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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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Thoughts on Empire Sniper?

I only got to play one match on Empire, but I enjoyed it. It seems fitting to have a precision weapon there rather than an explosive for 2's. The match I played was fun using it to pin enemies back in the tower. I could see it getting stally if the team tower side has a lead and the shotty. More playing is needed, but there are some nice sightlines on that map that make sniping interesting.

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Okay child, listen closely.

 

I asked for his alts names because checking who he was playing against and the previous ranks of his alts would give some more insight as to WHY this issue occurs. By knowing how and why lower accounts can match Champ/Onyx, you can write a constructive, detailed post explaining EXACTLY how to break and abuse the ranking system for personal gain.

 

I've compiled more data than I would like to admit on the H5 ranking system in an effort to reverse engineer the placement parameters and explain some of the weird stuff that inherently goes on with the ranking system. I've made posts on why certain facets of the ranking system don't sit well with me (party restrictions for one, like everyone else in here), and discussed it at length with all sorts of players from Gold to Champ.

 

So yeah, you got me man. I'm trying to see if what happened to Beast agrees with a theory I have regarding placements/early season. Fuck me right?

 

Are you one of Rainn Wilson's characters or something?

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Well I guess it must be skillful now that it has a name

 

It's had a name for awhile.

 

This was more luck than anything else. Some people using this purposefully would actually be amazing, but it would probably be way too inconsistent. Still, people like OfficeHyena did things that no one thought was practical just because, look at some of the shit he pulled off.

 

But here, go try hitting the thrust bump off of your sub at the start of the game on Fathom to top mid to snag camo. Let me know how it goes.

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It's had a name for awhile.

 

This was more luck than anything else. Some people using this purposefully would actually be amazing, but it would probably be way too inconsistent. Still, people like OfficeHyena did things that no one thought was practical just because, look at some of the shit he pulled off.

 

But here, go try hitting the thrust bump off of your sub at the start of the game on Fathom to top mid to snag camo. Let me know how it goes.

Without practice I can do this somewhat consistently. The thrust bump to camo.

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@@Devaneaux, did you ever write up about why Thruster is a good mechanic? I remember you posting about it not too long ago, and I'm actually interested in reading it.

 

Sadly, no man. I've had a ton of shit come up going into this next semester that I've had to take care of. I wanted to write a really detailed post, with multiple situational examples and the sort, but I don't have any graphic design skills nor do I know whether a video or a post would be a better medium to discuss this topic. 

 

My shitty laptop prevents me from recording myself too. So I'm technologically held back from creating the type of content that I would like to create in this case.

 

The idea would be to not try directly convincing people that don't like Thrust to approve of it, rather it would be to dispel a bunch of myths and misconceptions regarding thrust. It would be more to lay out the facts and uses of thrusts in certain situations and how these situations with thrust have significantly deeper mindgames than said situations without thrust.

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Won 9/10 of my placement games, every game went positive, even the one we lost. Got Plat 1 holylmao

 

Teammate that was with me all 10 games and consistently went negative, got Plat 4. I remember this happening in the beta as well.

 

Also get ready for atrocious maps to be pushed into the 4v4 playlists.

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Without practice I can do this somewhat consistently. The thrust bump to camo.

 

Then it's a skill yes? Unless you can do it 5/5 times in practice, then execute it in a heated situation like in a match with good players, you still have to practice it and learn how to work thrust bumps with all sorts of geometry. Not only that, but a thrust bump takes you to an advantageous position and then puts you there without  thrust. Now you're at a disadvantage against anyone near or at that location for a short period of time. High Risk/High Reward.

 

Now go try thrust bumping to s3 from basement on Coliseum. Or Thrust Bump off of Splinter Box to Mid Cat/White Corner to contest camo and sniper from a different angle. All of these require specific timing and execution so this skill that was learned now requires you to be flexible as well. Learning. Growth. Personal improvement. That last one being particularly satisfying for a series/game that has more than enough "what now?" moments when it comes to trying to improve.

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Are you one of Rainn Wilson's characters or something?

 

Here, this is the actual proper response you should have gone with. 

 

giphy.gif

 

Had to bring a little HCS thread to this place eventually.

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I think the answer depends on whether or not they are paid. Oh and I love the "advertisement" bit, as if pros have ever been a selling point for a game.

Umm... They are paid, and it is part of the advertising. It's a selling point to tell hardcore competitive fans that your Esports driven game has been playtested before release by the best players in the world as it gives more faith and confidence in general.

 

Little did we know the pro team had practically no influence on the design decisions except the worst one that makes the game unplayable (the aiming).

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I miss the color purple in Halo.

Ok, @.

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Then it's a skill yes? Unless you can do it 5/5 times in practice, then execute it in a heated situation like in a match with good players, you still have to practice it and learn how to work thrust bumps with all sorts of geometry. Not only that, but a thrust bump takes you to an advantageous position and then puts you there without  thrust. Now you're at a disadvantage against anyone near or at that location for a short period of time. High Risk/High Reward.

 

Now go try thrust bumping to s3 from basement on Coliseum. Or Thrust Bump off of Splinter Box to Mid Cat/White Corner to contest camo and sniper from a different angle. All of these require specific timing and execution so this skill that was learned now requires you to be flexible as well. Learning. Growth. Personal improvement. That last one being particularly satisfying for a series/game that has more than enough "what now?" moments when it comes to trying to improve.

basement to s3 is also something I can do with minimal practice. And when I say 'practice' I mean in the middle of a match. These are just ways to exploit bad mechanics and pass it off as a skill. Nothing screams skill to me about running/jumping/whatever into something and pressing 'x'

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basement to s3 is also something I can do with minimal practice. And when I say 'practice' I mean in the middle of a match. These are just ways to exploit bad mechanics and pass it off as a skill. Nothing screams skill to me about running/jumping/whatever into something and pressing 'x'

Difficulty does NOT equate skill.

 

Look at strafing. It's incredibly easy to learn, it's very effective, and it has a multitude of differing methods, but that doesn't mean that it isn't skillful. The skill in strafing is using the appropriate type for the appropriate situation. Dodging, aiming, zoning, etc.

 

Yet by your logic, strafing must be a bad mechanic because all it is is "wiggling a stick".

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Difficulty does NOT equate skill.

 

Look at strafing. It's incredibly easy to learn, it's very effective, and it has a multitude of differing methods, but that doesn't mean that it isn't skillful. The skill in strafing is using the appropriate type for the appropriate situation. Dodging, aiming, zoning, etc.

 

Yet by your logic, strafing must be a bad mechanic because all it is is "wiggling a stick".

Easy to learn, and difficult to master are two different things though. Anyone can strafe, but not everyone has a masterful strafe. Thrust bumps are easy to somewhat challenging to learn, but once you know them, there is not much more to go on afterwards. I'll concede and say that certain thrust bumps (Really Only the ones on Regret) can be mastered in different ways. But, it's still easy to learn decently easy to master. Sure it adds mobility options, but when did Halo ever need the ability to launch yourself into the air in order to make maps better? In fact, in the Coli argument it just adds MORE routes to get to snipe side of the map, making it that much harder to control the area.

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Ok, @.

;)

I miss the color purple in Halo.

I feel you, bro. If you wear armor that features a darker paint scheme, like many default sets, the darkest purple looks good, though.  Don't get why they altered colors like that. Ugh, so frustrating that every color under the sun is available, bar a good purple. Literally have two shades of white and the darkest black we've ever had, bar H3's black, alongside every team color, EXCEPT for purple. Ugh ugh ugh.

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God I hate 5v5.

 

Holy fuck Lemon stop playing MM and play good H5 with us in the Evolved lobbies lmao

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Holy fuck Lemon stop playing MM and play good H5 with us in the Evolved lobbies lmao

 

qxl3Pw8.png

 

IS THERE NO ONE ELSE, KILLMACHINE

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Easy to learn, and difficult to master are two different things though. Anyone can strafe, but not everyone has a masterful strafe. Thrust bumps are easy to somewhat challenging to learn, but once you know them, there is not much more to go on afterwards. I'll concede and say that certain thrust bumps (Really Only the ones on Regret) can be mastered in different ways. But, it's still easy to learn decently easy to master.

It doesn't matter whether 9% or 99% of the population can do something, what matters is how it's used and when it's used. Thumbless Timmy may be able to thrust bump like an MLG champ, but if he's solo launching into controlled enemy territory like an idiot, that doesn't make him a master at it.

 

Someone who can use every single strafe flawlessly but is terrible at picking the right one isn't a master strafer, he's just a dude who knows his strafes. Likewise, someone who knows every thrust bump but gets murdered every time he uses it because he doesn't have situational awareness isn't a master thrust bumper, he's just a guy who knows his thrust bumps.

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It doesn't matter whether 9% or 99% of the population can do something, what matters is how it's used and when it's used. Thumbless Timmy may be able to thrust bump like an MLG champ, but if he's solo launching into controlled enemy territory like an idiot, that doesn't make him a master at it.

 

Someone who can use every single strafe flawlessly but is terrible at picking the right one isn't a master strafer, he's just a dude who knows his strafes. Likewise, someone who knows every thrust bump but gets murdered every time he uses it because he doesn't have situational awareness isn't a master thrust bumper, he's just a guy who knows his thrust bumps.

That's a self fulfilling statement. What your saying is someone who learns it won't be a master, unless they grind the game super hard. But that applies to everything in every competitive game, ever. If someone wanted to become a 'master thrust bumper' they'd have to have a general understanding of where the enemy is, and what is currently happening in a match. If someone wanted to become a 'master strafer' they'd have to know where the enemy is so they don't open themselves to team shot by strafing into it, where they are on the map in relation to teammates so they can get help, what cover is nearby that they can use to supplement their strafe, and the same with any ways to change elevation.

 

Thrust bumping in the new term for using different routes to flank and engage an enemy. While it may increase the speed at which a team can collapse on someone, it also can lead to a decrease in need said map awareness you were mentioning before because a player can either get help, or get to a spot where they need to be in order to help their teammate in a fashion that was not originally intended. This also adds to randomness which makes isolating an opponent that much more difficult because even if Jimmy No Thumbs has no idea whats happening when he thrust bumps somewhere, he ultimately changes a battle he would've never influenced before in a game that took skill full movement, and turned a large portion of it into pressing 'x' as you hit a piece of geometry.

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I have played on 3 separate alts and each of them were never past diamond. I think 1 might have even been plat. 2 of them only placed diamond in 1 season. All 3 match champions and high onyx players every game. Whatever was adjusted COMPLETELY isn't working. I want to mention population but I'll just get a "highest retention since H3" responses (although that would mean that it's just the ranking system being completely broken which is honestly worse). I was thinking maybe it was just one alt had high MMR but all 3 match champs. I don't get it man I just want to play people close to my rank. I may as well be given a Champion rank seeing as I always play them.

 

So, @anyone from 343 there are 2 options. Either enforce tighter matchmaking, or add party restrictions (ideally both). Having neither of these things is turning soooooo many people away from Arena. But I don't have to tell you that. You can see all the numbers. Plz fix.

Yeh, I agree completely, I played my 10 placement matches, won 9 (I did relatively well) and lost 1 (Against 2 onyx and 2 Champions) and got put in Platinum, because of this I really don't want to play as I'm not playing against many people of my skill.

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