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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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I couldn't feel the difference in the Plasma Caster fall-off (which is silly because the problem with the weapon was its buffed detonation time) but I could definitely feel the difference in the Sniper. 

 

Red reticle felt less sticky and I felt as though the aim assist radius was lowered as well (how close your reticle must be before turning red), but that could be placebo. It's definitely more challenging.

 

I played a couple games of octagon yesterday and no scoping is still not H3-hard, like i know a lot of people here want, but its not as easy either.  It "feels" more fair so far.  That may change as people adjust though....

 

summit tried it and said the aiming was still trash and had FPS drops (visibly on stream too) while he played.

 

:/

 

Dropping frames on his rig is criminal.  That engine needs some serious work...

 

I would imagine it will have a significant impact on the crouching with autos effectiveness as well. 18m felt too short with sprint but at the same time 25m standard radar is just far too much info for the player that it becomes a crutch.

 

I think this is by far the best compromise possible, personally I didn't think no radar would work with halo 5's movement system, which might not be the most popular opinion around these parts though.

 

I agree.

1) No radar can be... ridiculous.  Sometimes it feels so good, but other times it feels so bad.

2) I think an ability radar is the best choice for Halo 5. I am not saying that its acceptable.  No radar should work fine and the fact that we have to compromise like this is a symptom of a problem with the mechanics of the game. 

 

Changing the way radar works is like putting a band-aid over a bullet wound but its probably the best we are going to get for Halo 5.

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Man, Waypoint as a website is so frustrating to use. Their quoting function has to be the most miserable experience I've ever had.

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Man, Waypoint as a website is so frustrating to use. Their quoting function has to be the most miserable experience I've ever had.

On mobile i try to respond to a post, then I'm like 'fuck it'

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On mobile i try to respond to a post, then I'm like 'fuck it'

Exactly. You'd think that the official forum site for Halo 5 would be more optimized than a separate forum like this one.

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Kinda OT, but Quinn talking about "radar changes" got me thinking: What about a vision-based radar like CS:GO?

 

Here's why I like the idea: Casuals still get their radar, but it's not a complete crutch like the motion tracker we've always had. In high level games, top players call out constantly anyways so it will not give them free information (besides, calling out will always be more effective than a vision based radar).

 

Thoughts?

 

Just gonna repost this. I admire 343 trying to fix the radar , but the SA-only radar is imo just a bad compromise and won't please either crowd.

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Just gonna repost this. I admire 343 trying to fix the radar , but the SA-only radar is imo just a bad compromise and won't please either crowd.

Wait, but the radar would still only reveal players in your proximity. What would be the point?

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Wait, but the radar would still only reveal players in your proximity. What would be the point?

No point.  It would reveal players in your proximity in probably a 90 degree arc... that you are already looking at?  Unless im misunderstanding something and they want the radar range to be a lot longer and to communicate the radar between all the players?

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No point.  It would reveal players in your proximity in probably a 90 degree arc... that you are already looking at?  Unless im misunderstanding something and they want the radar range to be a lot longer and to communicate the radar between all the players?

 

*You and your teammates see. Plus they could make the radius larger of course.

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For the record, I'm thoroughly against the "Halo 5 is too chaotic for no radar" argument.

 

 

100% agreed. I made few posts on this. The limited games I played of No-radar customs were amazing. I never felt like things were too chaotic or random. I will say that the map design allows for so many routes in small confined areas compared to other Halo games, but that still shouldn't be an issue since it's a team game and it's often easy to rule out where people are just by identifying where they aren't.

 

I've used shadowrun in my examples many times. If I can play Shadowrun without a Radar then Halo does not need one. I can move way faster, further, higher up and literally through walls/floors/ceilings quicker than in Halo.

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:wutface: My face when someone takes Super Fiesta so seriously that they sent me shit talk messages lol.

 

I agree about the radar changes. Just turn it off in the playlists that traditionally haven't used radar in the past and let the casual playlists keep the original radar with the 25m range. It makes it less complicated and less people will be pissed off about it.

 

 

I also ran into Dersky a couple times in BTB last night where he was playing with a full party. Both games were a stomp fest in his favor and the second game everyone quit. I hope that showed him how bad the matching system is and he passed it along, but I seriously doubt it.

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I also ran into Dersky a couple times in BTB last night where he was playing with a full party. Both games were a stomp fest in his favor and the second game everyone quit. I hope that showed him how bad the matching system is and he passed it along, but I seriously doubt it.

Ha, to think that employees would be critical of their own games unless they were being trashed or handed the short end of the stick.

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I'm so tired of this "lets make these settings for social and these settings for ranked" bs. It's all bs. Every single bit of it. All of it. Halo needs to have one standard of settings. This dual standard stuff that we've been seeing since Halo 3 needs to end for good.

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I'm so tired of this "lets make these settings for social and these settings for ranked" bs. It's all bs. Every single bit of it. All of it. Halo needs to have one standard of settings. This dual standard stuff that we've been seeing since Halo 3 needs to end for good.

You trolling?
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You trolling?

 

No. Never have. The split that we've been seeing since Halo 2 (we can thank H2 SMG spawns for that one) has only grown significantly larger because Bungie and 343 have decided to make different core settings for social and ranked, farther splitting the competitive and casual (majority) community. This has got to stop.

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:wutface: My face when someone takes Super Fiesta so seriously that they sent me shit talk messages lol.

That's pretty much the face I'm making when I log in after playing drunk from 2am to 7am and check my messages lmao. I don't even understand how people can take things so seriously sometimes.

 

 

No. Never have. The split that we've been seeing since Halo 2 (we can thank H2 SMG spawns for that one) has only grown significantly larger because Bungie and 343 have decided to make different core settings for social and ranked, farther splitting the competitive and casual (majority) community. This has got to stop.

 It really doesn't need to stop. People have been playing Halo for literally its entire existence with wildly differing tastes and game modes. I'm talking going all the way back before anyone but bungie played the game and they played rocket/shotgun CTF on Wizard. The same guys that thought spawning with a plasma pistol was a good idea in some game modes and the rest of us that decided we didn't want a radar and should spawn pistol/AR instead. The problem is when the games are so poor that we don't have a population worth mentioning and certain portions of the overall Halo community become so small that a playlist dedicated to them doesn't draw enough attention to justify its existence.

 

I would go as far as saying that variety in settings and game modes is one of the most core aspects of Halo's identity as far as multiplayer goes and its also one of the first pieces to fall into disrepair and neglect when the games themselves are simply poor experiences and/or we get shit tier playlist management.

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That's pretty much the face I'm making when I log in after playing drunk from 2am to 7am and check my messages lmao. I don't even understand how people can take things so seriously sometimes.

 

 

 It really doesn't need to stop. People have been playing Halo for literally its entire existence with wildly differing tastes and game modes. I'm talking going all the way back before anyone but bungie played the game and they played rocket/shotgun CTF on Wizard. The same guys that thought spawning with a plasma pistol was a good idea in some game modes and the rest of us that decided we didn't want a radar and should spawn pistol/AR instead. The problem is when the games are so poor that we don't have a population worth mentioning and certain portions of the overall Halo community become so small that a playlist dedicated to them doesn't draw enough attention to justify its existence.

 

I would go as far as saying that variety in settings and game modes is one of the most core aspects of Halo's identity as far as multiplayer goes and its also one of the first pieces to fall into disrepair and neglect when the games themselves are simply poor experiences.

 

You're bringing up an "action sack" type of settings though. What I'm talking about are core settings for the default Team Slayer playlists and the "MLG/Pro/Competitive" playlists. These two playlists being different are more demoralizing to Halo than anything else. It creates an unhealthy split. Fun little game modes are fine but Bungie and 343 need to stop acting like their idea of competitive needs to compete with the fan's idea of competitive. The compromise needs to be almost instant and not literally years after the game's release. It really is astonishing how 343 has treated the competitive side of Halo 5 while placing the emphases on Warzone/REQ's. No matter what, it's too late for competitive Halo 5. Doesn't get talked about outside of these communities and 343. And no, Microsoft throwing a bunch of money at each tournament doesn't count as "great support from 343". Not any chance in hell.

 

To 343, good the fuck luck on the Halo 6 pro scene because in all honesty, with literally millions of dollars thrown at the H5 tournaments, it's embarrassing how little of reverence that it became. I said this after Halo 4 and I know that it needs to be said again. The Halo competitive scene will not become large until 343 swallows their pride and makes the changes needed asap and not a year after when everyone already left. I'm sure they'll be excuses for H6 like "it's 343 first game on the Scorpio" and crap like that. Whatever. Excuses doesn't help population and relevance, places where Halo 5 is lacking tremendously in. This series has been dying a slow death since 2010 and if there's one thing I can promise you is that the defense force of the decision making since then has done absolutely nothing to help it.

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I'd agree that as far as running competitive settings the game needs to compromise heavily in favor of... actual competitive settings at the very least. Its like they believe fun and competitive are mutually exclusive. 

 

Also on another subject why do the servers absolutely blow now? I swear I've had more laggy games in the last 3 days than I've had in the entirety of H5. Like actual bullet eating and teleporting lag that I almost never see.

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Tbf people have been playing halo, with radar, for over 15 years... and they like it. And they don't want to see it go. There's nothing wrong with that. These radar lover are the franchises core fans.

The problem is simple- improper playlist management.

They need to go back to having 1 playlist with competitive settings (team Arena, team hardcore, mlg),1 ranked Slayer playlist with normal settings, and 1 ranked objective playlist with normal settings. With this setup no one would have to feel so defensive.

Right now Team Arena is the only way to play ranked objective and people are afraid they won't be able to play the game they like... even if they aren't able to articulate their position well.

Everyone here keeps shitting on waypoint and Reddit when they aren't the problem. the real problem is 343s refusal to accommodate the various subgroups within the community.

I'm not laughing at them because they like radar. I'm laughing at their blatant, and painfully obvious self imposed ignorance while they simultaneously act they understand fuck all about radar's effect on gameplay.

 

I also agree with having separate properly made, competitive settings, but I also strongly agree with @@EagleBurn that we need to stop compromising with those people when it comes to how default Halo plays. We shouldn't have to have separate settings at all. Waypoint and r/halo are very much in fact, a MASSIVE part of the problem.

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my Reddit WTF of the day.

"Yes, 343 shouldn't get credit for the anniversary graphics, and they also shouldn't get blamed for the MCC mess. You can't choose one or the other. They don't make the side games."

 

I can see where he's trying to come from. But no, they were in charge of that game, so they get the blame for the fact THAT THEY OKAYED IT

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my Reddit WTF of the day.

"Yes, 343 shouldn't get credit for the anniversary graphics, and they also shouldn't get blamed for the MCC mess. You can't choose one or the other. They don't make the side games."

 

I can see where he's trying to come from. But no, they were in charge of that game, so they get the blame for the fact THAT THEY OKAYED IT

They're more than happy to blame everybody except 343 for MCC, but they'll be the first to praise 343 for Halo Wars 2, which they barely touched lol
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No. Never have. The split that we've been seeing since Halo 2 (we can thank H2 SMG spawns for that one) has only grown significantly larger because Bungie and 343 have decided to make different core settings for social and ranked, farther splitting the competitive and casual (majority) community. This has got to stop.

Why force people together who don't want to be together... who literally play the game differently and for different reasons.

 

It just turns both groups off as neither get what they want.

 

I'm not laughing at them because they like radar. I'm laughing at their blatant, and painfully obvious self imposed ignorance while they simultaneously act they understand fuck all about radar's effect on gameplay.

 

I also agree with having separate properly made, competitive settings, but I also strongly agree with @@EagleBurn that we need to stop compromising with those people when it comes to how default Halo plays. We shouldn't have to have separate settings at all. Waypoint and r/halo are very much in fact, a MASSIVE part of the problem.

A part of what problem? You think H5 didn't sell as well as previous entries because the default settings aren't competitive enough? No that's because the story blew, and the MP content was barebones at launch.

 

So what if a casual can't articulate why they like radar. If they like the shit they like the shit. They bought the game, they should be able to play how they want.

 

If Halo was geared exclusively towards the competitive crowd, it would sell like hot dog shit. They waypoint-r/halo-casual crowd dwarf the competitive crowd. The size and spending power of the casual crowd is the only reason the franchise ever had enough penetration to even have a competitive scene.

 

Abandoning the experience they want in favor of what is inarguably a niche community is suicide. It would be a terrible business decision. It's not even worth considering.

 

The only reason we have to "compromise" is because someone thinks settings need to be unified. It's impossible to unify settings without someone having to compromise. Your looking at it from your perspective only: both sides have had to compromise their values due to this approach.

 

There was no compromise in H3 when there was an MLG playlist, a Team Objective Playlist, and a Team Slayer playlist. Everyone got exactly what they wanted, and neither part of the community has ever been happier. If H5 had that split since launch the population would have faired so much better.

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