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CyReN

Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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"Variety"

 

"Large sandbox"

 

Just some terms people throw around to justify these sorts of nonsensical changes.

 

 

The huge sandbox is just carried over from Halo 4, where 343 decided to play it ridiculously safe in terms of fan service and include all weapons from all previous Halo games (BR + DMR + everything else) instead of taking a risk on their own weapon sandbox; then when adding Promethean weapons, they STILL played it safe and just made reskinned versions of all the old Halo weapons with slight differences (binary rifle = one-shot sniper, boltshot = mauler, LR = DMR, suppressor = AR, incineration cannon = rockets, etc.).  This also explains why the Covenant were shoehorned into the H4 campaign despite it being a completely new story that did not require the Covenant in any way.

 

Anyway, H5 at least managed to differentiate the sandbox somewhat; storm rifle and scattershot are legitimately different now, etc.  But I think the redundant sandbox can be explained by H4

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It's only a problem if the maps are littered with them.

 

I'm not gonna put 2 SMGs, 2 Storm Rifles, and a Shotgun all on a single map (Empire, if you're wondering). It's gonna be 2 SMGs, ​or 2 Storm Rifles, or one Shotgun.

 

Same with the precision rifles. When I don't want a Sniper Rifle, I'll stick in one or more DMRs ​or Light Rifles.

 

But you just said that all of those weapons have a place, specifically regarding taking advantage of sight-lines. If you limit their availability, you're basically saying that only one or two people will have the ability to take advantage of features that the map you create is designed around. This isn't a criticism of you, it's a criticism of our starting weapon.

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I don't know where you've been but people have been saying why it's not fun since launch

What? I was just giving an example

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"I like CE because it's fun."

 

Are you convinced yet?

That statement convinces me that you find the game fun.

 

Regardless, that wasn't the context of your statement, was it lemon?

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"I like CE because it's fun."

 

Are you convinced yet?

Most people are not going to write a novel every time they make a post.

 

Its not like 343 guys are going to come here and say "well shit, that cooper guy wasn't very clear about why he has issues with game in that post. Now we have no idea what any of the issues teambeyond has with the game".

 

There are roughly 8.4 million other posts detailing the issues.

 

Calm your titties

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And this is exactly what I was talking about.

 

You've got a dozen players (probably more due to quitters) being spawn camped for minutes at a time with the inability to quit.

 

343, please tell me how you plan on keeping casual gamers around with this mode?

 

At least if both teams had access to the same weapons the score wouldn't be so one sided, but instead you've got a bunch of pro players spawning the weapons they want when they want them while the losing team is scrambling just to get Mongoose so they can escape the tanks sitting at the entrance of their base.

 

REQ cards just allow good players to snowball into monster players.

 

I don't see how the REQ system is any better than the ordnance drops from The 4. In fact, it's even worse. At least The 4 didn't allow you to summon a tank whenever you felt like it.

I think any game mode is going to have issues if full parties are paired up against a bunch of singletons. Goes for 4v4 Arena too.

In our case, our group was far from pros, and we didn't use many REQs at all... Most of these matches we didn't even have time to get above 3/4 Energy before we ended it. At best, we'd call in a Ghost Ultra to finish the core, but we were typically rolling with Loadout weapons throughout. Maybe some Uncommon FRCs or Railguns here or there. We weren't spawn camping, we were just rushing hard for a Core Destruction victory.

 

I have had games where we get dominated but the opposing team decides to spawn-camp our base and completely ignore the Core, using tons of REQs as they drag the game out just to pad their K/D. Those are worse IMO, but I'm not sure what the fix is. That's been an issue since Big Team Battle had Objective games in H2 online.

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But you just said that all of those weapons have a place, specifically regarding taking advantage of sight-lines. If you limit their availability, you're basically saying that only one or two people will have the ability to take advantage of features that the map you create is designed around. This isn't a criticism of you, it's a criticism of our starting weapon.

That's exactly the point of a pickup weapon. There shouldn't be enough for everyone, encouraging players to rotate and acquire them.

 

A person that grabs rockets is better off than someone who doesn't. A person who has shotgun is stronger in CQC than someone stuck with starting weapons. Someone with a Light Rifle can better control a sightline than someone without one.

 

Think of the DMR and the Light Rifle as substitutes for the Sniper Rifle that fulfill a similar purpose, controlling areas and dominating long ranged combat.

 

Likewise, the SMG and Storm Rifles are substitutes for the Shotgun, being close ranged power.

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Is it too ridiculous to say the sandbox would be fine in h5 if the pistol was a 4sk?

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Is it too ridiculous to say the sandbox would be fine in h5 if the pistol was a 4sk?

 

nope. I would enjoy a 4sk pistol right now.

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nope. I would enjoy a 4sk pistol right now.

Well, I'm glad I'm not alone.

 

I feel a lot of the issues would be much less severe (or gone) with an actual, good utility weapon.

 

You'd still have your rifles for other situations. If your shot sucks you MIGHT be able to hold your own with the br or dmr, plus it would be a bit easier to hit long range shots.

 

As far as autos, you should definitely be able to win battles against them at all ranges with a 4sk pistol unless your positioning and map movement is garbage.

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Is it too ridiculous to say the sandbox would be fine in h5 if the pistol was a 4sk?

The game would be soooooo much better.

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Haven't looked at this thread for a while, so no idea what the reaction to the patch news was, but I think it's an awesome update.

Excited for aiming updates, new maps, good REQs that I actually want, a fix to the fucking unreal Warzone Assault glitch, a new season, forge finally, CSR tweaks, 6 player FFA, and UI updates.

It's looking like the game we should have got when it shipped. Just hope the aiming tweaks are extensive, and the CSR system is tighter.

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so like there's obviously a lot of flaws with halo 5, like missing game modes, file share, and forge

 

but uhhh

 

yo this game is a lot of fun in both arena and warzone

 

i don't know maybe i'm a dumb casual but i'm having fun trying to get better in arena and i'm having fun dicking around in warzone and I've been playing halo since CE so

 

I don't know man

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So will there be something special happening during 343 day?

something ends up not getting done.

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Haven't seen any follow up to the update post on Waypoint yet but has there been any word on new gametypes coming with forge? Seems a bit pointless without gametypes such as KOTH, Race and Infection 

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That's exactly the point of a pickup weapon. There shouldn't be enough for everyone, encouraging players to rotate and acquire them.

 

A person that grabs rockets is better off than someone who doesn't. A person who has shotgun is stronger in CQC than someone stuck with starting weapons. Someone with a Light Rifle can better control a sightline than someone without one.

 

Think of the DMR and the Light Rifle as substitutes for the Sniper Rifle that fulfill a similar purpose, controlling areas and dominating long ranged combat.

 

Likewise, the SMG and Storm Rifles are substitutes for the Shotgun, being close ranged power.

 

The point of a pickup weapon should be to provide a player with an advantage in certain situations, not all situations; to compliment a player's choice of play style. The issue is that those "alternatives" are not strong enough to incentivize map movement. No one is going to give up position to risk grabbing a DMR that's across the map. However, the Halo 5 pistol is not strong enough to compete with those pickups, and that's bad; the issue with current settings isn't the proliferation of automatics and rifles, it's that the starting weapons can't compete with them on a skill-adjusted basis.

 

Look at the BR in breakout, which is basically what you're moving towards. One player gets a sizable advantage simply by virtue of where they spawn, but if you put one in the middle of the map, it's not going to engender a mid-map power struggle. It's not strong enough to compensate for the additional risk of obtaining it. It's not a power weapon, it's just a better utility weapon. The DMR or Lightrifle are not substitute for the Sniper rifle, they are just better alternatives than the starting weapon. A sniper rifle isn't a utility weapon, it's a long-range sniper rifle that is difficult to use in many situations. That's a critical distinction.

 

A player should not be dominated at any range simply by virtue of what weapon each party is holding. There should be advantages, but not insurmountable ones. Your solution of scarcity will simply add a slightly more controllable element to games, it won't fix the underlying issue that players are spawning with a weapon that is too weak compared to every other weapon in the sandbox.

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How do you guys avoid getting 343bola when visiting waypoint or r/halo?

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