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Halo 5: Guardians Discussion

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Yeah, the following post pretty much confirms this as bs:

Also there's a classic mode build in

>No sprint
>Fall damage on
>No thrusters
>Classic guns only (BR/SMG old rockets no promotheon )
>Smart scope removed and replaced with old halo scoped
>No chatter or ordance at all

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The zoom of past Halo's wasn't broken. Why do they want to change the whole system now? It baffles my mind that Halo peaked at popularity during Halo 3 and has gone downhill every game after. Why the hell are they further changing things? Wouldn't it be logical to go back to PROVEN gameplay?

 

I don't consider this a new system. I consider it a new cosmetic look to zooming with a few tweaks. If the BR had radical expanding spread with wide crosshairs, the Sniper no longer had a precise circle for No Scopes, etc., then I would be appalled because obviously that isn't Halo. A slightly obstructed view and some spread reduction on automatics is hardly a large change. The pros outweigh the cons for me.

We can sit here all day and argue opinions, which it seems like you want to do, but it's all bullshit. Fuck your opinion and fuck my opinion.

Nothing wrong with friendly discussion?

Fact: Halo peaked at Halo 3 and grew every year from Halo CE until Halo 3. Halo declined since Reach and reached an all time low at Halo 4.

I agree that Halo 1-3 were the best games of the franchise, but other factors were involved in Halo's decline. Gameplay being the major flaw but there was other stuff.

Traditional zoom was proven to work. Traditional gameplay was proven to work. Now they want to change the fucking zoom system? After changing the movement system? Fuck that man.

As I said, nothing is really being changed about the zoom system aside from aesthetics...

The reduced spread and the fact that you could hold the zoom in button to instantly re zoom after being descoped aren't "just aesthetic changes". And zooming in of course makes the target bigger on your screen. The bigger the target, the easier to hit. And a bigger target on your screen means its easier to get your reticle on which means more aim assist and bullet magnetism. So basically for ADS to be "aesthetic" only, it would have to have no zoom, which would defeat ADS to begin with.

 

More than anything, the new ADS system just shows 343's goal for Halo 5. They want to make it as noob friendly and casual as possible. It's a pretty telling sign of what's to come.

 

Tell me back in 2007 that Halo was going to have an AR that you could ADS with while reducing spread and holding to instantly re zoom that you could pray and spray with at close/medium ranges and consistently beat BRs with. I woulda lol'd pretty good.

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Yeah, the following post pretty much confirms this as bs:

Also there's a classic mode build in

>No sprint

>Fall damage on

>No thrusters

>Classic guns only (BR/SMG old rockets no promotheon )

>Smart scope removed and replaced with old halo scoped

>No chatter or ordance at all

He said it was a classic mode built in. I take it as it's just all the toggles turning off all the ******** shit which are confirmed to be in.

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Movement penalty?

Most ADS systems penalize movement when you scope, H5 doesn't.

 

Jokes Aside:

No movement penalty.

Does not provide the same advantages.

Doesn't look the same on a lot of weapons (Snipe, AR)

It isn't an L-Trigger every fight situation. For one thing, there is descope, and plus the zooming and aim assist behavior acts just as it did in other Halo's. You wouldn't zoom for a close range BR fight in Halo 2, and you don't do it in Halo 5.

We can't go back and test this unfortunately, but I'd argue that zooming in H5 is much more effective as compared to the older games, which is emphasized by the stretched out maps. You can take my hyperbole literally if you want, but what I saw in the beta was scoping at the start of almost every fight, and players rescoping multiple times per fight while under fire.

 

So instead of pressing L you would rather click right stick?

Yes actually, the default control scheme is extremely telling of how a dev imagined the game being played. For example, If they had run a setup like Bumper Jumper as default, that would've indicated a heightened focus on vertical movement.

 

While on the right-stick, rescoping during fights was a gamble. On L-trigger, it tilts hard toward optimal.

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>Smart scope removed and replaced with old halo scoped

 

That's the red flag for me. Unless this means you can turn it off on only automatic weapons, which I seriously doubt.

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Most ADS systems penalize movement when you scope, H5 doesn't.

Oh shit I misread your post, My b

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The ONLY thing I HATE about "Smart scope" is the delay. I can't even describe the amount of fresh feels I got when I went back to H2A. Everything felt instant. Mostly the weapon switching and zooming. Other than that, Its nothing new besides looks. Ok, the AR can now zoom in. OMG we all seem to care about the AR all of a sudden?! C'mon, don't we all prefer the BR/DMR in these forums?

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The reduced spread and the fact that you could hold the zoom in button to instantly re zoom after being descoped aren't "just aesthetic changes". And zooming in of course makes the target bigger on your screen. The bigger the target, the easier to hit. And a bigger target on your screen means its easier to get your reticle on which means more aim assist and bullet magnetism. So basically for ADS to be "aesthetic" only, it would have to have no zoom, which would defeat ADS to begin with.

 

 

You make it sound like I'm claiming zooming altogether is aesthetic. All those things were present with Halo's zooming already. (P.S., Bullet Mag isn't magically increased if you zoom in).

 

As for holding the trigger and re-zooming, I do see that as an issue but I actually believe that may end up being changed. The Sniper's 10x zoom couldn't be accessed because releasing the trigger unzoomed you. I think they might make the trigger a toggle zoom instead of Hold to Zoom, but thats just my prediction. Maybe @@Sal1ent or @@Deez can confirm what they are doing with that.

 

More than anything, the new ADS system just shows 343's goal for Halo 5. They want to make it as noob friendly and casual as possible. It's a pretty telling sign of what's to come

 Considering Quinn and other 343 Devs have stated specifically that they want a high skill ceiling in this game, along with the extreme stress they are putting on Halo 5's competitive viability for eSports, I don't see this at all.

 

Quinn even has said that the game is rough on noobs.

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Yeah, the following post pretty much confirms this as bs:

Also there's a classic mode build in

>No sprint

>Fall damage on

>No thrusters

>Classic guns only (BR/SMG old rockets no promotheon )

>Smart scope removed and replaced with old halo scoped

>No chatter or ordance at all

 

Please God be true

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If there's anything I've learned going on /v/ for several years it's to believe literally nothing that gets posted there about "leaks". Especially when E3 is coming up.

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Yeah, the following post pretty much confirms this as bs:

Also there's a classic mode build in

>No sprint

>Fall damage on

>No thrusters

>Classic guns only (BR/SMG old rockets no promotheon )

>Smart scope removed and replaced with old halo scoped

>No chatter or ordance at all

If this were true, It'd basically be like Halo 5 on pc with modding support.............except that 343 staffs are the only ones allowed to mod.

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If there's anything I've learned going on /v/ for several years it's to believe literally nothing that gets posted there about "leaks". Especially when E3 is coming up.

 

Sure Half-Life 3 is coming out in 2013

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The old scope system fit Halo like a glove and was unique to the series. If the new system retains the responsive feel of past games, and doesn't turn fights into "who can re-zoom first" contests like I was seeing cross map on Truth, I'll be fine with it.

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Sounds like what they did in Mario Kart 8. 1-2 players get 60fps, 3-4 get 30fps. I'm not completely against the idea, but it does really suck. I would rather drop down to 480p than lose half the frames.

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You make it sound like I'm claiming zooming altogether is aesthetic. All those things were present with Halo's zooming already. (P.S., Bullet Mag isn't magically increased if you zoom in).

When you zoom in, the player on your screen becomes bigger. When you zoom in, your reticle gets bigger compared to the foreground. When your reticle is bigger and your opponent is bigger on your screen, it's easier for you to put your reticle into the zone where bullet magnetism and auto aim take effect.

 

So yes, aiming doesn't increase bullet magnetism but it makes it a hell of a lot easier to get into that zone where it starts.

 

If this system was present on past Halo's, it sure wasn't present on AR/SMGS. Now it is, and the game just got significantly easier for low skilled players. I don't care who at 343 says what about Halo 5. They said MCC would launch with ranks over 130 days ago.

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Meh, it's late, and I'm in a good mood.

 

Props to @@Sal1ent for the communication. It's definitely a step up from before, particularly when we were frustrated (extremely so) over MCC's issues. I'll be leaving in a couple days and probably won't be back doing this shit for quite a while, so I figured I'd say something.

 

I won't let you live down #Immersion, though, no matter how long down the road it is.  :halo:

 

On the bright side, it's not as bad as "Just trust us."

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Sounds like what they did in Mario Kart 8. 1-2 players get 60fps, 3-4 get 30fps. I'm not completely against the idea, but it does really suck. I would rather drop down to 480p than lose half the frames.

Isnt each screen already like 480 when splitscreening?? I am a frame whore but I wouldnt go that far. (unless you are joking. im not good at catching jokes)

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Hit % was in the Beta.

 

I swear I saw an image of Halo 5's post game stats which included a "Damage Dealt" stat which is what we have long needed; Halo is touted as having "golden triangle" gameplay of grenades, melee and bullets, but in terms of their use (damage dealt) only bullets have been recorded once in Halo 2 as the "Shots Hit" stat. Yes we have melee *kills*, but that doesn't tell you how much overall damage you did with melee, how many shields did you pop with melees that were cleaned up with bullets? This kind of information can tell a huge story about a player, but we don't have access to it. The same goes for having "Grenade Kills" but no "Grenade Damage" stat.

 

That would be the ultimate: measuring all three individually and awarding 1 point for each shield's worth of damage, eg;

Bullet damage: 16

Melee damage: 8

Grenade damage: 5

 

Or as Percentage of shields to allow greater precision and to make it more intuitive;

Bullet damage: 1675%

Melee damage: 815%

Grenade damage: 530%

 

 

 

And if you really wanted to, break down the Bullet damage into weapon tiers to identify power weapon use;

Bullet damage: 1675%

   Tier 1: 235%

   Tier 2: 930%

   Tier 3: 510%

Melee damage: 815%

Grenade damage: 530%

 

 

 

That is possibly a big ask, but I think at the very least an overall Damage Dealt stat is doable, and again I swear I saw a screenshot of a H5 postgame statsheet with this on it before the beta came out, but I can't find it again now. @@Sal1ent?

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The old scope system fit Halo like a glove and was unique to the series. If the new system retains the responsive feel of past games, and doesn't turn fights into "who can re-zoom first" contests like I was seeing cross map on Truth, I'll be fine with it.

Thats actually already a thing in previous Halo games. At least for long range Which cross-map Truth is. Its hard to do but it definitely separates the pros from the average joes. I think the problem is the L-trigger.

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Halo has never really been a series of "It it ain't broke, don't fix it" so I guess it's not surprising that we get more changes. I'm still not entirely sure that's the correct mindset to have for developing a game.

 

You can argue that if things weren't changed or updated and given a fresh coat of paint that the series might get stale, but to me I've always felt that Halo has sort of lacked an identity. I mean no two games feel close to play at all.

 

Don't get me wrong I don't think Halo should enter the realm of COD (that is to say same shit, different year) and I'm sort of glad that they've felt comfortable enough to make fairly drastic changes. My issues arise when those decisions are tried and met with negative feedback and then continually utilised.

 

Ordinance drops were tried, hated and ultimately removed. Why are other gameplay elements not getting the same treatment??

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