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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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@@Moa looks like we should be able to pre-download H5 digital next week. Still curious what happened with yours sinc e you seem to think you actually downloaded the game.

@@Sal1ent this is great news to hear it went gold. I'm mostly excited the fact we have 21 maps at launch, that's amazing. I'm looking forward to learn a whole bunch of new maps!

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The classic "Don't buy it then" argument, it never gets old.

 

You are all brainwashed into thinking this is ok for developers to release half the game at launch and promise patches/fixes/the rest of the game months later.

 

I have yet to see a cohesive argument from any Beyond member here why this is ok for 343 to do this to the Halo community. Instead I just get downvoted, this site has really changed from 2013.

 

Your argument is full [email protected], Careh. My car analogy is spot on and you failed to muster a worthy argument answering my initial question: Why is it ok for developers to not ship a FULL game on launch day? If it's not done, it's not done. Post launch content? The fuck? Features that were Day One content in Halo 3 are post launch content in Halo 5? How the hell is that ok?

 

Please, amuse me Beyond. It's starting to get annoying to post here when most of you dance around the ambiguity that actually surrounds the day one launch of this game.

You are describing how I feel, people are just excited for this game and they don't want to see or hear anything negative about the game. That's my guess
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Post launch content? The fuck? Features that were Day One content in Halo 3 are post launch content in Halo 5? How the hell is that ok?

Like I said in a previous post, Halo 3 Forge was useless until Foundry came out 3 months post-launch (in December). You needed to spend 800 MSP ($10) on the Heroic map pack to have a decent Forge canvas. 

 

Halo 5 expects us to wait 1 or 2 months, gives us features that aren't even comparable in terms of creative possibilities, and will be free. Believe it or not, it's a better deal.

 

And there's also the advantage of people not begging for Forge remakes right off the bat instead of learning the new maps and getting used to them.

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voting woth your wallet is the only way to show a dev you dont support their dev decisions. rant allyou want on a forum, it usually falls on deaf ears. if you feel a game isnt complete, wait till it is then buy it. sales figures are stronger than you think.

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Remove the man-cannons from Narrows, it still plays like Narrows.

 

Add teleporters to Isolation, it still plays like Isolation.

 

Add a lift from waterfall to snipe room on Damnation, it still plays like Damnation.

 

Tear down the snipe towers on Pit, it still plays like Pit.

 

Put ramps from base windows to top mid on Midship.

 

There are a million modifications you can make to certain maps that provide drastically different mobility from one area of the map to the next, but will not cause the map to be played "radically" different.

 

My original point was that adding catwalks was something we could have done in forge if we wanted to, in about five minutes. To add that and then pass it off as a new map to bolster the launch count is absurd, as it will be if that's what we can expect future map updates to be like.

Those changes aren't nearly as extreme as the changes from Eden to Empire. Something more appropriate would be to remove red tower from Hang Em High, put another blue tower there, kill some of the no-mans land, and move the catwalks around.

 

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Like I said in a previous post, Halo 3 Forge was useless until Foundry came out 3 months post-launch (in December). You needed to spend 800 MSP ($10) on the Heroic map pack to have a decent Forge canvas. 

 

Halo 5 expects us to wait 1 or 2 months, gives us features that aren't even comparable in terms of creative possibilities, and will be free. Believe it or not, it's a better deal.

 

And there's also the advantage of people not begging for Forge remakes right off the bat instead of learning the new maps and getting used to them.

It wasn't useless at all.  Forge is used for a lot more than just making maps.  Forge was used to change spawns and weapon placement.  Think of all the changes MLG maps had in them. 

 

For the first 2 months we have to hope spawns and weapon placement are good enough.  If they aren't the game will be dead by the time forge comes out. 

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Like I said in a previous post, Halo 3 Forge was useless until Foundry came out 3 months post-launch (in December). You needed to spend 800 MSP ($10) on the Heroic map pack to have a decent Forge canvas. 

 

Halo 5 expects us to wait 1 or 2 months, gives us features that aren't even comparable in terms of creative possibilities, and will be free. Believe it or not, it's a better deal.

 

And there's also the advantage of people not begging for Forge remakes right off the bat instead of learning the new maps and getting used to them.

forge was usable before foundry, I can't tell you how many dday maps I made in last resort and high ground.

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Those changes aren't nearly as extreme as the changes from Eden to Empire. Something more appropriate would be to remove red tower from Hang Em High, put another blue tower there, kill some of the no-mans land, and move the catwalks around.

 

 

I don't think we have the same definition of what constitutes a "radical" change.

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@@Moa looks like we should be able to pre-download H5 digital next week. Still curious what happened with yours sinc e you seem to think you actually downloaded the game.

@@Sal1ent this is great news to hear it went gold. I'm mostly excited the fact we have 21 maps at launch, that's amazing. I'm looking forward to learn a whole bunch of new maps!

Looks like it was an issue with the new dashboard. Pre-ordered games would constantly show as downloading for long periods of time which made me think the game was downloading and taking its sweet ass time. 

 

In reality, it was already downloaded and the info text was wrong. I deleted and redownloaded this morning and it took seconds.

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The remix concept is absolutely redundant, we don't need two versions of one map when we have forge, like regret is different enough from truth, but if we have regret why do we need truth? They fill the same role.

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The remix concept is absolutely redundant, we don't need two versions of one map when we have forge, like regret is different enough from truth, but if we have regret why do we need truth? They fill the same role.

 

I'm getting sick of "circle" maps, personally.

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It wasn't useless at all.  Forge is used for a lot more than just making maps.  Forge was used to change spawns and weapon placement.  Think of all the changes MLG maps had in them. 

 

For the first 2 months we have to hope spawns and weapon placement are good enough.  If they aren't the game will be dead by the time forge comes out. 

Those changes weren't much which decent custom game options shouldn't be able to cover. Change weapon sets on the map, starting weapons, etc. 

 

I'd also argue that the spawn points MLG changed made a lot of the maps worse. Excluding Pit where it was possible to spawn in sword or almost pushed up past neutral line, a lot of the changes resulted in blatant spawn sniping being possible. There's a thousand clips out there where people will block a spawn with a grenade and pre-aim another and snipe someone right in the head. Whoever worked on those did a super questionable job.

 

At least this time around the devs are focused on esports and acknowledge the fact that competitive leagues are thing, as opposed to Bungie who just did whatever seemed fun to them with little regard to competitive merit (AKA a lot of ARs, needlers, spikers, maulers, equipment, horrendous kill times, slow ass movement). 343's pro team can also help deliver feedback and prevent issues that Bungie was too bad to test themselves.

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Like I said in a previous post, Halo 3 Forge was useless until Foundry came out 3 months post-launch (in December). You needed to spend 800 MSP ($10) on the Heroic map pack to have a decent Forge canvas. 

 

Halo 5 expects us to wait 1 or 2 months, gives us features that aren't even comparable in terms of creative possibilities, and will be free. Believe it or not, it's a better deal.

 

And there's also the advantage of people not begging for Forge remakes right off the bat instead of learning the new maps and getting used to them.

I thought the Heroic map pack was free? It's been so long I forgot. Maybe they made it free later or something, don't remember.

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I don't think we have the same definition of what constitutes a "radical" change.

That's exactly what was done between Eden and Empire. The bases were made level and equal, catwalks removed, a lot of the dance floor was reduced, pillars were added, along with a handful of new routes. They share a similar look and feel, but are otherwise entirely different.

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Looks like it was an issue with the new dashboard. Pre-ordered games would constantly show as downloading for long periods of time which made me think the game was downloading and taking its sweet ass time.

 

In reality, it was already downloaded and the info text was wrong. I deleted and redownloaded this morning and it took seconds.

Ahhh gotcha. I got the new dashboard as well and they're in queue for me. They're just chilling right now

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That's exactly what was done between Eden and Empire. The bases were made level and equal, catwalks removed, a lot of the dance floor was reduced, pillars were added, along with a handful of new routes. They share a similar look and feel, but are otherwise entirely different.

one is definitely worse than the other, I'll say that much.

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I thought the Heroic map pack was free? It's been so long I forgot. Maybe they made it free later or something, don't remember.

 

yeah, I paid for that map pack ... was made free a few months later.  the map packs for H4 were very impressive, tbh, much better than disc maps

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forge was usable before foundry, I can't tell you how many dday maps I made in last resort and high ground.

Forge being usable before Foundry is the equivalent of the Halo 3 AR being usable to get kills with.

 

You're not wrong, but it's still awful.

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I have no doubt that there will be maps made in Forge that will make 343's maps grossly incomparable. I am hoping that we will have a chance to put maps in matchmaking, and even HCS, to show the power of independent map designers.

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I thought the Heroic map pack was free? It's been so long I forgot. Maybe they made it free later or something, don't remember.

yeah, I paid for that map pack ... was made free a few months later.  the map packs for H4 were very impressive, tbh, much better than disc maps

Heroic became free a bit over a year later after its launch.

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I have no doubt that there will be maps made in Forge that will make 343's maps grossly incomparable. I am hoping that we will have a chance to put maps in matchmaking, and even HCS, to show the power of independent map designers.

If you can convince the cartographers to send them 343's way then push for it.

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I was expecting 343 to give us tools to make maps on a less limited platform. Something more precise, fast, and easy, like with mouse and keyboard. There's just a ton of limitations with a controller, and I thought with Windows 10 they were going to make a generational leap in Halo. A true map editor. A way to control the template of the maps, a way to control surfaces in a better way. A way to browse the maps or have a live preview, or something else in the line of finding cool new maps. Maybe something with procedurally generated environments, or an environmental randomizer so that you can get past "writers block" and improvise. Idk, I just wanted to see something big. Something I could tell my friends about that don't play Halo that would make them say "Damm, I can't believe they didn't delay that feature even longer". We got incremental improvement, and better tools than we've ever had, but that's all expected. Why we didn't get that in the launch window, who knows. But all I know is that I'm not amazed.

To be totally optimistic, this could still be a thing.

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I have no doubt that there will be maps made in Forge that will make 343's maps grossly incomparable. I am hoping that we will have a chance to put maps in matchmaking, and even HCS, to show the power of independent map designers.

 

I agree ... I'm annoyed by the delay for Forge but this definitely means that H5's longevity will be ridiculously improved.  

 

Incredibly powerful forge, custom games on dedicated servers, friends list can hold 1000 people, toggles for sprint and other features, etc. ... not bad

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I agree ... I'm annoyed by the delay for Forge but this definitely means that H5's longevity will be ridiculously improved.  

 

Incredibly powerful forge, custom games on dedicated servers, friends list can hold 1000 people, toggles for sprint and other features, etc. ... not bad

it might fuck halo 5 in the ass because important shit isn't available at launch.

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