Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

[ShmaltzyLatkes]

There's no such thing as a "free" flank. You put your team at a man-disadvantage and risk getting caught out of position—it's the definition of a high risk/high reward play. The only possible way you could construe something as a "free" flank is if you're using the term to criticize the opposing team for their lack of awareness.

[Reamis25]

5 minutes ago, ShmaltzyLatkes said:

There's no such thing as a "free" flank. You put your team at a man-disadvantage and risk getting caught out of position—it's the definition of a high risk/high reward play. The only possible way you could construe something as a "free" flank is if you're using the term to criticize the opposing team for their lack of awareness.

I’m opposing the guy who decides to flank. Flanking is easy as pie if there’s no footstep sounds. You gotta put a little more work effort if you know they can hear you. 

[OG Nick]

If flanking is so free why is it such a big deal when someone pulls off a good flank?

[Knighty Knight]

7 hours ago, Reamis25 said:

Haha smart guy.

I know. 

[TeeJaY]

7 hours ago, Reamis25 said:

I’m opposing the guy who decides to flank. Flanking is easy as pie if there’s no footstep sounds. You gotta put a little more work effort if you know they can hear you. 

If you're aware of me before I flank then it's no longer a flank. DUMMY

[Reamis25]

2 hours ago, TeeJaY said:

If you're aware of me before I flank then it's no longer a flank. DUMMY

A flank is you getting the jump on the enemy dummy! Even if I hear you at the last second it’s still a flank! 

[TeeJaY]

32 minutes ago, Reamis25 said:

A flank is you getting the jump on the enemy dummy! Even if I hear you at the last second it’s still a flank! 

If you're aware of me before I've put a bullet in you, then I'm not getting the jump on you...

[Reamis25]

18 minutes ago, TeeJaY said:

If you're aware of me before I've put a bullet in you, then I'm not getting the jump on you...

But you’re still going to get the kill!

[TeeJaY]

1 minute ago, Reamis25 said:

But you’re still going to get the kill!

Duhhhhhhh cuz ur bad 

[Reamis25]

1 hour ago, TeeJaY said:

Duhhhhhhh cuz ur bad 

Lmao 

[The Tyco]

If you need a safety net for your lack of awareness, you deserve to get shit on for it. Foot step noise and radar are 2 sides of the same coin. Arguing for one, and condemning the other is hypocritical at best.

[Reamis25]

4 hours ago, The Tyco said:

If you need a safety net for your lack of awareness, you deserve to get shit on for it. Foot step noise and radar are 2 sides of the same coin. Arguing for one, and condemning the other is hypocritical at best.

No they are not because they don’t work the same way. It’s not hypocritical. Hearing footsteps is a form of legit awareness where a radar is just this free information. You know where they’re exactly at, you know if they’re moving left right up down etc. sound doesn’t do that for you. With radar I can easily move around a guy while half shields or none and do my best to not end up in his line of fire, but footstep noises I couldn’t do that. With footstep noises I can get behind a guy still because he may not hear me. He would have to concentrate and listen, god forbid he’s shooting a guy top middle from his base, he’s definitely not hearing me. Footstep noises don’t even do half what radar does and you know damn well it doesn’t. 

[Boyo]

8 minutes ago, Reamis25 said:

He would have to concentrate and listen, god forbid he’s shooting a guy top middle from his base, he’s definitely not hearing me.

So, foot step noises punish players who fire their weapon?  

[Reamis25]

31 minutes ago, Boyo said:

So, foot step noises punish players who fire their weapon?  

Umm yes. That’s natural. If you were say shooting at an enemy how would you hear your opponents or even your own steps? With radar I’d know his teammate is flanking me unless of course I’m scoped in.

sound is awareness! 

[_Synapse]

Sound punishes players who try to make plays. 

Sound is free information that players cannot avoid giving. 

Sound is inherently attached to movement, and therefore inherently attached to flanking. 

 

Punishing players for making plays instead of rewarding them for it, is how you make generic-boring-setup-based-meta Halo game #1973972. 

There's no debate on this. 

[Boyo]

57 minutes ago, Reamis25 said:

Umm yes. That’s natural. If you were say shooting at an enemy how would you hear your opponents or even your own steps? With radar I’d know his teammate is flanking me unless of course I’m scoped in.

sound is awareness! 

Perhaps we could design a mechanic around this.  After a player fires his weapon a certain number of times, he develops tinnitus and can no longer hear footsteps.  

[Reamis25]

57 minutes ago, _Synapse said:

Sound punishes players who try to make plays. 

Sound is free information that players cannot avoid giving. 

Sound is inherently attached to movement, and therefore inherently attached to flanking. 

 

Punishing players for making plays instead of rewarding them for it, is how you make generic-boring-setup-based-meta Halo game #1973972. 

There's no debate on this. 

So you should just be able to get behind me no problem just because I’m not looking the direction you came? Why? 

[Faeyrin]

All guns should be silent because it gives players free information about the position of an enemy. Footsteps do the same, SOOOOOOOOO.

[Reamis25]

45 minutes ago, Faeyrin said:

All guns should be silent because it gives players free information about the position of an enemy. Footsteps do the same, SOOOOOOOOO.

Hey I mentioned something like this earlier. The entire game should be mute

[_Synapse]

1 hour ago, Faeyrin said:

All guns should be silent because it gives players free information about the position of an enemy. Footsteps do the same, SOOOOOOOOO.

I don't fire a gun when trying to be sneaky, unlike how I need to move when attempting the same

[_Synapse]

1 hour ago, Reamis25 said:

Why? 

 

1 hour ago, Reamis25 said:

because I’m not looking the direction you came

 

You answered your own question.

Why should you be able to pick up a power weapon, just because I wasn't contesting it when it came up? 

It's not that hard to check your routes, unless you're playing on a cheese-block clusterfuck of a map like Coliseum. 

[_Synapse]

I don't know why there's been such an emotional meltdown on twitter over FPS shotguns. 

Is there really any contention that online FPS shotguns have almost always been terribly designed, emphasizing "crouch in the corner" behavior? 

People replying with shotguns for primarily singleplayer games, just fucking LOL

Halo's like the prime example of this. The shotgun's always been brainlessly easy to use within it's optimal range, and Halo 2/3/Reach's shotguns just magnify this effect by making crouching around a wall be the only effective strategy with the weapon. 

The denial is palpable. I can name maybe 6 games with skillful shotguns. 

[The Tyco]

4 hours ago, Reamis25 said:

No they are not because they don’t work the same way. It’s not hypocritical. Hearing footsteps is a form of legit awareness where a radar is just this free information. You know where they’re exactly at, you know if they’re moving left right up down etc. sound doesn’t do that for you. With radar I can easily move around a guy while half shields or none and do my best to not end up in his line of fire, but footstep noises I couldn’t do that. With footstep noises I can get behind a guy still because he may not hear me. He would have to concentrate and listen, god forbid he’s shooting a guy top middle from his base, he’s definitely not hearing me. Footstep noises don’t even do half what radar does and you know damn well it doesn’t. 

The only difference between radar and soundwhoring is its medium. They both produce the same results. They both stagnate gameplay and slow the game to a crawl. They both reward passive play with free, unearned information. Staring at my radar real hard is a form of awareness if listening real hard is as well. It makes no difference. If had to pick or choose between the two, I'd pick radar everytime. Why? Because everyone gets radar, not everyone gets a $300 headset.

If you wanna act like you're making some high IQ play because the game fucked over a player who is actively progressing the game, so be it. Just don't act like your "awareness" had anything to do it. 

[ShmaltzyLatkes]

It's also a feature that gives those who spend money on better equipment an advantage. This is obviously not a dispositive reason for not including footstep noise, but something to consider.

Footstep noise has its place in slower, methodical games like CS—the stagnating effects of footstep noise bolster that type of gameplay. Halo, conversely, excels when gameplay is fast-paced and fluid. Footstep detracts from this component of Halo since it encourages players to slow down. Maybe, maybe, if there was a "walk" feature in Halo that keeps you silent in exchange for a movement speed thats slower than base but faster than crouch walking, it could work better; however, I don't really think our abstract idea of "Halo" gains anything from that feature.

[Reamis25]

9 hours ago, _Synapse said:

 

 

You answered your own question.

Why should you be able to pick up a power weapon, just because I wasn't contesting it when it came up? 

It's not that hard to check your routes, unless you're playing on a cheese-block clusterfuck of a map like Coliseum. 

My point is why should sound not be a category of awareness in halo? Has it magically broken the game? I don’t think it has at all. I don’t see competitive players complaining about them usually. The only tine I ever saw complaints on them was in head to head.