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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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since were talking about classic things that are being changed in the game, does anyone have an explanation? of why they kept the sniper from Halo 4, does anyone here know of anyone that actually likes that wall-e looking ass thing? Another decision by them that just baffles me.

The h4 sniper was a 343 sniper. Someone at 343 designed it, pushed it, and would have his feelings hurt if it were taken out just because we miss a classic sniper.

 

Everything they do revolves around ego. They are systematically reinventing halo the way they like it with THEIR touch everywhere. They despise classic halo because they didn't make it- it doesn't have their touch. This is basic Human nature and the biggest force for evolving anything.

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@@Shekkles I tried explaining this to my friends earlier today; there's a lot of factors that make Halo 5 'not Halo' to me. I think some of the charm from the original trilogy was the art style/unique audio design. Halo never went for photo realism then because Bungie had a fantastic grasp on how they wanted their game to look, and it's shown even now. They've aged wonderfully. Compared to 4/5 I feel like 343 just goes for generic sci fi / photorealism that quickly becomes outdated. It's not as timeless as the original trilogy and I feel like Halo lost a lot of its charm because of it, and so much of someone's perception on the game is based on how it looks and sounds. Thousands of custom games in Halo 3 that many people remember it by like Close the Door on High Ground, or Jenga, or Minotaur, Fat Kid, Cops and Robbers. I just don't see working in the Halo 5 sandbox. They could give us the same exact options to recreate the games just how they were but Halo 5, to me, just looks like it's trying too hard to look hardcore. I can't imagine having a casual time playing random custom games clashing with this over the top lens flare contrast deep black art style that encompasses the whole game. It'd just be weird. Because I enjoy how this looks

 

255688-halo-3-xbox-360-screenshot-infect

 

 

More than how this looks.

 

Halo-5-Guardians-Multiplayer-Beta-Empire

 

 

Maybe I'm crazy. But everything about 343's Halo makes me think they don't understand Halo

H3 maps did not look misty, cloudy, or foggy. They were crisp and bright with a few notable exceptions. But even blackout was easy to see at distance. Reach kept the strong bright ambience especially with forge world and tempest. But h4 took a sudden dive into darkness and misty ambience in half the maps. Exile looked like a cartoon. Ragnarok colors just broke any nostalgia a person had so a remake was pointless.

 

All in all your concluding assessment is spot on. 343 employees came into the studio without a clue and it has been the blind leading the blind ever since.

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armor abilities/double jumps/wall runs/ground pounds/jetpacks

oh come on, almost all the things you've listed aren't in halo atm, like yeah armor abilities and ground pound yeah, but armor abilities as a concept we've had since 2010, before just about all major shooter franchises(and by that I mean franchises like cod, bf, and before games like destiny and titanfall were made), and ground pound I really wouldn't consider a generic ability, destiny has it kind of( player flies up and slams down when you press a button) and with cod it's just a downward thrust that does damage, it was a total afterthought. I think crysis had it as well. That's 3 games, only one of which gained any real popularity, out of a whole genre.

 

Now, if you wanted to say that clamber and slide were added because they were recognizable, then I would agree, even though I think both can benefit gameplay if the right changes are made.

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Compared to 4/5 I feel like 343 just goes for generic sci fi / photorealism that quickly becomes outdated.  It's not as timeless as the original trilogy and I feel like Halo lost a lot of its charm because of it, and so much  of someone's perception on the game is based on how it looks and sounds.

 

You really don't want to get me started on that topic.

 

Feel like I've talked about Forerunner architecture to death.  The strange thing is I felt they actually got the feel down in CEA, but then they did a total reversal with Halo 4.  So they show that they know how to do it, but then they don't do it...

 

I agree with the cities as well.  The chrome cities such as Empire look like something I could see being in a CoD game.  I did like the look of Perdition though, in my opinion it felt reminiscent of Halo 3 / Halo Reach.

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The h4 sniper was a 343 sniper. Someone at 343 designed it, pushed it, and would have his feelings hurt if it were taken out just because we miss a classic sniper.

 

Everything they do revolves around ego. They are systematically reinventing halo the way they like it with THEIR touch everywhere. They despise classic halo because they didn't make it- it doesn't have their touch. This is basic Human nature and the biggest force for evolving anything.

Dude, you really need to...

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What if spartan call outs were a user controlled action like the call outs in shadowrun? It used the D-Pad, pressing up while looking at a player called out the race and location. Then pressing right called out that you needed  back up in your location, and left would say to move to whatever location. Obviously it doesn't have to copy the same exact thing but it would allow micless players to attempt to call out while hopefully not flooding the spartan chatter. There are some people who non-stop press up on the D-Pad in S/R which is my only annoyance with the system.

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For the people suggesting universal BR+Pistol starts, REALLY? You think casuals will enjoy spawning with no automatic for the first time ever in a Halo game (outside of competitive)?  Cmon now... 

Every Halo game has had a vote for Team BR's or Team DMR's in the main Slayer playlist. 

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What if spartan call outs were a user controlled action like the call outs in shadowrun? It used the D-Pad, pressing up while looking at a player called out the race and location. Then pressing right called out that you needed  back up in your location, and left would say to move to whatever location. Obviously it doesn't have to copy the same exact thing but it would allow micless players to attempt to call out while hopefully not flooding the spartan chatter. There are some people who non-stop press up on the D-Pad in S/R which is my only annoyance with the system.

give it a cool down of a few seconds.

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THANKS FOR THE ASSIST!!

 

How will they not know that was a nice assist if I don't have my mic in  :kappa:

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Well, we're backing up our opinions with reasoning... instead of just saying the BR is "more fun". I think the DMR and Light Rifle are more fun than Pistol, but realize Pistol is better for a starting weapon... I can always pick up a DMR, LR, or BR up on map. 

People back up their BR opinion with reasoning. You just chose to ignore them and make counter points to their argument. You fail to see that neither side is right. It's all preference at this point. When you get your hands on a buffed, recoil free pistol and you have tested every sandbox weapon, then we can talk facts. For now, this is all opinion. There may be more skillful weapons in the sandbox that we don't know about. Why not spawn with the most skillful weapon? I'm okay with BR/AR. I'm okay with Pistol/AR. I just PREFER having a BR off the start. We need to see the entire sandbox and test out the settings before we talk facts. I'll give my reasoning for BR starts below since you said no one does.

  1. Without BR (or DMR) starts, a great team with control over precision weapons on the map will demolish an even slightly lesser skilled team. How can you combat a team if they sit back with their precision weaponry and superior RRR and pick you off from power positions. Yes, the AR and pistol are viable medium and possibly "long" range weapons but they still don't compare to other precision weapons in the sandbox.
  2. Spawning everyone with a pistol and AR gives 343 the impression that we enjoy Halo being played with automatic starts. I think they'll fail to see that the pistol is the main reason for desiring these settings and will use data to back up the claim. Most players will use the AR over the pistol if they spawn with both. A lot of players won't even see the power or potential with the pistol if they have an AR that's both easier to aim and viable at just about any range.
  3. BR/pistol starts give players two weapons that are both seemingly able to beat the other in a 1v1 exchange. It also doesn't turn the game into an AR shootout. If a player hates the BR they can easily ditch it for an SMG, AR, or unknown sandbox map. 

Now, the problem with the above arguments are that they can be made for both sides. Especially number 3. Let's refrain from speaking facts until we have the game. For now let's accept that while our opinions make sense to us it doesn't make them right. People will always have different preferences and in the end playing the game is about having fun. If someone only has fun with BRs, they should be given the opportunity to do so. Having both starts in the game in some form is unavoidable if they want to sustain every population. It sucks that it has to be that way but it does. Just to be clear. I'm okay with AR/Pistol starts. I will play them if it becomes the norm. I just don't prefer them. I would actually prefer pistol only starts over those settings. My hatred isn't for the pistol. My hatred is for the possibility that Halo becomes auto vs auto and too "user" friendly.

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Every Halo game has had a vote for Team BR's or Team DMR's in the main Slayer playlist. 

 

What kind of argument is that? Team BRs is BR+AR and Team DMRs is DMR + AR.

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give it a cool down of a few seconds.

 

 

It could work in Halo, but it would have hurt in Shadowrun. I know that the player had to finish the entire call out before the next one would take place. In SR if you saw the player say in the center of hanger and pressed up on the D pad, it'd say 1 Human inside Hanger. As it's saying that, the human teleports up and into their promenade/connector high mid sentence. Before the sentence is finished, you can press up again and it will call him out again but this time with the location he moved to, even though you pressed the call out a bit early. It's easier to see and harder to understand through text.

 

So the issue with this is the cool down on the call outs can potentially allow for bad call outs if a player has sprinted out of the location or w/e. Just some things that cross my mind whenever I struggle to think how we can somewhat fix Halo lol.

 

 

 

while I'm on the idea of copying everything Shadowrun, I really like the stat sheet/post game lobby in it. I like that money in that game was earned through damage points and not kills. It doesn't showcase assists easily, but a player with 5 kills could have easily earned the damage of 12.0 but hadn't landed the finishing shot. Again, it works so well in SR but there's no shield recovery in that game, which would make it difficult or at least I assume so.

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People back up their BR opinion with reasoning. You just chose to ignore them and make counter points to their argument.

That's how debate works. And most reasoning has defaulted back to H2/3 reasoning/assumptions. 

 

There may be more skillful weapons in the sandbox that we don't know about. Why not spawn with the most skillful weapon?

 

The only utility weapon that hasn't been seen yet has been the Cov. Carbine. With Pistol, BR, DMR, CC & LR, I doubt 343 would add more utility weapons, especially since loadouts aren't returning.

 

I'm okay with BR/AR. I'm okay with Pistol/AR. I just PREFER having a BR off the start. We need to see the entire sandbox and test out the settings before we talk facts. I'll give my reasoning for BR starts below since you said no one does.

  1. Without BR (or DMR) starts, a great team with control over precision weapons on the map will demolish an even slightly lesser skilled team. How can you combat a team if they sit back with their precision weaponry and superior RRR and pick you off from power positions. Yes, the AR and pistol are viable medium and possibly "long" range weapons but they still don't compare to other precision weapons in the sandbox. 
  2. In the beta, this didn't really happen. And we KNOW that Pistol has been buffed, from Sal1ent. 
  3. Spawning everyone with a pistol and AR gives 343 the impression that we enjoy Halo being played with automatic starts. I think they'll fail to see that the pistol is the main reason for desiring these settings and will use data to back up the claim. Most players will use the AR over the pistol if they spawn with both. A lot of players won't even see the power or potential with the pistol if they have an AR that's both easier to aim and viable at just about any range.
  4. Every Halo game has had the player start with an Automatic weapon. That's not going to change any time soon. And we KNOW from Sal1ent that AR has been nerfed in the form of accuracy and headshot bonuses. 
  5. BR/pistol starts give players two weapons that are both seemingly able to beat the other in a 1v1 exchange. It also doesn't turn the game into an AR shootout. If a player hates the BR they can easily ditch it for an SMG, AR, or unknown sandbox map. 

Now, the problem with the above arguments are that they can be made for both sides. Especially number 3. Let's refrain from speaking facts until we have the game. For now let's accept that while our opinions make sense to us it doesn't make them right. People will always have different preferences and in the end playing the game is about having fun. If someone only has fun with BRs, they should be given the opportunity to do so.  What if I only have fun with Cov. Carbine? I pick it up on map... 343 has put plenty of each utility weapon on each beta map - this won't be H2/3 where there was 1 BR or CC per map. Having both starts in the game in some form is unavoidable if they want to sustain every population. It sucks that it has to be that way but it does. Just to be clear. I'm okay with AR/Pistol starts. I will play them if it becomes the norm. I just don't prefer them. I would actually prefer pistol only starts over those settings. My hatred isn't for the pistol. My hatred is for the possibility that Halo becomes auto vs auto and too "user" friendly.

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People back up their BR opinion with reasoning. You just chose to ignore them and make counter points to their argument.

That's how debate works. And most reasoning has defaulted back to H2/3 reasoning/assumptions. 

You just spoke as if you were correct and I was incorrect, again. I'm very familiar with how a debate works but seeing both sides is just as important in making a sound case for your opinion. Yes that's how old Halo's worked as a whole. I can easily see these settings being viable for a lot of players. However, the AR never had a place in competitive Halo after CE. For a lot of less "accepting" players starting without a BR or DMR will cause anger and frustration leading to those people quitting Halo. I want unified settings but not at the cost of turning Halo into a predominantly AR ridden game. AR requires arguably the least amount of skill for a starting weapon. It's impossible to please both sides. There will have to be both AR and BR starts (possibly even DMR) at launch before we figure out which options work best for HCS or as a unified setting. Lastly, I played each week of the Halo 5 beta. You pointed out that you only played at a friend's house for a week. You can't say that something never happened with such a small amount of first hand knowledge of the in game tendencies. I may not speak for you or anyone else in this topic but my team won the majority of matches 50-10 or with a massive one sided victory during AR week for the very reason I pointed out in my original post. It happened a lot for my friends and I during the beta. That's the only fact I can provide. Everything else here is just opinions and preference until we get our hands on the full game. I see your side of the argument so try seeing ours.

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The Halo 5 pistol was my favorite all time Halo weapon. It was so satisfying to get kills with. I would constantly out shoot people with a Br or Ar. I am pretty sure the pistol had the fastest kill time in H5. The only trick to the pistol beating the BR or AR is that you need to be at the perfect range. The range needed varies depending on the weapon you go up against. You also need to hit your shots. Weapon range is a huge factor in Halo 5. There is a very thin line between what weapon will win deepening on range. The SMG for example. If you are just slightly out of its range an AR will drop you. I feel the H5 weapons are very balanced due to the range limits. They all can kill if you play them correctly. 

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You just spoke as if you were correct and I was incorrect, again. I'm very familiar with how a debate works but seeing both sides is just as important in making a sound case for your opinion. Yes that's how old Halo's worked as a whole. I can easily see these settings being viable for a lot of players. However, the AR never had a place in competitive Halo after CE. For a lot of less "accepting" players starting without a BR or DMR will cause anger and frustration leading to those people quitting Halo. I want unified settings but not at the cost of turning Halo into a predominantly AR ridden game. AR requires arguably the least amount of skill for a starting weapon. It's impossible to please both sides. There will have to be both AR and BR starts (possibly even DMR) at launch before we figure out which options work best for HCS or as a unified setting. Lastly, I played each week of the Halo 5 beta. You pointed out that you only played at a friend's house for a week. You can't say that something never happened with such a small amount of first hand knowledge of the in game tendencies. I may not speak for you or anyone else in this topic but my team won the majority of matches 50-10 or with a massive one sided victory during AR week for the very reason I pointed out in my original post. It happened a lot for my friends and I during the beta. That's the only fact I can provide. Everything else here is just opinions and preference until we get our hands on the full game. I see your side of the argument so try seeing ours.

 

Fair enough. However, you have ignored some facts that go against your opinion/:

 

1) BR or DMR "starts" have always had a secondary automatic, outside of Throwdown/HCS playlists. So BR vs. Pistol doesn't really affect how the AR plays.

2) @@Sal1ent has written about AR nerfs (smart-scope accuracy, lower headshot-bonuses) and Pistol buffs where IT WAS BEATING THE BR in pro tests. They've definitely realized that the AR/Pistol balance was off from the beta.

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I don't know if this has been said, but I wish there was like a dialog where you can just filter which medals you see on the screen.

 

For example, there have been plenty of times where I've gotten a Killtrocity or a Killtac or something and it just sits there and flashes 20 medals in my face for like 7-8 seconds. I have a very... I guess the word is "reactive" type of eyesight, in which I draw attention very easily to the slightest movements even in the corner of my eye. Has always made me good at finding people across maps. Has also made me very paranoid when a fly or something gets into the room.  -_-

 

Having SO many medals flashing across the screen is nothing but a distraction and it honestly does bother me to an extent (No, it doesn't cause me to die or anything, it's just a extremely annoying). I literally killed an entire team on top red in Truth, and the medals didn't stop flashing until I got to the top of big tower and killed someone who respawned on blue (in which I got another medal just for killing him).

 

Honestly, a really simple option window with a bunch of switches to turn these off would be great in my opinion.

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I really hope that Spartan Chatter is removed completely. It makes no sense that the game calls things out for you when you and your team are supposed to do that.

I feel exactly the same way, but it seems most people here like spartan chatter. The argument in favour of it is always: "But it helps when you get put with randoms who don't know how to communicate".

 

Well... yeah, just like how extra auto-aim for your weapons would help when you get randoms who don't know how to shoot. Being put with randoms is annoying, but the whole point of being on a team is that you are all responsible together for the outcome of the game, and if one person is bad, then the team overall is supposed to do worse because it's a team-based match. I don't know, the argument just doesn't sit well with me. Spartan chatter is just one of the many annoying things that 343 have done to put me off the multiplayer side of Halo.

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It's hard for me to see and relate spartan chatter and micless players to noobs who need "extra" auto-aim because they have trouble shooting. Too different of a scenario. I think as long as skill based matchmaking works, you're way more likely to end up with a micless teammate than a thumbless teammate.

 

I personally wouldn't want any chatter available except for player specific call outs.

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...

  • Without BR (or DMR) starts, a great team with control over precision weapons on the map will demolish an even slightly lesser skilled team. How can you combat a team if they sit back with their precision weaponry and superior RRR and pick you off from power positions. ...

  • Spawning everyone with a pistol and AR gives 343 the impression that we enjoy Halo being played with automatic starts....

     

  • BR/pistol starts give players two weapons that are both seemingly able to beat the other in a 1v1 exchange...
Now, the problem with the above arguments are that ...

1. This is counter to experience. As I have repeatedly stated AR starts help lower the score gap. As I have argued this at length I have come to realize that AR starts helps demonstrate individual skill over team skill which is critical in 1v4. This makes acquiring power weapons more likely even for the lesser skilled team.

 

2. Makes no sense at all.

 

3. Makes team skill more dominate and individual skill less so, making the better team capable of taking control of power weapons.

 

The problem with your arguments is that they don't conform at all to experience.

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From my experience, I didn't encounter people camping with precision weapons much, and even then, it wasn't hard for my team to take them out.

 

For instance, Truth had DMRs behind cover on the ramps and two BRs in each spawn, while Empire had plenty of interior rooms for CQC and the lower area was well-covered.

 

In Regret, the Hydra spawn could be bombarded with grenades and the Light Rifle spawn had multiple paths of entry.

 

The only maps where I had a problem with camping were Eden and Orion, which can be alleviated with some simple changes (I.E decrease upper ramp cover, make more paths from lower to higher areas).

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Does anybody else think that they'd like the H2 (or even H3) physics back? It was so rewarding to see a guy's legs kick up into the air after you sniped him in the face. The H5's physics just made the guy's head snap back so the top half of his body folds backwards

 

cEyPaGw.jpg

I know my friend would love that shit. His GT is Flipbackboy because BR/Snipe head shots made you flip back BOY

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1. This is counter to experience. As I have repeatedly stated AR starts help lower the score gap. 

 

I disagree with this statement - assuming you're talking about AR + Pistol vs. BR + AR starts...

 

1) Pistol is harder to use than BR, so > skillgap, more likely land-slides

2) More useful sandbox overall (Pistol starts) allows for more variety and depth, so > skillgap. 

3) Without BR starts, not everything is teamshooting, so individual skill makes a greater difference on the impact of a game.

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