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CyReN

Halo Championship Series Season 1 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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I tried this and everytime i got pros in games with forgers the forger wouldn't listen and had that idea that nothing was wrong with their map and that the pro was wrong.

Examples?

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Ryan wants the game to take the most skill. BUT HE WANTS THE DEVELOPER TO MAKE IT THAT WAY AND NOT SEPARATE THE COMPETITIVE COMMUNITY FROM THE HALO COMMUNITY AGAIN.

However you want to word it, you do agree that Ryanoob won't opt out for settings and maps that yield the highest skill gap while someone like SAM will- even though he's never been a pro player.

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In halo reach and Halo 4 i worked with a lot of forgers and tried to bring pros into the mix on forge maps. I would bring maps to the attention of KC and Ponytar in reach. I can't think of a lot of forger names of the top of my head but the ones i worked with would remember.

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I tried this and everytime i got pros in games with forgers the forger wouldn't listen and had that idea that nothing was wrong with their map and that the pro was wrong.

 

What forgers? Just name them and avoid them?

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However you want to word it, you do agree that Ryanoob won't opt out for settings and maps that yield the highest skill gap while someone like SAM will- even though he's never been a pro player.

But how do you know if you aren't near the highest skill gap like Ryan?

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In halo reach and Halo 4 i worked with a lot of forgers and tried to bring pros into the mix on forge maps. I would bring maps to the attention of KC and Ponytar in reach. I can't think of a lot of forger names of the top of my head but the ones i worked with would remember.

Sigh

 

I asked for examples of complaints that got completely ignored

 

There must be one forger and one map and one problem that stands out in your head somewhere, because believe me, I remember tons from the other side

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But how do you know if you aren't near the highest skill gap like Ryan?

Because he thinks that halo 4 and reach had the best mechanics in the halo series. He also thinks all asymmetric maps are bad for competitive play, and that halo CE isn't as deep and complex as it is. This crap just isn't true.

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In halo reach and Halo 4 i worked with a lot of forgers and tried to bring pros into the mix on forge maps. I would bring maps to the attention of KC and Ponytar in reach. I can't think of a lot of forger names of the top of my head but the ones i worked with would remember.

Maybe because they wanted feedback from a pro player?

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However you want to word it, you do agree that Ryanoob won't opt out for settings and maps that yield the highest skill gap while someone like SAM will- even though he's never been a pro player.

 

I don't disagree with what people like you and sam want. I hope you understand that. You just have to realize that we've tried that in the past. MLG and Goldpro settings are too different from what out of box halo is that people can't follow what is going on.  Pro want NEW AND Complex maps. They just know that forge isn't interesting to viewers. We should just be playing H2C for a year and we wouldn't be having this conflict.

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I've played with good players in CE and kept up. (people who go to Ogre lans. I know this is arguable, but I don't think the game is complex as everyone thinks and if HCS was H1, give us 2-3 months and we'll be on par with the best CE players.)

 

 

LOL

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This whole argument has the makings of a great episode of Bomb Planted. I'll go get the popcorn.

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I don't disagree with what people like you and sam want. I hope you understand that.

Then don't say things like "Why isn't SAM a pro."

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Ryan wants the game to take a lot of skill. BUT HE WANTS THE DEVELOPER TO MAKE IT THAT WAY AND NOT SEPARATE THE COMPETITIVE COMMUNITY FROM THE HALO COMMUNITY AGAIN.

I don't think you understand the situation fully. We need two maps for the HCS settings, right. That means we'll need to use forge as I highly doubt DLC is happening for MCC. No matter what forge maps we decide to use, they won't be a part of the normal matchmaking where the normal halo community is. 

 

So, what is stopping us from using new, interesting forge maps over the same old, Midship styled maps? It's not like we're saying no to disc maps and wanting a bunch of forge maps like what happened in H3 and Reach. We literally only have THREE disc maps for H2A. 

 

 

 

In regards to your most recent post, no one's saying we should be using Gold Pro settings for HCS, or different settings from what 343 is using. We are simply saying that from a community and spectator point of view, forging two Midship style maps, for another Halo game in a row, is incredibly boring.

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I don't think you understand the situation fully. We need two maps for the HCS settings, right. That means we'll need to use forge as I highly doubt DLC is happening for MCC. No matter what forge maps we decide to use, they won't be a part of the normal matchmaking where the normal halo community is. 

 

So, what is stopping us from using new, interesting forge maps over the same old, Midship styled maps? It's not like we're saying no to disc maps and wanting a bunch of forge maps like what happened in H3 and Reach. We literally only have THREE disc maps for H2A. 

 

What's your gamertag. We can go over some maps you have in mind. and again I can show them to pros ask them to test them and we can see what happens. I'm all for trying man. 343 is who controls the settings. I just hope we can do something to get 2 maps picked up.

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And i don't think people want two midship style maps. They just want a small symmetrical 2 base. Make it different. I have an idea for one if you'd care to look at it.

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Why do maps/settings need the pro seal of approval?

 

Riot doesn't consult pros before making updates to leage.

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What's your gamertag. We can go over some maps you have in mind. and again I can show them to pros ask them to test them and we can see what happens. I'm all for trying man. 343 is who controls the settings. I just hope we can do something to get 2 maps picked up.

 

And i don't think people want two midship style maps. They just want a small symmetrical 2 base. Make it different. I have an idea for one if you'd care to look at it.

What's the name of the map you're thinking of? It'd be nice to see some gameplay on it. I doubt pros will want to start testing at this point in time due to IG being close. 

I personally don't have any specific maps in mind that could be used for HCS, I just feel very strongly against the use of basic designs like Midship in yet another Halo. Maybe go look around the Forge section or browse Forgehub.

 

Maybe @@WaiHo or another forger who reads this could point you into the right direction.

 

Anywho, thanks for being a bit more open. It'd be nice to see pros test some new Forge maps when the time comes, but I fear they'll just push them aside straight away and opt for one of Salot's remakes which is why I think community involvement should hold weight and not just what the pros want.

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Am I wrong? It doesn't take a genius to know that you should be setting up on one of the towers (P3 Middy, either side Onslaught/Amp, Purp Simplex etc) or both towers if you have total map control and pushing when you get 3/4 down. The designs are so basic, would it not be refreshing to play a map where you have to develop new strats with your team which could give you an edge over opponents in tournament play.

 

 

 

 

 

Are you talking about the H2A maps as well? I was focusing on the game we are playing right now (especially Shrine and Warlord). If you aren't, then I'm mistaken.

 

 

How has the meta changed from Halo 2 Midship, to Halo 3 Heretic, to H4 Simplex? What deep thought processes go on in those games? I can explain my decision making process of 2v2 CE, 4v4 Shadowrun, or 6v6 Monday Night Combat, but probably not in a very easy to understand way through text.. I can explain the meta of Halo 3 and beyond as simply a linear team-shooting numbers game.

 

Come on, even on maps that similar the meta has changed because of different spawn systems, different difficulty of shooting, range of shooting, player movement speed and communication evolving throughout the years. I don't know what to say if you don't think there are difficult decisions to make in any given game at the top level. What am I supposed to say here? That I can explain my decision making process of 4v4 H2, 4v4 H3, 4v4 Reach and 4v4 H4, but probably not in a very easy to understand way through text? Meh, IMO a lot of people are over-analyzing this just for the sake of debate lol. Every time I come onto this forum it's a debate similar to this with the same things being said, but without any depth. Sorry if I come off as rude.

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What's your gamertag. We can go over some maps you have in mind. and again I can show them to pros ask them to test them and we can see what happens. I'm all for trying man. 343 is who controls the settings. I just hope we can do something to get 2 maps picked up.

 

If you want to show them something: http://www.forgehub.com/SecretSchnitzel/maps/Orion%20H2A

This is Orion forged by SecretSchnitzel. It is really good for KotH and should be tested. Also it is not something completely new since it is a better version of Halo 3s Construct.

 

Maybe timers need to be changed back to dynamic since the HCS settings still have dynamic timers (which isn't good imo)

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Are you talking about the H2A maps as well? I was focusing on the game we are playing right now (especially Shrine and Warlord). If you aren't, then I'm mistaken.

No, I was always referring to the fact people wanted Midship style maps for the HCS settings and I was commenting on the previous maps such as Middy, Onslaught, Amplified, Simplex and Onyx. 

 

I have no problem with Lockout, Sanc and Warlock, they are good maps, although Lockout desperately needs Ball instead of TS/KoTH.

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Why do maps/settings need the pro seal of approval?

 

Riot doesn't consult pros before making updates to leage.

 

From what I understand (which is quite a bit) the goal of the HCS is to provide an experience that can be played from the highest competitive level all the way down to the casual player.

 

What that means is that any maps that will be considered for HCS would probably go into the regular rotation of the H2A playlist for example. Top players and the community will probably play a big part in that but the decision is ultimately 343's to make.

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