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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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But Halo 3 was far from stellar from anything outside of the feature set.

 

Beautiful gems like Isolation, Snowbound, a terrible utility weapon, bad sandbox, terrible online connection, etc. I'd actually agree that H3 is one of the most refined games I've ever played in terms of features, so its hard to argue against it, but then there are the things that H5 does that H3 doesn't.

 

60FPS, Stellar online connection (dedicated servers), better ranking system by miles, better playlist management, Warzone is more innovative for Halo than anything Halo 3 attempted (outside of Forge, which was just user-innovation), better competitive custom game options, better maps, better weapon layouts/sandbox, Spectator Mode (albeit weak, is still present), etc.

This is all true...

 

But the most important thing to me in Halo is the community. Without a community, Halo is nothing. It WAS nothing for 2-3 years when H4 and MCC dropped bombs on us. Even Reach made us lose people; the forge and custom and stupid clans saved that game.

 

Halo 3 had features that made the community FLOURISH. Halo 5 doesn't. THAT'S the distinction. At launch, it's most important day ever, it was half a game. The player population / twitch numbers / actual active discussions about this game make it clear we lost A LOT of people. This would not have been the case had the features been there at launch.

 

I argue for competitive settings because I want a game ALL community members can enjoy, casual or competitive. The community is the single most important thing to me, and lack of content is killing it.

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Okay so now we're shifting the argument to anecdotal opinions, so I'm out.

 

Clarify whether you believe it is universally unacceptable or whether it is what you deem as unacceptable.

 

I'm trying to explain why there are certain things that should NOT be complained about, but there are things that I deem unacceptable. The only difference is that I don't state those thoughts as if they are law.

Obviously I can only speak for myself. Sorry if you ever thought I was doing more than that.

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actually I changed my mind these missing gametypes are preposterous. 

 

Anyone want to hop on H3 for some Isolation VIP?

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Halo 3 is regarded as the epitome of Halo's art design, what are you talking about? And the resolution wasn't even DISCOVERED until well into Halo 3's life.

 

The frame rate issues only came up when people started going crazy in Forge.

We're not talking about art lemon... Don't shift your argument. If that's the case I've openly stated H3 to be the peak in Halos art style.

 

The resolution was discovered at launch. It wasn't widely known until digital foundry put out on an article but it was definitely known before then from several major pixel counters/news sites who picked it up before DF did.

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I'd take 30fps Halo 5 if it meant split screen was included and all staple features at launch.

I'd rather we keep 60FPS for single screen gameplay and re-work the engine so split-screen runs at a locked 30FPS. I think Mario Kart did this? 

 

To my understanding, H2A relied on 60FPS so everything ran swimmingly. On some maps, frame rate drops would actually slow down the in-game timer and allow for multi-kills to have longer time between kills. I imagine Halo 5 is similar in that regard and by the time they realized they couldn't get a locked 60 in split-screen, they had to cut it entirely. 

 

I have no doubt that it will be back in Halo 6 (or if anything comes before then).

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I know I've heard Heytred on stream saying the exact same things Infinity is saying now. Funny how that works. 

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actually I changed my mind these missing gametypes are preposterous. 

 

Anyone want to hop on H3 for some Isolation VIP?

Ah c'mon, we had one shitty gametype out of the 8 other awesome ones.

 

Besides, Protect The President was one of the most fun custom games I've played in Halo.

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What the fucking fuck is wrong with 343? Well, I mean it's not like I expected them to do a good job with it.. Can't say I'm overly disappointed. Is it at least a 3sk?

Yeah, it's a 3SK.

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Ah c'mon, we had one shitty gametype out of the 8 other awesome ones.

 

Besides, Protect The President was one of the most fun custom games I've played in Halo.

 

 

Haha I agree, I wish H5 had the potential for better Custom Game options, but designing an Arena gametype around that isn't worth it. That's why I am very unhappy with the timeframe for Infection's release.

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I'd rather we keep 60FPS for single screen gameplay and re-work the engine so split-screen runs at a locked 30FPS. I think Mario Kart did this?

 

To my understanding, H2A relied on 60FPS so everything ran swimmingly. On some maps, frame rate drops would actually slow down the in-game timer and allow for multi-kills to have longer time between kills. I imagine Halo 5 is similar in that regard and by the time they realized they couldn't get a locked 60 in split-screen, they had to cut it entirely.

 

I have no doubt that it will be back in Halo 6 (or if anything comes before then).

That would have been better. Sacrifice visuals only for split screen play and keep 60fps for single. I don't get why they didn't go through with that option.

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better playlist management, Warzone is more innovative for Halo than anything Halo 3 attempted (outside of Forge, which was just user-innovation), better competitive custom game options, better maps, better weapon layouts/sandbox, Spectator Mode (albeit weak, is still present), etc.

Better playlist management? Lol. Sure if we're only into hardcore competitive gametypes. Everyone else got fucked with the release of H5 unless you reallyyyy love Warzone or Breakout. So basically anyone who's all time favorite playlist isn't the competitive playlist, TS or SWAT would disagree with that.

 

I can't think of a single thing about warzone that is innovative. Maybe if you restrict your view of gaming to just Halo you could begin to argue that but its subjective as well as pointless. I feel theater and the massive custom game options that came with H3 are leagues beyond warzone in that sense along with forge as you mentioned.

 

We don't even use those options.

 

Subjective.

 

Subjective.

 

Subjective.

 

???

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Interesting. A 3sk lottery cannon? It must feel just like H1 MCC :kappa:

I believe you can actually get a 3SK from hitting a certain part of the back. I have yet to use it on Recurve but in Warzone the Halo CE Pistol is insanely easy (but fun). 

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That would have been better. Sacrifice visuals only for split screen play and keep 60fps for single. I don't get why they didn't go through with that option.

Likely because the engine requires 60FPS for whatever reason. If H2A is any evidence, it looks like it does.

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I honestly believe that the grunts at 343 are hard working, talented people..But the management is absolutely horrendous. Broken games at lunch, half completed sequels, questionable playlist management. It's very apparent that 343 has horrible management that can't fulfill deadlines or have proper quality assurance. Also the people that are making the calls are just out of touch with halo in general. Case and point the hitscan/bloom CE pistol, and the baffling creation of breakout..anyone who played even a single halo game knows elimination game types were not only already made but proven not to work well.

 

It's just a fact that 343 isn't good at delivering games, especially compared to studios like CD Project Red, Valve, and Riot games.

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Better playlist management? Lol. Sure if we're only into hardcore competitive gametypes. Everyone else got fucked with the release of H5 unless you reallyyyy love Warzone or Breakout. So basically anyone who's all time favorite playlist isn't the competitive playlist, TS or SWAT would disagree with that.

 

I can't think of a single thing about warzone that is innovative. Maybe if you restrict your view of gaming to just Halo you could begin to argue that but its subjective as well as pointless. I feel theater and the massive custom game options that came with H3 are leagues beyond warzone in that sense along with forge as you mentioned.

 

We don't even use those options.

 

Subjective.

 

Subjective.

 

Subjective.

 

???

 

 

What? Halo 5's playlist management is great. Your issue might be with lack of gametypes but for what we have they did a stellar job.

 

Yes, I was referring to innovating Halo exclusively. I know it draws aspects from tons of other games but Halo 3 didn't really pull out anything unique other than Forge/Theater, but those are outside of gameplay. I agree with Halo 3 having stellar innovative features.

 

But they are available to us, they were never available in previous games. And plenty of niche groups (Gold Pro) use them and can create a Halo 5 in their vision.

 

I'd say that weapon layouts aren't very subjective in terms of map balance. You can argue the sandbox is worse because of the approach it takes to weapon viability, but H3 did not have a good sandbox balance in the slightest. Maps are subjective, yup.

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I believe you can actually get a 3SK from hitting a certain part of the back. I have yet to use it on Recurve but in Warzone the Halo CE Pistol is insanely easy (but fun). 

 

Nice. I can't believe a small part of me thought that they would actually keep it functionally similar to the original. They're doing a great job at reaffirming my cynicism towards them. 

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We're not talking about art lemon... Don't shift your argument. If that's the case I've openly stated H3 to be the peak in Halos art style.

 

The resolution was discovered at launch. It wasn't widely known until digital foundry put out on an article but it was definitely known before then from several major pixel counters/news sites who picked it up before DF did.

 

"Visuals" =! art? Okay, fine.

 

How can you say that it was widely criticized if people didn't even widely know it was a thing until someone put out the technical details to confirm it?

 

Regardless, are you really going to try to claim that the backlash over the sub-HD resolution is in any way, shape, or form even remotely close to the backlash over no split screen? 

 

I'd rather we keep 60FPS for single screen gameplay and re-work the engine so split-screen runs at a locked 30FPS. I think Mario Kart did this?

 

We don't take kindly to reasonable compromise around these parts, mister.

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30fps was acceptable but it had a hard time staying at a consistent 30. I agree with you though, the missing content was rough, even if we got one of the only locked 60fps on the market right now,

I'm not disagreeing with you. I agree with the missing content I just don't know why people seem to forget halo 3 was a technical mess.

I think it more than compensated with its art style, I also doubt that the complaint over the resolution was as widespread as the lack of many staple features.

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I'd say that weapon layouts aren't very subjective in terms of map balance. You can argue the sandbox is worse because of the approach it takes to weapon viability, but H3 did not have a good sandbox balance in the slightest. Maps are subjective, yup.

I feel like the only aspect that H5 really does better as far as the sandbox goes is the H5 pistol vs the H3 BR and the OS. Everything else doesn't quite sit as well with me. The automatics being more viable is a good thing but they're too viable in H5 for my taste. The camo is pretty poor in H5 at times. The snipe is just way too easy to use which is a big deal, imo, for the competitive side of things. What it really comes down to is I think that every gun in the entire game outside of the H5 pistol and the rockets are probably too effective for how easy they are to use. It sounds weird to say when I like the game with the fastest kill times the most but there has to be a better skill/damage ratio for it to actually work out. Not that H5 isn't good as it is it could just be much better.

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Likely because the engine requires 60FPS for whatever reason. If H2A is any evidence, it looks like it does.

Frankie SAID it required 60fps. We discovered that was bullshit when the e3 showing of h5 routinely dropped to 40fps and time didn't slow down. I'm willing to bet they could've made it 30fps split screen if they wanted.

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