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CyReN

Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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So the basic argument is, "since these other bias problems exist over here, we shouldn't put in any effort to eliminate whatever bias we can over there"?

 

Thats the same argument people make when they blow a diet. "Well I ate like crap yesterday, so fuck it why try today?"

 

What I'm saying is: this "study" is 99% biased and 343 is trying their hardest to get it down to 97%. Using your analogy it's like saying "oh no bro, I'm on a diet" to someone offering you a glass of orange juice after you just ate two entire chocolate cakes by yourself. Yes it's good that they are trying to get rid of bias, but this reminds me a whole lot of the "only 11% of players are against sprint" poll.

 

This is an irrational fear. They ARE going to provide the data you desire. The discussion will be driven by anecdotes from people who have played it without knowing the data, and then the discussion will continue after the data has been revealed- this is how it should be.

 

You don't tell people what brands they are drinking BEFORE they partake in the taste test. You get their honest, completely blind answer, and they you reveal what their options were.

 

I hope you're right. I'm just afraid the feedback thread is going to become the typical waypoint thread filled with people who think Elites should be in matchmaking and that a sidearm should always be inferior to a rifle.

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60 FPS is objectively better than 30

 

Destiny 2 on console is also very fun

 

both of these truths can live in harmony

 

believe

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What I'm saying is: this "study" is 99% biased and 343 is trying their hardest to get it down to 97%. Using your analogy it's like saying "oh no bro, I'm on a diet" to someone offering you a glass of orange juice after you just ate two entire chocolate cakes by yourself. Yes it's good that they are trying to get rid of bias, but this reminds me a whole lot of the "only 11% of players are against sprint" poll.

 

 

I hope you're right. I'm just afraid the feedback thread is going to become the typical waypoint thread filled with people who think Elites should be in matchmaking and that a sidearm should always be inferior to a rifle.

 

I totally agree with you here, i'm just saying its still good that they are taking control of the variables where they can.  Its worth the short term ignorance imo.

 

and dont forget that no weapons are balanced until they are being wielded by spartans with black undersuits.

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60 FPS is objectively better than 30

 

Destiny 2 on console is also very fun

 

both of these truths can live in harmony

 

believe

Destiny 2 on console:

 

Benefits-Of-A-Kids-Mini-Roller-Coaster-R

 

Destiny 2 on PC:

 

Takabisha_roller_coaster.jpg

 

 

 

Sure, you could have fun on either. But we know which one is better. :glasses:

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​That you get this worked up about some posts on an internet forum is your amusing problem, not mine. This has nothing to do with the topic we're discussing and everything to do with your personal beef with me. Get over it.

Sure my beef with you is going to influence my opinion of your posts.  But I actually agree with you on a lot of things.  Go check your post history since we argued over OW's gun skill and I rage quit that cancerous discord server.  I've +1'd you numerous times about things you've said about Halo. I even agree with you about PC. I love PC and wish the whole industry was just as good. I don't agree with how you talk down to people about it. Just like the way you talked down to me about OW's lack of gun skill. Same way you talk down to people who have their personal reasoning behind deciding to play on a console instead of a PC. You got your problems, I got mine.  I guess I'll just try to do a better job ignoring your condescending posts in the future. Life's too short to indulge in feeding pricks who get enjoyment off triggering people. 

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Destiny 2 on console:

 

Benefits-Of-A-Kids-Mini-Roller-Coaster-R

 

Destiny 2 on PC:

 

Takabisha_roller_coaster.jpg

 

 

 

Sure, you could have fun on either. But we know which one is better. :glasses:

 

Ahh see! roller coasters.  Now i get it, you just have to meet me at my level. :simms:

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I just wanted to say, that there is something about Destiny 2 that makes it feel WAY smoother than any 30 fps game I've ever played. I don't know what it is or how Bungie does it but it literally doesn't even look like 30 fps.

 

That being said I usually can't stand 30fps and it's the reason I won't be playing Halo 3 bc. But Bungie worked some weird sorcery with D2.

 

 

30fps is garbage. Console D2 is serviceable. Carry on.

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I just wanted to say, that there is something about Destiny 2 that makes it feel WAY smoother than any 30 fps game I've ever played. I don't know what it is or how Bungie does it but it literally doesn't even look like 30 fps.

 

That being said I usually can't stand 30fps and it's the reason I won't be playing Halo 3 bc. But Bungie worked some weird sorcery with D2.

 

 

30fps is garbage. Console D2 is serviceable. Carry on.

 

I would actually love to hear a technical explanation of this.  All i can think is that they got the frame-time so stable that it lines up perfectly with the refresh of the monitor/tv like a psuedo-frankensteinian g-sync/freesync.

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I just wanted to say, that there is something about Destiny 2 that makes it feel WAY smoother than any 30 fps game I've ever played. I don't know what it is or how Bungie does it but it literally doesn't even look like 30 fps.

 

That being said I usually can't stand 30fps and it's the reason I won't be playing Halo 3 bc. But Bungie worked some weird sorcery with D2.

 

 

30fps is garbage. Console D2 is serviceable. Carry on.

Fancy motion blur maybe? Much better aiming system than H5 probably is contributing to that too?

 

I would actually love to hear a technical explanation of this.  All i can think is that they got the frame-time so stable that it lines up perfectly with the refresh of the monitor/tv like a psuedo-frankensteinian g-sync/freesync.

Impossible unless the monitor itself is set to 30hz. The frametime will be 33.3 ms if it is a rock solid 30fps and will go higher with ANY dips in framerate.

 

The longer you play the less noticeable the 30fps will be obviously so I think that's what's happening here. I wish I had both so I could lock the PC version at 30 and go back and forth to see if there is a difference. With the beta I never tried that and never dipped below 100fps.

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Fancy motion blur maybe? Much better aiming system than H5 probably is contributing to that too?

 

Impossible unless the monitor itself is set to 30hz. The frametime will be 33.3 ms if it is a rock solid 30fps and will go higher with ANY dips in framerate.

 

The longer you play the less noticeable the 30fps will be obviously so I think that's what's happening here. I wish I had both so I could lock the PC version at 30 and go back and forth to see if there is a difference. With the beta I never tried that and never dipped below 100fps.

I promise you I'm not numb to the horrors of 30 fps. Every time I play BC Reach it catches me off guard. Every time I play horde in Gears 4 it catches me off guard. Something about D2 does NOT feel like a 30fps game and I remember feeling the same way about D1 when I first played it.

 

Some of the programmers at Treyarch were explaining to me some of Bungies tricks one time and they mentioned something about how the input rate is higher than the visual refresh rate or some jibberish like that. Might have something to do with it, or I might sound like an idiot. Who knows. All I know is that if you play D2 on console you'll see what I mean.

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I honestly think when devs say they are targeting 30fps, they still get a lot of dips below 30. Could just be that Bungie nailed D2 to the wall at 30 and it never dips. Dips are the most noticeable part especially at those low frame rates.

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Fancy motion blur maybe? Much better aiming system than H5 probably is contributing to that too?

 

Impossible unless the monitor itself is set to 30hz. The frametime will be 33.3 ms if it is a rock solid 30fps and will go higher with ANY dips in framerate.

 

The longer you play the less noticeable the 30fps will be obviously so I think that's what's happening here. I wish I had both so I could lock the PC version at 30 and go back and forth to see if there is a difference. With the beta I never tried that and never dipped below 100fps.

 

I mean every-other refresh is getting a new frame exactly every time instead of sometimes 2 in a row and simetimes it skips 2.    I doubt it, just guessing wildly lol.

 

Is the OneX going to have FreeSync?

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I promise you I'm not numb to the horrors of 30 fps. Every time I play BC Reach it catches me off guard. Every time I play horde in Gears 4 it catches me off guard. Something about D2 does NOT feel like a 30fps game and I remember feeling the same way about D1 when I first played it.

 

Some of the programmers at Treyarch were explaining to me some of Bungies tricks one time and they mentioned something about how the input rate is higher than the visual refresh rate or some jibberish like that. Might have something to do with it, or I might sound like an idiot. Who knows. All I know is that if you play D2 on console you'll see what I mean.

Ask some programmers there if they think Destiny 2 should be able to run D2 at 60fps on the Xbox One X. I suspect it could, only they won't allow only one console to get 60fps while the others can't. I mean, I was getting 140+ FPS at 1440p FFS. Granted, it's a powerful PC but the power of the Xbox One X is no joke either.

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Is the OneX going to have FreeSync?

Nope. Consoles use vsync anyway, freesync is only really beneficial if your fps is fluctuating.

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Ask some programmers there if they think Destiny 2 should be able to run D2 at 60fps on the Xbox One X. I suspect it could, only they won't allow only one console to get 60fps while the others can't. I mean, I was getting 140+ FPS at 1440p FFS. Granted, it's a powerful PC but the power of the Xbox One X is no joke either.

 

Even i can get 60 on my PC with settings set to High and i only have an R9 380.

 

Interestingly, turning down the settings wasn't giving me any higher framerate.  I need an upgrade.

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Ask some programmers there if they think Destiny 2 should be able to run D2 at 60fps on the Xbox One X. I suspect it could, only they won't allow only one console to get 60fps while the others can't. I mean, I was getting 140+ FPS at 1440p FFS. Granted, it's a powerful PC but the power of the Xbox One X is no joke either.

Most comments pin the still-shitty jaguar cpu in the One X as the problem for performance drops (and the jaguar cpu is REALLY shitty). Things like having multiple AI on screen are more intensive for cpu calculations than it is strenuous on the gpu for drawing triangles.

 

The discrepancy between the pretty good gpu and the dog shit cpu in the One X is going to bottle neck it more than people realize I think. Most it's going to do is throw in pretty particle effects and upres all textures (my prediction). Things like frame rate tend to lean towards the computational side unfortunately for us and Destiny. It's not unheard of to have the gpu take some work load and makeshift compute some data when the cpu bottlenecks but I think it requires some fancy programming, would have to ask someone more knowledgeable than I.

 

 

To answer your question....I don't know. Part of me thinks Bungie didn't want discrepancy between platforms, part of me thinks that D2 is sitting petty at 30 and any bump in performance would require unreasonable cuts to very core elements of the game.

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I just wanted to say, that there is something about Destiny 2 that makes it feel WAY smoother than any 30 fps game I've ever played. I don't know what it is or how Bungie does it but it literally doesn't even look like 30 fps.

 

That being said I usually can't stand 30fps and it's the reason I won't be playing Halo 3 bc. But Bungie worked some weird sorcery with D2.

 

 

30fps is garbage. Console D2 is serviceable. Carry on.

I bet the input polling is much higher than 30hz, which would have the effective response time feel shorter. The game can start acting on your intentions before the frame updates.

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To answer your question....I don't know. Part of me thinks Bungie didn't want discrepancy between platforms, part of me thinks that D2 is sitting petty at 30 and any bump in performance would require unreasonable cuts to very core elements of the game.

 

Bungie specifically said they wanted no framerate difference cross platforms when answering questions at E3, I think.

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Whoa, whoa, whoa, let's calm down with the torture methods here. We can be civil too.

 

Oh, we're talking about torture methods?

 

My coworker insists on talking to me about Destiny 2. He knows I hate Destiny. I've told him repeatedly that I will never play it. You would think the complete lack of interest I show with my body language when he is talking about it would clue him in. Or maybe the utter lack of response I give him when he stops talking. But he keeps doing it, day after day. He tells me how it's so much better than Destiny 1 (it isn't), and how Bungie really listens to their fans (they don't), and how he swears Activision isn't going to rape him this time as a 'thank you' for preordering. He's heard me explain at length why I think they're a horrible publisher, and how anyone that supports Destiny or Activision is essentially completely complicit with getting consumer-fucked, and that he's completely okay with Activision doing the absolute bare minimum for his money, and that they don't respect him. But day after day, this simpleton greets me with all his latest exploits in a game I have never and will never play.

 

I know he's not trolling me bc he's too dim to pull that off. It's like working with gamer-Forest Gump.

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Oh, we're talking about torture methods?

 

My coworker insists on talking to me about Destiny 2. He knows I hate Destiny. I've told him repeatedly that I will never play it. You would think the complete lack of interest I show with my body language when he is talking about it would clue him in. Or maybe the utter lack of response I give him when he stops talking. But he keeps doing it, day after day. He tells me how it's so much better than Destiny 1 (it isn't), and how Bungie really listens to their fans (they don't), and how he swears Activision isn't going to rape him this time as a 'thank you' for preordering. He's heard me explain at length why I think they're a horrible publisher, and how anyone that supports Destiny or Activision is essentially completely complicit with getting consumer-fucked, and that he's completely okay with Activision doing the absolute bare minimum for his money, and that they don't respect him. But day after day, this simpleton greets me with all his latest exploits in a game I have never and will never play.

 

I know he's not trolling me bc he's too dim to pull that off. It's like working with gamer-Forest Gump.

Can just feel the honeymoon period exuding from your description of him.

 

But for realzies, it's the bestest game ever, you know. I love consumable cosmetics. 

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