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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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"There needs to be a toggle for this" God damn how many toggles yall want? The options screen gonna look like a fucking Mcdonalds menu lol.

it already does

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PS: ground pound looks like it has way more range than I expected from comments from goldenboy. Honestly I'm starting to disagree with everything he says.

I pointed this out to my friend yesterday.

 

Goldenboy made it seem like you have this extremely limited range to choose from when you go to do a ground pound. He literally made it seem like you have a couple of feet of space to choose from, and that if the enemy moves from that space, you're screwed. Then we see a new video and a player ground pounds several metres across the map. It just makes me wonder whether Goldenboy just didn't know how ground pound actually works, or if he knew but was lying about it to try and sell the it to the guys.

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I just don't see what this game offers to be optimistic about. I won't knock on people for being excited for it though since it is your opinion but this is way too reminiscent of Reach/H4.

 

I mean come on were getting Midship redesigned for the 3rd game now with sprint and armor abilities to accommodate the changes....this is never what we wanted or needed in Halo. I just feel its unfair we are getting 343's version of Halo and they are not willing to openly share and create an experience the entire community would enjoy. 

 

I don't understand how after everything shown in the game footage and with the countless amount of discussions had on this forums on sprint, abilities, loadouts, map design, and with PROOF of a decline in the series because of these things, we are still going to continue to support it because its the right thing to do.

 

I know I won't be buying this game at launch but I really hope for everyone who do they get what they wanted because it's been too long since we ever had that.

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The only thing I want from this game, is for it to be a good game out of the box.

 

Halo 1, 2 and yes even Halo 3 did this very well. The NUMBER 1 reason Halo died in the first place is that Reach needed to basically redone from the ground up in custom settings, and Halo 4 even went to the extent of 3rd party mods.

 

343 needs to get the settings right from Day 1, and the casuals need to play the settings we play in comp in public matches, much like LoL and CS. Only then will Halo 5 be a successful game, but the ranking system has already confirmed a buy for me, lol

 

I agree and IMO that means we need to stick with the new features. This game having default abilities means turning them off in customs or whatever would drastically change the game. 

 

The best example I can give is CoD: AW. Yeah the new stuff looked gimmicky at first, and people were tempted to play without Exo's. However, the players are sticking with default settings, and honestly, the game has a huge skill gap and more new players will be willing to jump in to competitive if they know its the same thing they are playing in Pubs for the most part.

 

Thats why we need to try to get sprint nerfed more or removed in the Beta. I don't think this game will work with Sprint regardless of the shield delay, and it definitely won't work if we remove it in Comp settings but its still in the main game. 

 

 

I just don't see what this game offers to be optimistic about. I won't knock on people for being excited for it though since it is your opinion but this is way too reminiscent of Reach/H4.

 

I mean come on were getting Midship redesigned for the 3rd game now with sprint and armor abilities to accommodate the changes....this is never what we wanted or needed in Halo. I just feel its unfair we are getting 343's version of Halo and they are not willing to openly share and create an experience the entire community would enjoy. 

 

I don't understand how after everything shown in the game footage and with the countless amount of discussions had on this forums on sprint, abilities, loadouts, map design, and with PROOF of a decline in the series because of these things, we are still going to continue to support it because its the right thing to do.

 

I know I won't be buying this game at launch but I really hope for everyone who do they get what they wanted because it's been too long since we ever had that.

 

 

I don't think AAs themselves ruined Halo, I think the randomness of AAs ruined Halo. Having the same abilites across the board is the way we need to go, especially in an Arena shooter. Sprint however is different because although everyone has it, it changes the flow of games and slows it down drastically. That is why thruster needs to be toned down, it also allows players to escape when it really should just allow players to dodge shots, melees, etc. (Basically a sudo strafe)

 

Luckily we have this beta to figure out what works and what doesn't, but people need to give it a chance if not it will almost certainly fail. 

 

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Actually after watching some more gameplay I see why clamber was added.

 

There's a lot of horizontal jumping  and horizontal thrusting going on, in some instances where the only way you could possibly make the jump without clambering is landing on the ground and jumping again.

 

If maps were smaller because of there being no sprint you could say clamber wouldn't be necessary, but it is what it is.

Hey Ramirez77. Always nice to see you post around here. :D

 

Amyway, I have to say I can't really agree with your reasoning as to why Clamber was added. The way I see it, they probably designed the maps around the mechanic. Your post almost seems to suggest that they would have designed the maps a certain way and then said: "oops, now we need some kind of mechanic to make this unusual design work".

 

Due to the way Clamber reduces the skill-gap, I think a better starting point would have been for them to keep the original skill jumping aspect of Halo intact due to the depth and character it always added, and then design the maps around that. If they really wanted thrust + jump combinations to be part of the game, then they still could have done so by creating the verticality in the maps in ways which thrust + traditional skill jump could be used for. Then there would be no need for a hand-holding mechanic.

 

I would have a much easier time accepting Clamber if it were only able to be used for those jumps which normal crouch jumping couldn't be used for. And then the smaller jumps would still require the use of skill jumps. But unfortunately, what we actually have (based on what I've seen in the videos) is a situation where anything that can be jumped on that's higher than chest level can be clambered.

In fact, I would completely accept Clamber if this were the way it was being implemented. The way I see it, walking up some stairs or a ramp or using a grav lift to get to a higher level on a map doesn't really require any more skill than Clamber, and those options have been in Halo since day 1. So it's not necessarily Clamber as a movement option that I dislike, it's simply the fact that it seems to be replacing skill jumping almost completely.

 

That's why, when the time comes, my feedback for Clamber will probably be that it should only be possible for those things which are too high to be crouch jumped onto. I think this suggestion is realistic because it allows for the feature to remain in the game, and it wouldn't require the maps to be re-designed. All that would need to happen is the ability to clamber would be taken away from those things which are low enough to crouch jump onto.

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This game looks like shit.

 

Whats the point of grabing anything other then a AR when it kills in 1-2 seconds at a really far range.

 

lololol at people compairing this abortion of a games kill time to H1 and H2.

 

I hope everyone has fun being hulk smashed by some dude hanging in the air for 3 seconds like hes the reincarnation of Michael Jordan but only to miss you by 10 feet and still take you down to no sheilds then AR you for the kill.

 

SnD style game type is not going to work in this game when there is no weapon depth and recharging shields

your a fuckface, we have a year.
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I don't see why automatic/CQC weapons need a zoom function to begin with. Those weapons are mostly spray and pray as opposed to accuracy-based, so they require far less skill to use effectivitely. The fact that they had such limited range worked to make sure that there was still an advantage to be gained when using precision weapons. My worry is that automatic weapons will now be almost as viable as precision weapons at longer ranges, making skilled use of the BR/DMR/Pistol more redundant and less rewarding.

 

It's 343 doing their typical "we fixed what wasn't broken!" routine.

 

I think they have always been broken on some level.

 

The way I see it, except for Halo CE, the Assault Rifle has sat awkwardly between the SMG and Battle Rifle, never really being preferable to either weapon, while the Magnum is crammed in there in different ways as well.  I'm not saying giving them a scope is the best solution, but I'm curious as to what roles you would assign the overlapping weapons (SMG, Magnum, AR) and what changes you would make to them.

 

To be honest I don't think its so much "automatics are broken" as it is "just what the hell is the point of the Assault Rifle?"

 

Also as for Clamber, I would've added a wall-kick mechanic like this instead:

http://i.imgur.com/IEczHbY.png?1

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I think they have always been broken on some level.

 

The way I see it, except for Halo CE, the Assault Rifle has sat awkwardly between the SMG and Battle Rifle, never really being preferable to either weapon, while the Magnum is crammed in there in different ways as well.  I'm not saying giving them a scope is the best solution, but I'm curious as to what roles you would assign the overlapping weapons (SMG, Magnum, AR) and what changes you would make to them.

 

To be honest I don't think its so much "automatics are broken" as it is "just what the hell is the point of the Assault Rifle?"

 

Also as for Clamber, I would've added a wall-kick mechanic like this instead:

http://i.imgur.com/IEczHbY.png?1

Not gonna lie, that wall kick looks 100x better than clamber. I feel like it's too late for 343 to add it though.

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I'd take that wall-kick over clamber any day. It would allow for much more verticality and fluent movement (as long as there is no gun interruption), and it could potentially make skill jumps more relevant than before. Clamber is just as useless as sprint.

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So Greenskull said on r/halo that pistol is worthless compared to DMR & BR :( 

 

I'd be happy if we just got the H2A pistol w/ no bloom. 

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I think they have always been broken on some level.

 

The way I see it, except for Halo CE, the Assault Rifle has sat awkwardly between the SMG and Battle Rifle, never really being preferable to either weapon, while the Magnum is crammed in there in different ways as well.  I'm not saying giving them a scope is the best solution, but I'm curious as to what roles you would assign the overlapping weapons (SMG, Magnum, AR) and what changes you would make to them.

 

To be honest I don't think its so much "automatics are broken" as it is "just what the hell is the point of the Assault Rifle?"

 

Also as for Clamber, I would've added a wall-kick mechanic like this instead:

http://i.imgur.com/IEczHbY.png?1

Ramirez, you're my favourite Halo genius. That wall-kick thing definitely sounds better than Clamber. I'd say we should all tell 343 about it but I'm guessing it would be too late to replace Clamber like that. :/

 

As for what roles I'd give the automatics, my first thought is that I'd simply buff them all a little bit in their respective ranges. But I'd have to think more about it to have a better answer.

It's not so much that I know exactly how they should be as it is that I'm not comfortable with something so void of skill being given such ranged capabilities.

Seeing as most of the time most people go for precision weapons, I'd be tempted to have players start with BRs (or whatever), and I'd put one or two buffed ARs on the maps so that they were treated more like something to have in your back pocket to use at close range. Though I have no idea how that would work. Anything but a longer ranged AR/SMG lol.

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Not gonna lie, that wall kick looks 100x better than clamber. I feel like it's too late for 343 to add it though.

How about that, a new vertical movement mechanic for Halo that we both like the sound of, lol. I wish I could come up with ideas like that.

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One word really sums up halo 5 IMO: underwhelming.

 

1. Spartan abilities seem kind of weak to be honest, not only do they make the button incredibly convoluted, but they also seem somewhat redundant in many ways except for maybe ground pound. They would have been better off with Armor Abilities and equipment but at least they didn't include anything as stupid as in the previous Halo games.

 

2. The gameplay seems really fast this time around, I don't know if it was the kill times or the frame rates or what but this is definitely a huge plus, especially when you think of the last few halo games.

 

3. Weapon design is trash, not so much on a per weapon basis but more so on an overall level it's pretty atrocious, if you're gonna make redundant variants of weapons (BR/DMR,SMG/AR,etc) you may as well go with a loadout system while you are at it, of course I would prefer a sandbox that is short and sweet but since we're not getting that might aswell just go with loadouts instead.

 

4. Map design is alright from what I've seen, not complex sized map so far which alone is a good thing in my eyes, hopefully we get at least 3-5 decent maps this time around and we'll be good.

 

Overall though and really what I was trying to say to begin with is that the game seems to lack any real ambition whatsoever, at least I can say you tried to do something with halo 4 whereas with halo 5 it just seems like you said screw it and gave up, now I know I have only seen a small part of the overall package and I know this is a bit preemptive, but I can't help but be bored with halo 5 right now.

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Having the crosshairs in the centre of the screen instead of the bottom third really bugs me. It just feels like one of those subtle things that helped differentiate Halo from other games (though again, they're clearly not trying to make Halo stand out from other modern FPS games, by the looks of it).

 

I'm pretty sure someone else mentioned this as well, but the sounds are way too acute and actually hurt my ears, even on low volumes. I don't want to imagine it playing through a loud headset.

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2. The gameplay seems really fast this time around, I don't know if it was the kill times or the frame rates or what but this is definitely a huge plus, especially when you think of the last few halo games.

 

Really? I've only seen the gameplay on Truth, but it looked much slower to me than any other Halo game on Midship. There seemed to be a fair bit of people just siting around or sprinting looking for people; however, on H2/H3, there are rarely periods of time when I'm not shooting/nading/getting shot/exploding. But again, I've yet to play the game so my opinion is very subjective.

 

redundant variants of weapons (BR/DMR,SMG/AR,etc)

Hopefully H5 can make the weapons less redundant. The SMG can be more akin to a poor man's shotgun, while the AR could cover short to medium range. BR could excel at medium to long range combat, and the DMR could be better than the BR at long range but not as effective in medium or short range situations. Not sure how they would go about differentiating the DMR and BR though, since it's counterintuitive to make a gun do less damage up close and otherwise the DMR would be better than the BR in every situation.

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Overall though and really what I was trying to say to begin with is that the game seems to lack any real ambition whatsoever, at least I can say you tried to do something with halo 4 whereas with halo 5 it just seems like you said screw it and gave up, now I know I have only seen a small part of the overall package and I know this is a bit preemptive, but I can't help but be bored with halo 5 right now.

 

My jimmies will never know rest from the rustling reading this gave me.

 

The last thing I expected people to criticise was their lack of ambition after everyone, at least to me, seems to be uniformly shouting "No, you're going the wrong way, turn back!"

 

Can 343I win at this point?

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@@EonXII I cannot be certain, I just remember bodies being dropped in an incredibly fast period of time, I may be wrong but even so I would expect tons of changes (for better or for worse) up until launch so I guess it's nothing more than gossip at this point.

 

If you are expecting an interesting and unique sandbox this time around you will likely be disappointed, the moment I saw the BR I assumed the sandbox would be poor, oh well I guess it's to be expected out of Halo, hopefully they'll at least make it balanced and fair, that's the least they can do.

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My jimmies will never know rest from the rustling reading this gave me.

 

The last thing I expected people to criticise was their lack of ambition after everyone, at least to me, seems to be uniformly shouting "No, you're going the wrong way, turn back!"

It depends on what you're expectations for halo 5 were to begin with, if you expected them to make it more traditional then sadly you were setting yourself up for failure, personally I assumed (seeing as how it's next gen and all) that they would go for something extraordinary, however all I saw was ADS and breakout (which was lazy as hell btw) which are fine I guess but Don't really wow me, I mean I watched halo 4/reach nonstop til launch and although they didn't keep my attention for very long at least they managed to grab it to begin with which is more than I can say about halo 5 at the moment.

 

I may just be jaded IDK.

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I think they have always been broken on some level.

 

The way I see it, except for Halo CE, the Assault Rifle has sat awkwardly between the SMG and Battle Rifle, never really being preferable to either weapon, while the Magnum is crammed in there in different ways as well.  I'm not saying giving them a scope is the best solution, but I'm curious as to what roles you would assign the overlapping weapons (SMG, Magnum, AR) and what changes you would make to them.

 

To be honest I don't think its so much "automatics are broken" as it is "just what the hell is the point of the Assault Rifle?"

 

Also as for Clamber, I would've added a wall-kick mechanic like this instead:

http://i.imgur.com/IEczHbY.png?1

I would get rid of the redundant weapons that have been shoved into the game over the years. There is no reason to have the SMG, AR, Magnum, BR, and DMR. I would either a) make duel wielding a thing like Halo 2 have the SMG and Magnum plus a DMR/BR, B) have the AR, get rid of the SMG and pistol, and have BR/DMR, or C) make it like halo 1 and have the AR and godly pistol.

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I would get rid of the redundant weapons that have been shoved into the game over the years. There is no reason to have the SMG, AR, Magnum, BR, and DMR. I would either a) make duel wielding a thing like Halo 2 have the SMG and Magnum plus a DMR/BR, B) have the AR, get rid of the SMG and pistol, and have BR/DMR, or C) make it like halo 1 and have the AR and godly pistol.

Dual-wielding makes Spartan Abilities look good lol.

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Dual-wielding makes Spartan Abilities look good lol.

 

Good thing playing Halo 2 on Xbox Live reminded me how overrated dual wielding was, I hate how much space taken up on the screen. 

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How about that, a new vertical movement mechanic for Halo that we both like the sound of, lol. I wish I could come up with ideas like that.

it's not necessarily a new idea, but it definitely would fit Halo super well. The problem is theyd have to build maps with that in mind, so I highly doubt that we'll ever see it. wish we could see it though.

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...

 

As I said earlier, the only people this system is a negative for are those who liked to pubstomp against noobs who don't know timers. Personally I don't really care about those kind of players because their preferred style of play is directly in opposition to the purpose of a good matchmaking system (which it's looking like H5 will have).

This.

 

I think showing where a weapon will spawn is also OK because new players would then get the short cut of learning faster where they spawn and not have to take time to study it in forge. So long as it is not random you can still strategize and contend for weapon and map control.

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I have been thinking of clamber. It seems to me it eliminates jump skill. OK. Just design maps for clamber skill instead. Make grabbing the ledge challenging similar to jumps in previous titles. Then the only drawback is you lose aiming while in the climbing maneuver.

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