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If you could change one thing in Halo: CE, what would you?

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I have so much to say about this subject that it's exhausting to even think about.
 
@@xxcloud7xx Halo PC is undeniably more accessible (unfortunately - see my next point) than the superior, OG version. Almost anyone can run it on their PC and jump into a game without issue. On the other hand, if you want to play the OG version, you need to buy an OG box and find a group of people within a reasonable distance to play with. The truth is, the high-level metagame is lost on most PC players, as is evidenced by the horrid gametypes that are plaguing the game's hundreds of dedicated servers. Since none of the high-level Xbox players moved to Halo PC, the PC community developed their own metagame and gametypes. The blame goes entirely to the company that botched the port: Gearbox.
 
@@Qbit While I appreciate you sticking up for Halo PC (because I've been playing it since launch and I agree it needs some love), I must disagree about some of the things you're saying. About fall stun: many ledges' heights are specifically set so that you need to crouch-land to absorb the fall damage (see: top blue on hangem, light/dark snipe on BC, etc). This is undoubtedly intentional, and if you open the map geometry in 3ds max you can see a lot of the same heights in different maps, suggesting that Bungie used the same guidelines across all the maps.
 
The following basic principle can be applied to nearly every aspect of the game, and I fully expect that some may disagree with my opinion:
 
Bungie's design philosophies during the making of Halo CE should be held as sacred.
 
You may have seen Hardy Lebel's AMA's where he discusses the fact that many subtleties are indeed intentional, from the player spawning system to the weapon spawning system to the way the maps are designed, among many other things. If you haven't listened to them, you should definitely check them out (http://teambeyond.net/forum/topic/8945-free-level-design-webinar-with-hardy-lebel/).
 
The fact that weapon timing isn't nearly as predictable in the PC version has a grave impact on the metagame. The fact that it is easier to aim with a mouse (this IS a fact - don't let naysayers tell you that controller offers the same level of precision) changes the TTK and therefore the pacing of the gameplay itself.
 
As far as your mod goes: I don't doubt that you have succeeded in adapting the gameplay to the PC control scheme (kb/m). I'd actually be interested in trying it out (not kidding, link pls). But can you say you fixed the netcode? What about the server-side weapon timing? There are fundamental flaws in the game that effectively stopped the competitive console community from picking the PC version up back when it was still relevant.
 
Again: please don't misunderstand me. I still play Custom Edition (I even host a server so I can play actual good maps and gametypes as opposed to the drivel that's hosted on 99% of the other active dedicated servers) and for the most part I thoroughly enjoy myself.
 
But there's nothing like lanning 2v2 on an OG box. MCC comes close (closer than many would like to admit, I think), but the original version of the game just feels perfect.
 
Call me nostalgic. Call me a purist. 
 
But don't say that CE players need:
 

[freedom] to traverse the map as they see fit during an engagement, rather than being forced to conform to map geometry. It's as simple as that really. The result is smoother gameplay during a firefight, because you don't need to worry about being a sitting duck for nearly a whole second after jumping off something.

 

You might as well be arguing for sprint and clamber. They both offer more freedom of movement and less conformity to map geometry. This will also reduce the skillgap that sets CE apart from its sequels. If you want to argue about skillgap and accessibility, I'll let someone else tackle that one with you, as the argument has been run to the ground countless times on this board.

 

TL;DR: the reality is that the game was designed to play on console and therefore suffers fundamental problems on PC. Your mod and suggestions may well suit the PC version, but this isn't the thread (or forum, really) to discuss the inferior PC version of the game, since it was never (and never will be) adopted by the competitive community that makes up the vast majority of Team Beyond's user base.

 

 

 

 

MCC could really use a goddamn server list, though. Not to mention custom maps, dedis for custom games, etc, etc - the list goes on.

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Boarding vehicles. Campaign and Multiplayer.

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Honestly all the game really needs is an in game clock and the H5 icons that show when weapons spawn. At a certain level everyone is using a timer anyways so might as well add it into the game. (inb4 this ruins the skill gap)

 

I'd use the H4 spawn system for FFA, 4v4 and BTB, but I know that's a touchy subject. IMO the CE spawn system is thrash outside of 2v2s.

 

And I'd also reduce the jump delay and add some more fluid animations, especially the 3rd person nade throw while walking looks dumb as hell.

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Honestly all the game really needs is an in game clock and the H5 icons that show when weapons spawn. At a certain level everyone is using a timer anyways so might as well add it into the game. (inb4 this ruins the skill gap)

 

This tbh

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About fall stun: many ledges' heights are specifically set so that you need to crouch-land to absorb the fall damage (see: top blue on hangem, light/dark snipe on BC, etc). This is undoubtedly intentional, and if you open the map geometry in 3ds max you can see a lot of the same heights in different maps, suggesting that Bungie used the same guidelines across all the maps.

 
The following basic principle can be applied to nearly every aspect of the game, and I fully expect that some may disagree with my opinion:
 
Bungie's design philosophies during the making of Halo CE should be held as sacred.

 

I know those heights were intentional, I just don't really agree with the intention itself. In any case, I wouldn't remove it without a trace, I'd have fall stun available as an option so that the original CE mechanics could be faithfully reproduced if desired. I wouldn't miss it, but hey, apparently many would.

 

95% of Bungie's decisions in CE were very good and I stand by them, but they weren't infallible. It's almost unanimously agreed that jump delay is a negative and should be removed if given the chance. Examples like those prove that Halo CE does have room for improvement, even in some pretty important areas. That said, I do regard the Xbox version as "sacred" as you put it, and agree that nothing about it should be changed because part of what makes LANing with CE so timeless is it's authenticity and familiarity. Here I talk strictly about an idealized version of Halo: CE for the PC.

 

You might as well be arguing for sprint and clamber. They both offer more freedom of movement and less conformity to map geometry. This will also reduce the skillgap that sets CE apart from its sequels. If you want to argue about skillgap and accessibility, I'll let someone else tackle that one with you, as the argument has been run to the ground countless times on this board.

 

Adding sprint and clamber profoundly changes map design itself and not only that but also affects virtually all other aspects of the game as well. Removing fall stun does not, so it's a pretty awful comparison. Removal of stun allows you to introduce more freedom of movement without buggering up the entire game. That's the obvious difference there.

 

The fact that it is easier to aim with a mouse (this IS a fact - don't let naysayers tell you that controller offers the same level of precision) changes the TTK and therefore the pacing of the gameplay itself.

 

While aiming is definitely enhanced with a mouse, it's also much easier and faster to strafe using a keyboard than a thumbstick, especially with an increased movement acceleration (which is why the PC version needs that), so those two basically cancel out.

 
As far as your mod goes: I don't doubt that you have succeeded in adapting the gameplay to the PC control scheme (kb/m). I'd actually be interested in trying it out (not kidding, link pls). But can you say you fixed the netcode? What about the server-side weapon timing? The fact that weapon timing isn't nearly as predictable in the PC version has a grave impact on the metagame.There are fundamental flaws in the game that effectively stopped the competitive console community from picking the PC version up back when it was still relevant.

 

I haven't uploaded the mod anywhere yet, and I'm still doing a few tweaks to it, but when I do (after uni finals next week) I'll send you a PM. I'm well aware of the unfortunate back-end problems with the game which revolve around the shitty net code and it's on my to-do list to find out if something can be done to address it. I really want Halo to be able to flourish on PC because we're probably never getting a good one for a console again and being at the mercy of a modern dev is never a good thing.

 
TL;DR: the reality is that the game was designed to play on console and therefore suffers fundamental problems on PC. Your mod and suggestions may well suit the PC version, but this isn't the thread (or forum, really) to discuss the inferior PC version of the game, since it was never (and never will be) adopted by the competitive community that makes up the vast majority of Team Beyond's user base.

 

Call me delusional, but I actually believe that if a legitimate promod was made for Halo on the PC and the netcode was fixed, it probably would be warmly accepted by the competitive community.

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Only way the pro xbox community would play it is if you can hook your controller up and have bullet magnetism/w slight aim assist like on the xbox. A very low percent will want to relearn how to play a game they have been playing for 15 years on a mouse and keyboard. However right before mcc came out I played halo pc custom edition with a controller using a keyboard/mouse mapping program running in the background. That along with the combination of turning on player_magnetism 1 and playing on the no lead modded servers felt pretty damn good. It felt much better then halo pc ever felt to me the numerous times I have downloaded it and tried it the past 12 years.

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I completely agree with the person that said the halo pc elitist view is rockets and power up timing is newb. In fact all of the pro labeled servers I joined had rockets and power ups disabled where you cant even pick them up standing on them........

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I don't know if this mechanic has a name, but Plasma Slowdown, I guess? When your movement stutters/slows down while being shot at with a Plasma Rifle or Pistol. Both weapons are already useful enough without it, and it just feels so clunky.

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I don't know if this mechanic has a name, but Plasma Slowdown, I guess? When your movement stutters/slows down while being shot at with a Plasma Rifle or Pistol. Both weapons are already useful enough without it, and it just feels so clunky.

 

Did you mean increase the range and power of the slowdown?

 

From least to greatest: timer in the HUD h2/3 style in game stats, kill limit increase, and better system link.

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I don't know if this mechanic has a name, but Plasma Slowdown, I guess? When your movement stutters/slows down while being shot at with a Plasma Rifle or Pistol. Both weapons are already useful enough without it, and it just feels so clunky.

Absolutely not.  This idea is shit.

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Why, though?

Without it the plasma weapons don't really serve a purpose. In CE you could actually use them in lethal ways to melt an OS guy or in CQC stun lock someone. The weapon was niche but it had a damn good use if you knew what to do with it. After CE the plasma rifle was dog shit. Even to the point where it isn't even in Halo games.

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Without it the plasma weapons don't really serve a purpose. In CE you could actually use them in lethal ways to melt an OS guy or in CQC stun lock someone. The weapon was niche but it had a damn good use if you knew what to do with it. After CE the plasma rifle was dog shit. Even to the point where it isn't even in Halo games.

I had always thought that it did enough to shields for it to still be effective? I also thought the PR was pretty decent-good in Reach. 

At any rate, if slowdown had to stay on the Plasma Rifle, I'd want it at least taken off of the Plasma Pistol. Cause as it stands, they're basically the same weapon with slightly different functionality.(One's full-auto, one has the charge). Not that it ever was in CE, but might as well make the sandbox less redundant.

 

It's been a while, but that's of course assuming that both of the weapons have slowdown, right?

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Absolutely not.  This idea is shit.

 

Seriously, part of the reason MCC sucks is because the plasma rifle is ass and doesn't always work right for slowdown. It makes the gun unique and actually useful compared to the AR.

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I had always thought that it did enough to shields for it to still be effective? I also thought the PR was pretty decent-good in Reach. 

At any rate, if slowdown had to stay on the Plasma Rifle, I'd want it at least taken off of the Plasma Pistol. Cause as it stands, they're basically the same weapon with slightly different functionality.(One's full-auto, one has the charge). Not that it ever was in CE, but might as well make the sandbox less redundant.

 

It's been a while, but that's of course assuming that both of the weapons have slowdown, right?

 

You'll find the PP isn't used as much in MP because it overheats faster. I can't remember if the damage is any different. Also the PP differentiates with the overcharge.

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I had always thought that it did enough to shields for it to still be effective? I also thought the PR was pretty decent-good in Reach. 

At any rate, if slowdown had to stay on the Plasma Rifle, I'd want it at least taken off of the Plasma Pistol. Cause as it stands, they're basically the same weapon with slightly different functionality.(One's full-auto, one has the charge). Not that it ever was in CE, but might as well make the sandbox less redundant.

 

It's been a while, but that's of course assuming that both of the weapons have slowdown, right?

Sure, it did damage to shields but the ttk on it after the shields were gone was bad-which is intended. Not to mention it has a really slow/clunky melee. At best it was niche and having that feature made it viable to use in various situations. Flanking on Rat Race with it was always fun. 

 

The plasma pistol was hardly ever used. It's the 2nd worst gun in the game (multiplayer wise). I don't think people ever used it for full charge. The thing shot as fast as the AR if you could pull it off fast enough. They had completely different functionality based on the player discretion. I can see where you're coming from with redundancy, but if anything they had their intended purposes. 

 

The PR was not in any map in Reach outside of Invasion or Customs. There were no maps that it was a pick up weapon created by Bungie. 

 

If anything I wish they brought the CE plasma rifle back instead of all the bastardized versions of it, especially post 3.

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Red X's, ingame clock, 25 kill limit for 2v2's.  

 

I'd start there, but there is much more.  Thrusters, PP tracking with charge depletion, Energy Sword with shield alt fire that drains its energy, maps that are suitable for 4v4's, the list goes on.

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Red X's, ingame clock, 25 kill limit for 2v2's.  

 

I'd start there, but there is much more.  Thrusters, PP tracking with charge depletion, Energy Sword with shield alt fire that drains its energy, maps that are suitable for 4v4's, the list goes on.

 

Do you have any appreciation for what halo 1 has to offer? Thrusters? seriously?

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add bloom.  :kappa:

So silly. Every online Reach kid has proven bloom IS in Halo CE! Remember the "CE has bloom" videos?  :kappa:

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I have so much to say about this subject that it's exhausting to even think about.
 
@@xxcloud7xx Halo PC is undeniably more accessible (unfortunately - see my next point) than the superior, OG version. Almost anyone can run it on their PC and jump into a game without issue. On the other hand, if you want to play the OG version, you need to buy an OG box and find a group of people within a reasonable distance to play with. The truth is, the high-level metagame is lost on most PC players, as is evidenced by the horrid gametypes that are plaguing the game's hundreds of dedicated servers. Since none of the high-level Xbox players moved to Halo PC, the PC community developed their own metagame and gametypes. The blame goes entirely to the company that botched the port: Gearbox.
 
@@Qbit While I appreciate you sticking up for Halo PC (because I've been playing it since launch and I agree it needs some love), I must disagree about some of the things you're saying. About fall stun: many ledges' heights are specifically set so that you need to crouch-land to absorb the fall damage (see: top blue on hangem, light/dark snipe on BC, etc). This is undoubtedly intentional, and if you open the map geometry in 3ds max you can see a lot of the same heights in different maps, suggesting that Bungie used the same guidelines across all the maps.
 
The following basic principle can be applied to nearly every aspect of the game, and I fully expect that some may disagree with my opinion:
 
Bungie's design philosophies during the making of Halo CE should be held as sacred.
 
You may have seen Hardy Lebel's AMA's where he discusses the fact that many subtleties are indeed intentional, from the player spawning system to the weapon spawning system to the way the maps are designed, among many other things. If you haven't listened to them, you should definitely check them out (http://teambeyond.net/forum/topic/8945-free-level-design-webinar-with-hardy-lebel/).
 
The fact that weapon timing isn't nearly as predictable in the PC version has a grave impact on the metagame. The fact that it is easier to aim with a mouse (this IS a fact - don't let naysayers tell you that controller offers the same level of precision) changes the TTK and therefore the pacing of the gameplay itself.
 
As far as your mod goes: I don't doubt that you have succeeded in adapting the gameplay to the PC control scheme (kb/m). I'd actually be interested in trying it out (not kidding, link pls). But can you say you fixed the netcode? What about the server-side weapon timing? There are fundamental flaws in the game that effectively stopped the competitive console community from picking the PC version up back when it was still relevant.
 
Again: please don't misunderstand me. I still play Custom Edition (I even host a server so I can play actual good maps and gametypes as opposed to the drivel that's hosted on 99% of the other active dedicated servers) and for the most part I thoroughly enjoy myself.
 
But there's nothing like lanning 2v2 on an OG box. MCC comes close (closer than many would like to admit, I think), but the original version of the game just feels perfect.
 
Call me nostalgic. Call me a purist. 
 
But don't say that CE players need:
 

 

You might as well be arguing for sprint and clamber. They both offer more freedom of movement and less conformity to map geometry. This will also reduce the skillgap that sets CE apart from its sequels. If you want to argue about skillgap and accessibility, I'll let someone else tackle that one with you, as the argument has been run to the ground countless times on this board.

 

TL;DR: the reality is that the game was designed to play on console and therefore suffers fundamental problems on PC. Your mod and suggestions may well suit the PC version, but this isn't the thread (or forum, really) to discuss the inferior PC version of the game, since it was never (and never will be) adopted by the competitive community that makes up the vast majority of Team Beyond's user base.

 

 

 

 

MCC could really use a goddamn server list, though. Not to mention custom maps, dedis for custom games, etc, etc - the list goes on.

 

 

Halo PC has a warp on chillout that is exposed on broken bridge.  Also fuel rod cannon and flame thrower?   I was that it was never created, then 343 could have simply ported over the correct game.

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Red X's, ingame clock, 25 kill limit for 2v2's.  

 

I'd start there, but there is much more.  Thrusters, PP tracking with charge depletion, Energy Sword with shield alt fire that drains its energy, maps that are suitable for 4v4's, the list goes on.

 

How old were you in 2001?

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It results in removing the skill that used to be required to succesfully fall from key locations and utilize map geometry and well timed crouches to avoid getting stuck like that.

 

Here's an example of what you lose when we you remove it:

 

  1. With stun: A bad player ports from red on damnation up to the catwalk with his fresh OS. I, standing on green plat, strafe like a maniac juking all his shots while hitting all of mine. As his health drops he knows  he must work to get away before he dies. So he drops to shotties. Because he is a BK he gets fall stunned and i can succesfully get an angle to finish him off.
  2. Without stun: The bad player enters the same situation, gets outshot then drops to shotties and can make it to red door despite getting completely outplayed because i dont have the window that i used to.

 

 

Hence the reason why 343 made halo 5 with thrusters.  They want the bk's to be able to get away when they make a mistake, so they enabled a quick get away option with the thruster.  This essentially makes the game last longer for bk's, and the longer they stay alive the more fun they have, which is the main objective of 343.

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Gonna bring up the age argument again?

 

Someone that has been playing halo CE since launch is going to understand it much better than someone who started with halo 3.   I don't see why h3 kids get's so insecure whenever it's brought up.  It's simple math.

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Someone that has been playing halo CE since launch is going to understand it much better than someone who started with halo 3.   I don't see why h3 kids get's so insecure whenever it's brought up.  It's simple math.

 

I wouldn't consider myself a Halo 3 kid. I didn't grow up with CE (at least not multiplayer, I got the game in 2002 and played the campaign countless times). It's just attacking someone by bringing up the age argument looks uncredible and will deter others from seeing what you have to really say. 

 

I disagree with Unknown completely. Bringing thrusters and whatever else he said to CE is the dumbest thing I've read on here. That doesn't make it ok to attack someone with an age argument. Just provide facts of why he is wrong.

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