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Velo

Push Fast TTK, Not Dropping Sprint

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If you guys have read cT's or Lemon's posts, you know that TTK is the real problem. Sprint only exacerbates this problem for Halo. My argument is simple: sprint is NOT going to be removed from Halo 5, not a chance, however, buffing the BR and DMR to reward players with perfect shots with a much lower TTK is possible. We have to push for this. There is no other possibility to improve the future of Halo. We will never get sprint removed and people are wasting time and energy pushing for it. However, we MIGHT be able to PUNISH players for making bad decisions by killing them Halo CE style, fast as hell. THAT is the argument we should all be pushing. 

 

 

Speed up kill times for perfect shots with the main utility weapon, that is the only true counter to sprint, nothing else. 

 

This is the argument that has to happen for the survival of this series.

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nope, both are equally important. sprint is still garbage even with faster kill times. faster kill times just makes sprint more bearable which isn't what we should aim for. 

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So we bandaid sprint by making the ttk faster?

 

No thanks.

 

There's no other option though. Sprint isn't going to be removed so at least this would be an improvement. I get what you're saying though.

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nope, both are equally important. sprint is still garbage even with faster kill times. faster kill times just makes sprint more bearable which isn't what we should aim for. 

 

I know what you're saying but we both know that sprint isn't going to be removed so I'm just suggesting a more realistic argument. Buffing the strength of a weapon is something 343i has done in the past and might do again. 

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Faster, more difficult kills are always welcome.

Although sprint still really needs to get the boot.

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So go full CoD?

 

I used to think fast TTK meant COD. I learned after reading cT's post that it doesn't. There's a crucial difference, faster average kill time is not changed. Faster perfect shot kill time is improved. So in Halo 1, the average kill time was NOT faster than later Halos, kill times for perfect shots was much faster though. It was a reward for better shots. That's the big payoff. 

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I used to think fast TTK meant COD. I learned after reading cT's post that it doesn't. There's a crucial difference, faster average kill time is not changed. Faster perfect shot kill time is improved. So in Halo 1, the average kill time was NOT faster than later Halos, kill times for perfect shots was much faster though. It was a reward for better shots. That's the big payoff. 

I know, but developers will never do that nowadays. They want to make it as easy as possible, so if they do a CE-like kill time, they'd just make it too easy to get a perfect kill so people aren't whining about getting destroyed.

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Have you not seen the TTK on the ar, smg etc?

 

No, halo needs to stay to it's roots. The day Halo becomes a twitch shooter, is the day Halo dies.

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Have you not seen the TTK on the ar, smg etc?

 

No, halo needs to stay to it's roots. The day Halo becomes a twitch shooter, is the day Halo dies.

 

Halo died a long time ago

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Yeah sorry, OP, but by doing this it just shows 343 that were are okay with sprint. I'd rather just not purchase their game and move on.

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Faster kill time = why the fuck bother having spartan armor if it does nothing, just play COD

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Have you not seen the TTK on the ar, smg etc?

 

No, halo needs to stay to it's roots. The day Halo becomes a twitch shooter, is the day Halo dies.

There's nothing wrong with the AR and SMG's killtimes. The other weapons should try to match that.

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There's nothing wrong with the AR and SMG's killtimes. The other weapons should try to match that.

 

There is plenty wrong with the AR and SMG's killtimes. You are able to essentially instantly kill someone with negleglible skill involved. This is a direct result from giving players countless options to run away from a fight and why Halo 5 is already a  twitch shooter to me. If you catch someone off guard you can kill them before they can react every time because the automatics don't have any noticeable skill gap.

On the other hand if you get in a 1v1 with anyone it is now aggravatingly hard to finish the kill because they can thrust sprint slide hover away or just wait for you to peek out and instantly melt you with their smg if they get first shot.

 

It's not about having fast killtimes its about having hard fast perfect killtimes and a large gap to average killtimes, and not easy fast average/perfect killtimes when caught off guard and hard slow average/perfect kill times when in a 1v1.

 

I'm not against automatics in general but CE and even H4 and H2A do them so much better than H5 does.

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There is plenty wrong with the AR and SMG's killtimes. You are able to essentially instantly kill someone with negleglible skill involved. This is a direct result from giving players countless options to run away from a fight and why Halo 5 is already a  twitch shooter to me. If you catch someone off guard you can kill them before they can react every time because the automatics don't have any noticeable skill gap.

On the other hand if you get in a 1v1 with anyone it is now aggravatingly hard to finish the kill because they can thrust sprint slide hover away or just wait for you to peek out and instantly melt you with their smg if they get first shot.

 

It's not about having fast killtimes its about having hard fast perfect killtimes and a large gap to average killtimes, and not easy fast average/perfect killtimes when caught off guard and hard slow average/perfect kill times when in a 1v1.

 

I'm not against automatics in general but CE and even H4 and H2A do them so much better than H5 does.

As pickups, they'll work fine. Pickups don't need to take skill, but making the autos a bit harder to aim would be a welcomed change.

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As pickups, they'll work fine. Pickups don't need to take skill, but making the autos a bit harder to aim would be a welcomed change.

 

Why dont they need to take skill? I've heard other people saying this too and it does not make any sense to me. What could possibly be the downside of making every weapon have a significant skill gap? I think people have just gotten used to weapons like rockets shotgun and automatics not being skill based that they don't even consider it.

 

Edit: To clarify, the grenade launcher from reach was exactly what I mean. If you gave it someone who had no idea how to use it they would have been better off with just a dmr, but a player that knew how maximize damage by bouncing and perfecting the timing was almost as lethal as if he had had rockets.

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Player speed got slower and jump height got lower from H3 to H4 lol. Is it because he's getting old that MC can only run fast one in a while?

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Best counter to sprint in halo 5: not buying the game.

 

And how is this going to help the game?  "I don't like it"... and dev moves on to waypoint user to ask about their thoughts on sprint.... C'mon guys, the forums has voiced their opinions on sprint only to have the developers continue to defend it.  Almost every other community wants it/doesn't care to explore its consequences too (reddit/waypoint).  Clearly it has shaped H5's map design, is required for several of the spartan abilities (ie, shoulder charge & slide), and is a major fundamental design in where 343 is taking this game.  You may not buy this game, but the masses will and sprint will remain.  Go ahead and enjoy your other games.

 

Also, argue that the TTK of automatics do not need to be buffed, I agree in that they are powerful so far.  But automatics don't have a history with Halo, precision weapons and sound shooting do.  When a BR/DMR/pistol cannot take down an auto when both players have an equal opportunity then there is rebalancing needed.  

 

Buff BR/DMR/pistol to have a faster TTK than autos.  I'd like to see pistol at 4 shot (with fast rate of fire) and AR/BR at 3 shot.  With the low aim assist in H5 so far this will not make all encounters 3 shots and done.  Have you played H1?  Are you 3 shotting all day?  Reward those players with good shots with a dead opponent so that they can move on to the next guy without having to call out where he's sprinting too.  Take out the player before he/she can even get up to full speed sprinting and we don't have a problem.  Yes sprint still breaks a number of issues with game flow, but with faster TTK at least some control goes back to the attacking player.

 

Maybe a good way to show this is compare actual match times across all Halo games.  Start tracking team slayer match times in H1/H2/H3 and compare them against what we see in H5.

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A more powerful magnum (4-shot, .8 kill time) would alleviate part of the "Get out of Jail, Free" problem of sprint, at higher skill levels. But sprint still makes the maps bigger, and lets people get away at lower skill levels.

 

If AR is going to be kept as a loadout weapon w/ Magnum, its aim assist needs to be decreased along with the removal of the headshot multiplier. On-map weapons should fill a niche or preference. SMG for CQC, DMR for long range, BR as an alternative to Pistol. BR should be 1.2 second kill time with current AA levels. 

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Lot of people in this thread that don't really understand where Halo's problems stem from. It's not TTK on the assault rifle and smg, it's TTK times decrease for perfect shots for the main utility weapon that makes all the difference.

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