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CyReN

Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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I feel like a dick being short considering the amount you wrote OP. At the end of the day I have friends and roommates are some of the worst Halo players I've seen in years. You know, struggle to get 1 kill in a game. However they play through the beatings and have fun. With Halo 5 having no real social outside of Warzone it puts me in that awkward position. 

 

Nope, you're good. This was just a combination of my rambles in threads over the past few days. I'm in a similar situation with people who I would rather not be playing on my Ranked account.

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Yeah, ranked 4s, 2s and FFAs are really all that we ever needed. I mean what else? BtB? I don't know what compelled them to make everything ranked.

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Nope, you're good. This was just a combination of my rambles in threads over the past few days. I'm in a similar situation with people who I would rather not be playing on my Ranked account.

 

Even then not playing on a ranked account you're eventually going to carry them to a division above them. When that happens you get to lose over and over again. Being a tryhard with friends is hard these days lol

 

I still don't really follow 343's choices in regards to the playlists. Obviously you don't want to dilute the population, but there are core gametypes that have been in the game for over 12 years. Why take them away now?

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I still don't really follow 343's choices in regards to the playlists. Obviously you don't want to dilute the population, but there are core gametypes that have been in the game for over 12 years. Why take them away now?

 

Core Social Playlists

Minimal Ranked Playlists

Fun and Engaging Weekend Playlists

 

Easy formula.

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Core Social Playlists

Minimal Ranked Playlists

Fun and Engaging Weekend Playlists

 

Easy formula.

Easy formula and we know it works. (Halo 3)

 

Great post Ryan!

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Core Social Playlists

Minimal Ranked Playlists

Fun and Engaging Weekend Playlists

 

Easy formula.

Speaking of ranked playlist. Isn't Strongholds like Halo 2 Territories, well partially. Why is it getting its own playlist? Why not lump Hill, CTF, Oddball, Strongholds and Assualt into Objective? Well, if those gametpyes are in the final.  

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Can't believe this guy is complaining about ranked playlists. If you want to warm up, there is Warzone or custom games. We're finally getting a good number of ranked playlists, something we haven't had since Halo 3 and you'd rather it be like Reach with one or two ranked playlists and everything else social. Screw you dude.

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Forge isn't the problem, the developers are the problem when they fuck shit up with crappy maps and horrible settings.

Do you honestly think Forge would kill H:CE? Naaaah.

 

I don't see why an entire community should be punished man. The community is divided because the game sucks man, just like what happened with Halo: Reach and Halo 4. Man, you give me a good default setting with good default maps and I can assure you... both the Casual and Competitive players will enjoy the game.

Bro, what are you even talking about?

 

CE (and to a lesser extent 2) if anything are good examples as to how great a halo game can be even without forge, you are not helping your position with that statement.

 

Then you say "I didn't see why an entire community should be punished", like are you being serious with that comment? Again, 343i are a fucking company, it doesn't punish people, it doesn't love people, it exists for one reason only and if you wonder what that is its in your wallet.

 

You are too quick to judgement my friend, instead of saying what your gut tells you to relax and think about it for a while.

 

I also want to say that this entire conversation is entirely theoretical, with no viable sources I would not entertain a possibility too much, I was just saying IF they did it how I would feel about it.

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Speaking of ranked playlist. Isn't Strongholds like Halo 2 Territories, well partially. Why is it getting its own playlist? Why not lump Hill, CTF, Oddball, Strongholds and Assualt into Objective? Well, if those gametpyes are in the final.  

 

1. A Strongholds exclusive playlist is not confirmed

2. Assault/Hill/Oddball are not confirmed to be in the game

3. Josh Holmes said it will be either Team Objective or CTF at launch

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Well let's have some counter arguments.

 

In halo 3, I noticed there were lots of people in social that were way above their rank level and some below their rank level in skill. Why is the major grade 4 better than me and I'm a general? It's not a big deal but it's just kind of weird. Every game being ranked would mean you will always be the correct rank unless you purposely derank.

 

Let's look at halo 3 again. Every ranked playlist is dead except when you are above rank 40. This forces people to play social. Also there are many people who just play social b/c they feel more comfortable with it. If every1 in the social playlist were suddenly forced to play ranked, all the rank brackets would be popular again. yeah 343 could just change to ranked only 2 years after release but I think they have another thing in their mind

 

I think 343 is trying to get more people to think of halo as a competitive game, not just a campaign game where you play the multiplayer for lulz. 

 

I personally think both systems are good.

 

I do agree on few ranked playlists. 

what needs to happen is for 4v4 to carry oddball, slayer, breakout, ctf, assault, koth, and extraction. No more split obj playlists.

Then we can have doubles

Then we can have ffa

 

Then we can have the rotational social playlist of swat/snipes/btb/actionsack/w/e

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I may have disagreed with you before, but you just changed my mind from a conceptual standpoint. I like what you're throwing out here. My main digression would be that Halo needs to first and foremost become a game of skill before ranks mean anything. I've struggled to care about ranks in Halo games because I feel that none of the games that feature rankings properly reward an individual player's contributions.  

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"Again, 343i are a fucking company, it doesn't punish people, it doesn't love people, it exists for one reason only and if you wonder what that is its in your wallet."

 

- Finally @@bluejay

 

I've been saying this since CE Anniversary failed to live up to CE

 

Your Halo died with Halo 3. Even the purists will admit this, no matter how utterly broken and scrubbish Halo 3 was.

 

The console mass prefers less competitive games because of comfort, ego and self-gratifying. Console gaming generally has moved from skill, rewards based on true merit, and fun, to low-effort braindead run & gun with rewards for everything, even dying. Even setting up a console is made to be as easy as all hell as apposed to building a PC for yourself and your specific needs (even tho PC is far more rewarding). 

 

 

This won't change because people love comfort more than anything else in the world. It's where the money is, and it's where console devs will aim for 100% of the time, disregarding you fools, because it's all about putting that food on the table.

 

Even with tournaments, none of you will gather enough people to warrant any console devs to cater to you guys. There's just too many casual players.

 

I strongly feel all you Halo vets should permanently move on. 

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Can't believe this guy is complaining about ranked playlists. If you want to warm up, there is Warzone or custom games. We're finally getting a good number of ranked playlists, something we haven't had since Halo 3 and you'd rather it be like Reach with one or two ranked playlists and everything else social. Screw you dude.

 

I'll ignore your blatant rudeness and passive aggressiveness (something we do ban for) because I love the thrill of a debate.

 

I'm not complaining, I'm delivering feedback. Feedback that a lot of people agree is extremely vital.

Responding to the bold: If you read my post, you'd know why Halo 3's numerous ranked playlists are a bad thing. Reach had the right idea with only one ranked playlist, but their system and game settings were completely misguided.

 

Screw me, though.

 

 

In halo 3, I noticed there were lots of people in social that were way above their rank level and some below their rank level in skill. Why is the major grade 4 better than me and I'm a general? It's not a big deal but it's just kind of weird. Every game being ranked would mean you will always be the correct rank unless you purposely derank.

 

Let's look at halo 3 again. Every ranked playlist is dead except when you are above rank 40. This forces people to play social. Also there are many people who just play social b/c they feel more comfortable with it. If every1 in the social playlist were suddenly forced to play ranked, all the rank brackets would be popular again. yeah 343 could just change to ranked only 2 years after release but I think they have another thing in their mind

 

I do agree on few ranked playlists. 

what needs to happen is for 4v4 to carry oddball, slayer, breakout, ctf, assault, koth, and extraction. No more split obj playlists.

Then we can have doubles

Then we can have ffa

 

Responding in order:

 

Decent counter arguments, but I think you are confused about Halo 3's system. "Ranks" in Social Playlists (Major, Commander, General Grade 5, etc.) are NOT ranks. They are progression systems that reward wins. It does not take into trueskill when deducting or adding XP. However, the 1-50s did take TrueSkill into account.

 

As for population, the reason the H3 Ranked playlists were dead before 40 is because of how many there were. If you put everyone playing Ranked into one list, the skill levels are dispersed and each skill level has a healthier population.

 

And yep, a 4v4 Ranked Playlist would be mixed TS/Objective. Whatever they decide to play in HCS.

 

I may have disagreed with you before, but you just changed my mind from a conceptual standpoint. I like what you're throwing out here. My main digression would be that Halo needs to first and foremost become a game of skill before ranks mean anything. I've struggled to care about ranks in Halo games because I feel that none of the games that feature rankings properly reward an individual player's contributions.  

 

 

I understand that logic, but popular systems have proved that a Win/Loss-only based system is more effective at ranking players. People won't stat pad in Objective modes, etc. If you Win then its likely that most people were contributing to the team. Of course, this might not be the case for Team Slayer but that is a whole different debate, because Team Slayer really doesn't belong in HCS/eSports play.

 

Glad you understood where I was coming from though.

 

----

 

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give up, move on.

NO.

 

you can move on though if you wish, you decision is your own just as mine is.

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Wonderful post man.  I agree completely.  The only thing I would add is a playlist specific XP rank, to give me a reason to grind any unranked playlists.  That was one of my favorite things about Halo 3, and MCC sorely needs it for its unranked playlists.  Games just feel empty and meaningless without something to play for.  If its not going to be a rank (and that's fine), at least let us fight over that XP point for the win.  Otherwise people like me feel like they have no reason at all to play that playlist.

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NO.

 

you can move on though if you wish, you decision is your own just as mine is.

 

Yea but by not moving on, and instead continuing to talk/buy their products up, you are contributing to their crappy practices. And pretty much the detriment of gaming as a whole. You reward their incompetence (can we even call it that? They know what to do and how to do it. they just choose not because $$$$) and promote more devs to follow their strategy & practice.

 

Yall do as you wish tho

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What?
 

Forge isn't the problem, the developers are the problem when they fuck shit up with crappy maps and horrible settings.

Do you honestly think Forge would kill H:CE? Naaaah.

 

Bro, what are you even talking about?

 

CE (and to a lesser extent 2) if anything are good examples as to how great a halo game can be even without forge, you are not helping your position with that statement.

 

I think you're confused my amigo. Forge is not the main reason of why the competitive community gets divided. Forge wouldn't kill Halo CE man. CE is such a GOOD game, and never had Forge. Forge is just a gamemode, for fun, that has been used as a last resort method/tool for good maps and settings for the last few games JUST LIKE YOU SAID, you get me? I'm helping my own position with that statement. Halo: CE would be just fine with or without Forge; therefore, Forge is not the main reason of why the community gets divided.

 

Then you say "I didn't see why an entire community should be punished", like are you being serious with that comment? Again, 343i are a fucking company, it doesn't punish people, it doesn't love people, it exists for one reason only and if you wonder what that is its in your wallet.

 

The map creators, content creators, get punished for not having Forge in a Halo game. Those whole communities are getting punished with the missing content being added later. IF the rumors are true, obviously. Like you said: "For 343i to not include it at launch would be crazy from a business standpoint, unless of course they thought it would end up helping them in the end."

If the rumors are true, there's no reason for the lack of Forge yet; moreover, it doesn't help anyone. Would be a huge backlash, 343i gets a lot of hate, and several communities would be punished. Everyone loses man.

 

relax and think about it for a while.

:(

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Wonderful post man.  I agree completely.  The only thing I would add is a playlist specific XP rank, to give me a reason to grind any unranked playlists.  That was one of my favorite things about Halo 3, and MCC sorely needs it for its unranked playlists.  Games just feel empty and meaningless without something to play for.  If its not going to be a rank (and that's fine), at least let us fight over that XP point for the win.  Otherwise people like me feel like they have no reason at all to play that playlist.

 

REQ Points should serve as a good replacement for Playlist XP, you are always earning since 343 will continue to add new content. You get to pick your playlist and don't get judged based on how much you've played it.

 

Glad you agree with the other stuff though!

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1. A Strongholds exclusive playlist is not confirmed

2. Assault/Hill/Oddball are not confirmed to be in the game

3. Josh Holmes said it will be either Team Objective or CTF at launch

Well as you can tell, I'm clearly not following all too much haha

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REQ Points should serve as a good replacement for Playlist XP, you are always earning since 343 will continue to add new content. You get to pick your playlist and don't get judged based on how much you've played it.

 

Glad you agree with the other stuff though!

 

Is that enough to get people to care about winning/losing though? I'm unfamiliar with how REQ Points are awarded after games.  Is the difference between winning and losing substantial?  I just remember Reach, and how hollow and unfulfilling wins felt to me, bc the reward was only like an extra 500 credits or something negligible.  Halo 3 had it perfect.  It wasn't the end of the world if you lost bc you didn't go down at all, but you really wanted that win to get that XP point (or at least I did).  I remember not emotionally investing in Reach until I discovered HaloTracker.com and their 1-50 ranks for each playlist.  I need stuff like that to get me to really invest, and I'm sure I can't be alone on that.

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I couldn't resist.

 

The annoying thing is this is EXACTLY what I was planning to do, because of how much I hate most of the maps I was going to get forging some maps for classic settings custom games. Now I'll have to fucking WAIT for this wtf.

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