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chaosTheory

Dedicated website for tracking Halo CE gameplay issues in MCC

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Hosting feels a bit more like OG now, which makes me prefer hosting since it's more challenging. Although aiming might be too easy for my opponents, it feels very good when I outpistol someone because I know that I deserved to win the duel. I agree with ThreeShotPistol when he says it's ok if they leave host this way as soon as they make aiming off host as hard as on host.

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Anyone else getting a lot of lag since the patch? Nearly every game has a good amount for me. Was not like this prior to patch.

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Anyone else getting a lot of lag since the patch? Nearly every game has a good amount for me. Was not like this prior to patch.

I wouldn't say more lag, just different kind of lag lol. Like before the patch I died through portals waaaay more than post patch. But now off host, reloading is sluggish, ghost rockets and ghost nades are common, and people stutter when they move much more often now.

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I wasn't talking about mcc. obviously they have changed the netcode around a lot and done some weird things.

 

The way you worded it earlier made it sound to me like you're saying it's a staple of the series that the actual aim assist values are changed between hosting or not.

 

If you just meant mcc and the later installations of halo then never mind, I don't know much about them.

 

To clarify, I would just be surprised if in an era preceding online console shooters (og h1), the devs could forsee any kind of latency issues, and in turn code anything to mitigate them.

It's a thing in H3 and onward.

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Any thoughts on this?

The last shot hits where I was aiming 4 frames before, which could just be a coincidence. We were strafing opposite directions, which would obviously explain this if it was on OG, but I don't believe self-movement makes a difference on MCC.

 

Edit: Some more from the same game (hits that don't look like they should hit).

 

I also grabbed all the shots from that game and an offhost game with the same players (complete with teammate complaining) - Onhost / Offhost

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I don't think you should be running tests against a guy from Venezuela. That said, I'm pretty sure movement is affecting where the bullet hits now on host just like in OG. You would see better proof of this by comparing on host/off host sniper. The amount you have to lead the sniper when strafing AGAINST your opponents movement ON HOST post patch is really really similar to OG. Off host is still childs play easy mode though. 

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I don't think you should be running tests against a guy from Venezuela. That said, I'm pretty sure movement is affecting where the bullet hits now on host just like in OG. You would see better proof of this by comparing on host/off host sniper. The amount you have to lead the sniper when strafing AGAINST your opponents movement ON HOST post patch is really really similar to OG. Off host is still childs play easy mode though. 

Pollo lives in FL.

 

also, bonesaw is too smart for this thread. ***** talking about game files and map codes and shit.

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Pollo lives in FL.

 

also, bonesaw is too smart for this thread. ***** talking about game files and map codes and shit.

and naker lives in?...... 

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I haven't read the entire thread, but does anyone else feel like their rate of fire with the pistol is slower on certain connections?  Am I really late to the party with this?

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That said, I'm pretty sure movement is affecting where the bullet hits now on host just like in OG.

 

Minto, both of those clips are the story of my life. 

 

If movement's affecting bullets on host now, those clips make sense. If that's true, they should definitely find a way to do the same thing offhost.

 

I'll have to host more and pay attention to that.

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I wouldn't mind if offhost was SLIGHTLY easier. There should be a tiny bit of compensation for lag.

 

As it currently stands, offhost has way too huge of an advantage.

 

Also, even with onhost, I feel like there is lag coming from the offhost Xbox. As I noted earlier, certain people feel impossible to hit consistently even as a host when they have shitty connections. So that may explain why bullets are hitting them when it looks like they shouldn't? I dunno.

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If movement's affecting bullets on host now, those clips make sense. If that's true, they should definitely find a way to do the same thing offhost.

 

I'll have to host more and pay attention to that.

Yes and I think I've come to the conclusion that on host right now is basically OG shooting. The sniper gives it away the most. This is fantastic, but combined with the easy mode off host shooting, it's creating a very biased favoritism towards the off host player. I hope they read this thread and I really really hope the next patch makes on and off host shooting as close to OG as possible, with movement of both players affecting the shot lead. That is where the shooting skill gap in H1 is most profound.

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Tonight was the first night I have hosted since people started saying its like og shooting. So I went in with the mind set of pretend its og and I shot really good, prob as good as I was off host. I haven't lanned og in about 2 months but shooting felt identical best I can tell. 343 please fix off host to feel the same way and the shooting part of this game is fixed. Shotgun and plasma riffle also feel completely fixed on host now. I can finally go back to loving co again now that my sniper shotty combo works.

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Tonight was the first night I have hosted since people started saying its like og shooting. So I went in with the mind set of pretend its og and I shot really good, prob as good as I was off host. I haven't lanned og in about 2 months but shooting felt identical best I can tell. 343 please fix off host to feel the same way and the shooting part of this game is fixed. Shotgun and plasma riffle also feel completely fixed on host now. I can finally go back to loving co again now that my sniper shotty combo works.

You are, literally, crazy.

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You are, literally, crazy.

Can you elaborate? Are you saying host shooting does not feel like og? If so whats different? Because as I said I havent lanned in over 2 months but best I can remember from years of lanning it feels basicly the same, if not it has to be pretty close.

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I'm afraid it's going to be very hard for 343 to make it harder to shoot off host since there is compensation. Hopr they will find a solution though.

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It's a challenge, but far from impossible. They are probably using a so-called "reverse time" netcode, where the client is generally trusted as long as the information sendt from the client is plausible in light of the game state X amount of ms ago. Given this, it should be possible to trust the client even more when it comes to position, direction and velocity of the planery shooting and the player being shot. Making the bullets behave like OG should then not be too much trouble, provided that the client is quite authoritative.

 

This could, however, lead to more instances of people being shot despite being around corners/through a port etc. It is all about tweaking and fiddling with these different settings to try and find a workable compromise. In my opinon, the end result should be that host and off-host are as equal as possible. Even if that would entail that host shooting is not 100% to OG. If equalness cannot technically be achieved, I would prefer that host has the advantage, since this will simplfy deciding hosts in online tournaments (I can elaborate this point if it is not obvious).

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It wouldn't make sense to implement a really cool change like this if they only planned to do it for the hosting player. If I had to guess, they ran into problems with the offhost version that couldn't be fixed before the patch deadline. For instance, it may have performed well on smooth hosts, but performed terribly on unstable hosts.

 

Just some speculation - maybe giving myself some hope for the next patch.

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I'm going to go with the glass wallers opinion here. Since we both actually tested it in customs, not just played easy mode match making, the shooting on host is behaving like OG. Your own momentum changes how much you need to lead at all ranges. 

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I'm going to go with the glass wallers opinion here. Since we both actually tested it in customs, not just played easy mode match making, the shooting on host is behaving like OG. Your own momentum changes how much you need to lead at all ranges. 

Did you also test jumping/falling/ramp-running shots? Those felt different from OG for me, but I haven't taken the time to actually test it.

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It wouldn't make sense to implement a really cool change like this if they only planned to do it for the hosting player. If I had to guess, they ran into problems with the offhost version that couldn't be fixed before the patch deadline. For instance, it may have performed well on smooth hosts, but performed terribly on unstable hosts.

 

Just some speculation - maybe giving myself some hope for the next patch.

This was my thought as well, because it wouldn't make much sense (even for 343i) to make shooting so different between onhost and offhost. Hopefully the next CU will make offhost shooting just like the way onhost shooting works, because it really does feel like you are playing a different game depending on whether you are host or not.

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Did you also test jumping/falling/ramp-running shots? Those felt different from OG for me, but I haven't taken the time to actually test it.

I dont think shot lead while jumping/falling will ever be the same, since once your character leaves the ground the 180 glitch comes into play. Which of course it doesn't in MCC because 180 glitch is patched. 

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Can someone help me with on-host shooting? I've been playing Halo since 2002, but I'm awful now.  :wutface: I was never good at OG CE and never played it at a competitive level, and it's showing now. I'm always stuck with hosting customs, and I hate being at a disadvantage to everyone else. Missing by millimeters is annoying as hell and I don't even know what I'm doing wrong. :salt: I always enjoy a challenge, but not when it's due to an uneven playing field. I'd be ok with it if everyone shot the same.

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