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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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LoL does have ranked 3v3 as well, it just isn't nearly as impressive as your 5v5 rank.

 

I do agree with your point in limited the ranked playlists, however in a game that has as much variety as Halo there's really no need to limit this to a SINGLE playlist. The reason CS and LoL limit it so much is because the game simply isn't competitive in other formats.

 

2-3 would be fine. Perhaps 2v2, 4v4 and 8v8 or FFA or something. (I do question how popular a ranked BTB playlist would be, I have a feeling a few people in this thread are vastly over estimating the player base that actually takes BTB seriously).

 

That's what I think as well.

 

1x ranked 4v4 playlist (incorporates all game modes)

1x ranked BTB playlist

 

Team doubles could be ranked if it even makes it in, and FFA could be as well.

 

Each of these offer a completely different experience playing the game, so I can see them being ranked. But having the arena playlist incorporate slayer and breakout yet them being their own ranked playlists is what I don't understand. Make it Ranked Arena, then have a slayer, a breakout, and a team objective list as all unranked where you go to wind down, warm up, or practice your weak area without stressing about climbing the ladder or messing anyone else's rank up.

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Biasing heavilty towards these matches is something we agree with. It makes sense. Hard and fast rules (4s vs 4s ONLY, no exceptions) are problematic. Particularly when you need to take skill, regional location, etc into account.

 

I'm very glad we at least see eye to eye on this because with as much work as you all are putting towards Arena and rankings, having this last small detail ironed would pretty much seal the deal as far as great matchmaking experiences goes. 

 

I know it having the explicit rule such as teams of 4 vs teams of 4 could seem problematic but I can wholeheartedly assure you, this is not the case. Halo 3 has survived for yearssssss using this method. The only time this would become problematic would be after population drops exponentially. The reason why Halo 3 had a consistent massive population is because if Halo 3 had anything right, their matchmaking system created the most balanced games possible. 

 

I would honestly suggest at least tracking/analyzing data for teams of four and seeing what kind of results and feedback from the community you get.

 

I hate to keep using Halo 3 as an example but it's literally the only one I can use that's relevant. But if there is one thing you can know about playing 50 high in MLG, is that there was absolutely no shortage of teams of 4 in the playlist. I use the MLG playlist as an example because as I'm sure you know, it was one of the least populated playlist, yet matches could continue to be found. I would love to see this type of matchmaking again. 

 

Thanks for the timely response! 

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Halo 5 is a $60 console game. Trying to use f2p or cheap games as models is just idiotic. LoL doesn't need a bunch of social playlist. You know why? Because you can play with bots of varying difficulty. Until Halo can do that we need social playlists. Halo 5 needs ranks for multiple playlists to give people a reason to play more anyway. Imagine if the only ranked playlists in MCC were Hardcore and HCS. People would be pissed beyond belief at the lack of competitive gametypes. Halo 3 was the biggest Halo game and it offered a lot of social AND a lot of ranked. The fact that we only have FOUR playlists COMBINED is just absurd. And to rank all of team is even worse. Seriously, you could copy every playlist and make a social version and the game would be better for everyone (not the ideal way to go about, just an example). Four playlists is just plain laughable. Are we that worries about population? Really?

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Yeah, it'll be a solid 25-0 for me. Big goose egg for you.

You'd be out of your element. This isn't Halo 1, there's no plasma freeze.

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This is where a game like LoL has an advantage over a game with many many different game types. The way I see it, and feel free to disagree bc I don't pretend that what I say is universal, is that in a game like Halo, or CoD, or any other FPS with multiple game modes (CTF, Slayer, Strongholds, and Breakout in H5's case) the solution would be a single playlist with all of these game modes in it that is ranked. So all the 4v4 variants from slayer to ctf to breakout would be in the list, making it a necessity to know how to play all that the game has to offer that is being used in the professional scene. Any game mode in this playlist would have its own social playlist to allow experimenting, playing with friends, not taking it seriously, or actually just practicing a specific gametype without worrying about losing games while trying new tactics out. To try and illustrate that leaves us with:

 

Playlist: Ranked Arena (HCS)

Playlist: Slayer

Playlist: Obj (Ctf, strongholds, + whatever else is down the pipeline)

Playlist: Breakout

 

This gives you the chance to practice specifically your weak points as a player, and then go into the "end-all-be-all" playlist to fight it out with others to climb the ladder. The social playlists can offer a progression system of being ranked like CoD has that will keep the casual players just as busy as competitive players are about skill-rating. In my playlist world the "unranked" playlists would use the same ranking system behind the scenes and be completely invisible, just like playing normals in LoL.

 

BTB and Warzone should be completely separate and I AM ALL FOR A RANKED BTB as well as a social BTB. I've seen a stream of a competitive BTB tourney going on for H4 and it was actually pretty good to watch, not my cup of tea to play mind you, but people enjoy it and more power to them. Not only that, but it allows larger groups of friends (5+ obviously) to play together in a ranked environment if they enjoy the larger maps and bigger scale of battle.

 

Curious what your take on setting it up like this is, and what disadvantages it creates that I might be overlooking.

I can see where you're coming from in the regards of lumping everything into one ranked playlist. I wouldn't have an issue with Slayer and Obj-Strongholds is pretty much and OBJ so why dilute more.

 

*Edit-Didn't see you lump Stronghold into Obj, my bad.

 

You're idea of 

 

HCS Arena* ranked

Obj*Social

Slayer*Social

Breakout*Social

--------------------------------------

Whatever 343 adds post Christmas

 

My only real issue with this is Breakout being lumped in with Slayer and Obj. Simply put, having it in there is kind of a contradiction. 

343 has pushed the idea, alongside the community, of having a Halo game that the vanilla game can translate from thumb less casual fun, to top tier competitive levels with non mechanic changes (radar, weapon starts, maps). Breakout however differs from these 3 gamemodes thus creating a difference. In LOL or COD you don't have something like this within its ranked playlist. 

 

In LOL terms, imagine being in your Diamond 5 promo's and you're 2-2, you get URF instead of Vanilla LOL. That's an extreme example but look at it this way. URF is a modified gametype. The champion still has the same mechanics but they're are changes to the gameplay via buffs to everything. 

 

In COD ranked every gametype you would play had the same game mechanics, damage, health etc. The winning conditions were different, but it still all played the same.

 

Breakout is a new gamemode that has differen't health, damage, no radar. Regardless of the lives or how to win, its simply not the same as the rest. Therefor I don't think it should be included.

 

It's like back in Halo 2 when people freaked at Bungie for having Team Snipers and Team Swords  in Ranked Team Slayer. 

 

Obviously my examples are a bit far fetched but I used them to try and give some context as to why I don't like the idea of having a gamemode drastically altered from the rest be an issue. 

 

In Tournament play, it makes more sense simply because its a 3 game series. Not a single game. Its like if we were back in Reach and MLG said, 2 games are zbns and 1 is vanilla with radar. One team is going to excel at the off variant.

 

As for BTB and Warzone, I get the idea of where 343 is going with Warzone. Its fun, its new, and it looks fun to be drunk and fuck around in. BTB ranked would be nice, and I don't even enjoy BTB. Just gives another part of the Halo community a big sandbox to spawn fuck each other for fun.

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Exactly. Really, REALLY annoying. As in, I cringe and sigh in annoyance when I see these "imitations", which I use loosely. Be yourself. STOP trying to imitate someone else to "piggyback" off of their popularity based on their personality.

Reminds me when EVERY new CoD youtuber tried to sounds like tmartn.

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snip

 

I totally agree with breakout. It's in the game though, and I'm willing to give it a shot. I just don't see how it would fit in for competitive Halo. That would be like adding SWAT into the HCS rotation.

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I totally agree with breakout. It's in the game though, and I'm willing to give it a shot. I just don't see how it would fit in for competitive Halo. That would be like adding SWAT into the HCS rotation.

 

I have no issue with it being in the game either. Some players really enjoyed it. I've seen some pro's talk about it being negative, others positive. It could be a good change up. Personally don't like it one bit. Once again, I can see it working in series play, but not really fit for individual game ranked play.

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We should convert Beyond into a development studio and make our own Halo 5.

 

It's the only way on-topic discussion won't be thrown to the wolves.

 

(That's a pretty fun thing to imagine, actually)

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