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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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You know how when you watch a movie trailer that has the actors and producers talking positively about the film more than having actual film footage you know the movie is trash?  Well they know it too.  That's exactly what the pros were doing during that infamous Halo 4 interview. If i was honest in public about my thoughts on some of the features we put into our software at work, for sure i would get fired.  I don't do that because i'm not stupid. I reserve those thoughts for private conversations.  I am not going to hold the pro's public statements about H4 against them at all. Any of you would have done the same thing if you had half a brain.

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That's honestly the situation that a lot of pros are in. They're in a position of relative influence and have clout with 343i and Halo eSports, so they have to maintain that position by not stirring up a shitstorm about descope not being in or it being way too easy to perfect kill someone with the utility. 

It's like @Hard Way's already said: they can't stir up anything or they'll lose their influence. It's why I really doubt 343 listens to anything from here after Frankie got shooed off (If I understand what happened correctly). 

 

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4 hours ago, Apoll0 said:

You know how when you watch a movie trailer that has the actors and producers talking positively about the film more than having actual film footage you know the movie is trash?  Well they know it too.  That's exactly what the pros were doing during that infamous Halo 4 interview. If i was honest in public about my thoughts on some of the features we put into our software at work, for sure i would get fired.  I don't do that because i'm not stupid. I reserve those thoughts for private conversations.  I am not going to hold the pro's public statements about H4 against them at all. Any of you would have done the same thing if you had half a brain.

No they honestly didn't know any better. they played it for a few days at a tourney. Maybe a few hours TOPS combined. a lot of ppl including myself loved h4 at launch night... (playing custom FFAs with freinds was a blast) 

It only took me a couple days to realize something was off and I was raging a lot more than usual.

 

Then I went to octagon forge with a friend and spawned the beam rifle. Found out why I hated the game when I showed my friend the beam rifles no scope. i remember thinking it was a bug and theyd patch it.

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22 hours ago, Shekkles said:

This is how Australian Politics work. We have the two main parties then we have the smaller, but still influential, fringe parties. What happens is the more votes these fringe parties get, the more of their policies the big parties take into account because they want those voters to support them.

We are basically the "extreme competitive" community and it's fair we shoot for the stars for a competitive game. We want projectile, weapon timers, good strafing, 4v4 maps and quick perfect kills but slightly longer average kills (amongst many others)

Reddit, from what I've seen, are the AR starts community. They want BTB, AR starts, grunt shaped cakes, dual wielding and clips of shenanigans (amongst others).

The frustrating part is you can have both and do it without too much fuss (in Halo). But nah. Let's add advanced movement instead.

 

I think a problem on our end is that we're competitive by nature right? So we want to win the discussion and we want to win the casual vs competitive debate. This means that compromise is difficult.

Our more casual counterparts at Reddit's problem is that they don't understand why AR starts are bad. Some don't even understand why SMG starts are bad. I'm not being facetious either, it's a big problem.

Reddit really is disgusting. And waypoint. I read post all the tome about “nO oNe uSeS aNyThInG eLsE, iTs a oNe gUn gAmE” and you can tell these are the guys whom are straight garbage at it. Only way auto starts works is if there’s no precision guns on the map, and that includes the sniper. Lol have you seen someone get that in auto starts h3? Dude can’t even get Descoped hardly. These people actually think this is ok. They hate how someone more skilled any pick up or use the starting weapon and dominate. H4,&5 are more balanced than any other halo when it comes to precision vs AR(I won’t count CE since you gotta be like close as shit still for that to be effective) and people still complain because no matter what a good player can still Rekt an AR user. These people think because they’re in CQC scenarios they deserve to win every time as well. 

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58 minutes ago, znot said:

No they honestly didn't know any better. they played it for a few days at a tourney. Maybe a few hours TOPS combined. a lot of ppl including myself loved h4 at launch night... (playing custom FFAs with freinds was a blast) 

Not only that, think of the environment they're in. Back at an MLG event, finally Reach is gone, haven't seen a bunch of your friends in months, the developers are there and are showing potential interest in your scene. You think that for the first time, even if things are rough right now, that the developers will work closely with the competitive community. I don't blame them for just having a good time at an MLG event again.

It used to be a problem in games journalism when publishers would throw huge parties with open bars in San Francisco to play the latest build of their game. It wasn't necessarily buying favor, I mean a journalist talking good about a game only because you get a few free drinks? However, all of those sites were aware that games become a lot more fun with friends around and general good vibes. Usually the final reviewer wasn't allowed to attend those events to make sure they were a blank slate when the game came out.

343 basically threw a journalist preview party for a bunch of competitive players who aren't trained for it or have experience attending something like that.

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Games are best judged solo. If you’re playing locally with friends and shit you won’t have a bad time. 

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Every game is more fun when you're playing with friends. 

On the other hand, if soloqing is as enjoyable as pouring scalding oil into your urethra, then the game probably sucks. 

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Just allow yourself to imagine.

 

• 343 delayed MCC to mid-2016, and launched ODST and Reach along with it. 

• 343 used the Custom Edition version of CE and the OG Xbox version of H2 for MCC. 

• All inconsistencies between OG Xbox CE, H2, 360 H3, Reach, H4 and their MCC versions were all sorted out less than a month after release. 

• Netcode and networking issues were also all sorted out within the first month of release. 

• Functioning dedicated servers were implemented at launch date, and not in 2018 (with performance being worse than P2P and regional selection being horribly skewed, to boot). 

• The games launched with centered crosshair options, FOV, KBM functionality, input-based MM, and viewmodel customization. 

• NHE H1's maps, settings, and training mode were implemented into MCC along with all the basic custom game options available in H2/3. 

• H3's spread was permanently removed from it's MCC version, and Reach used zero bloom/MLG movement settings universally. 

• MCC launched with a custom game browser and party up. 

• MCC launched with perfect functionality and zero online issues. 

• It was added to game pass within 2-3 months of release. 

• It featured prominent crossgame playlists, with a veto system and equal weighting between CE, 2, 3, and Reach. 

• The game launched with a large and diverse selection of ranked playlists, using H3's ranking and progression systems. 

• Forge for the legacy titles had the limits raised to what the XB1 could handle. 

• Total player counts were raised from 16 to 24. 

• A PC release happened in early-mid 2019, and was just as bug-free/had all major bugs dealt with within two weeks of launch. 

 

This is complete fantasy, but just imagine. For the 2017-2020 period, we could have had actually new content being added to the MCC, and not just a slow crossing out of the laundry list of game-altering bugs that MCC still has. 

Things like a PC release with crossplay at launch, actual mod and original dev tools on par with Custom Edition's Guerrilla/Sapien/OpenSauce/3DS Max/Tool for the games in the collection, new and innovative playlists that aren't bland, constant tourneys for all the games in the collection (and not just H3/2A), more forge maps in MM, NHE maps for CE, mods, new content for older games like skins, crossplatform mod support a la FO4/Skyrim, and god knows how much else could have been added earlier. 

If this was the actual case with MCC, I'd have been OK with H5 being cancelled altogether. The game would have pulled several hundred thousand players at launch, and still HELD them well into 2021-2022. Hypothetically, if the PC release was in early 2019, then I'd estimate the player count on XBL to be roughly 50-70K, and the player count on PC to be roughly 30K-60K. 

Instead, we have this.

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2 minutes ago, _Synapse said:

Just allow yourself to imagine.

 

• 343 delayed MCC to mid-2016, and launched ODST and Reach along with it. 

• 343 used the Custom Edition version of CE and the OG Xbox version of H2 for MCC. 

• All inconsistencies between OG Xbox CE, H2, 360 H3, Reach, H4 and their MCC versions were all sorted out less than a month after release. 

• Netcode and networking issues were also all sorted out within the first month of release. 

• Functioning dedicated servers were implemented at launch date, and not in 2018 (with performance being worse than P2P and regional selection being horribly skewed, to boot). 

• The games launched with centered crosshair options, FOV, KBM functionality, input-based MM, and viewmodel customization. 

• NHE H1's maps, settings, and training mode were implemented into MCC along with all the basic custom game options available in H2/3. 

• H3's spread was permanently removed from it's MCC version, and Reach used zero bloom/MLG movement settings universally. 

• MCC launched with a custom game browser and party up. 

• MCC launched with perfect functionality and zero online issues. 

• It was added to game pass within 2-3 months of release. 

• It featured prominent crossgame playlists, with a veto system and equal weighting between CE, 2, 3, and Reach. 

• The game launched with a large and diverse selection of ranked playlists, using H3's ranking and progression systems. 

• Forge for the legacy titles had the limits raised to what the XB1 could handle. 

• Total player counts were raised from 16 to 24. 

• A PC release happened in early-mid 2019, and was just as bug-free/had all major bugs dealt with within two weeks of launch. 

 

This is complete fantasy, but just imagine. For the 2017-2020 period, we could have had actually new content being added to the MCC, and not just a slow crossing out of the laundry list of game-altering bugs that MCC still has. 

Things like a PC release with crossplay at launch, actual mod and original dev tools on par with Custom Edition's Guerrilla/Sapien/OpenSauce/3DS Max/Tool for the games in the collection, new and innovative playlists that aren't bland, constant tourneys for all the games in the collection (and not just H3/2A), more forge maps in MM, NHE maps for CE, mods, new content for older games like skins, crossplatform mod support a la FO4/Skyrim, and god knows how much else could have been added earlier. 

If this was the actual case with MCC, I'd have been OK with H5 being cancelled altogether. The game would have pulled several hundred thousand players at launch, and still HELD them well into 2021-2022. Hypothetically, if the PC release was in early 2019, then I'd estimate the player count on XBL to be roughly 50-70K, and the player count on PC to be roughly 30K-60K. 

Instead, we have this.

pfft already lost me at custom edition and OG h2... they would never. way too much work to get those working and besides why go through the hassle when the ports already do most of that for you? 

 

I agree theyre shit ports but most of the work is already done and doesnt have to be redone... plus cartographer shows us that you can get the games as close to OG as possible if you care or try enough.

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4 minutes ago, znot said:

they would never. way too much work to get those working

Hence "imagine"

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7 hours ago, _Synapse said:

• H3's spread was permanently removed from it's MCC version, and Reach used zero bloom/MLG movement settings universally.

Halo 3 spread could probably be removed and not really upset anyone, but making all of Reach use v7 settings would be a horrible idea. People want to play the game they remember, and v7 Reach might as well be an entirely different game, so you'd upset the overwhelming majority of Reach players.

I don't even like v7 Reach tbh. KOTH on Battle Creek is just horrible, and I really hate how you just get melted from across the map with the x3 scope of the DMR. Not to mention, in MCC, the DMR's rate of fire is faster than OG, further compounding the issue of just getting absolutely melted. There are much better competitive Halo games.

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1 hour ago, TI Inspire said:

Halo 3 spread could probably be removed and not really upset anyone, but making all of Reach use v7 settings would be a horrible idea. People want to play the game they remember, and v7 Reach might as well be an entirely different game, so you'd upset the overwhelming majority of Reach players.

I don't even like v7 Reach tbh. KOTH on Battle Creek is just horrible, and I really hate how you just get melted from across the map with the x3 scope of the DMR. Not to mention, in MCC, the DMR's rate of fire is faster than OG, further compounding the issue of just getting absolutely melted. There are much better competitive Halo games.

I'm pretty sure that even teamshot is preferable to bloom

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It only took 6 years but it seems like we will finally have a great way to play the original Halo games for years to come by the end of this year. :simms:

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4 hours ago, thdyingbreed said:

Highlights:

Custom Game Browser

Design and implementation is underway on the custom game browser. Our goal is to offer players a way to host and join a larger variety of gametypes than what we are able to support via social or competitive matchmade games. We want to give players control over multiple games (HCE - H4), gametypes, and maps in a custom browser rotation. We want to make it easy to play with friends and to find games you are interested in based on filters you provide. We want to provide a detailed browsing experience. We also need to make some adjustments to the core Halo multiplayer flow for custom game browser so players spend less time in the UI and more time in maps. Our plan is to get a version of this feature up and running and into our flighting rings for feedback. We will have more details and examples of the UI flow to show in the near future.

Region Selection

serverregionselect-38a0a99942514fad82216

Halo 3 Hit Registration:

This change has been flighted and will be improved in the next game update. Thank you to all who gave feedback during this most recent flight!

View Model:

This work is continuing to be in active development. We are aiming for an update to this for flighting across all games prior to release.

Input Based Matchmaking:

Currently, players in MCC are split by platform, but that’s a fairly arbitrary split. With input-based matchmaking and crossplay, the goal is to break down as many barriers between players as possible but to split players by something that has a direct impact on their moment-to-moment gameplay experience.

To accomplish this, we are looking at input-based matchmaking being implemented at the playlist level. This allows us to have more control on where we do and don’t separate players into sub-groups.

Basically, what that means in terms of implementation, in certain playlists, players will be locked to a given input, and we will have a couple of different knobs we can tune to alter this experience over time.

For example, in a playlist like Infection when crossplay and input-based matchmaking features come online, we're not going to limit by input at all. The same can be said for something like Firefight. We don’t believe that there is a need to lock players by input in these areas, so in those cases players will get the full benefit of crossplay so anyone can play together, which is really great. This should help those player groups find matches more quickly and break down barriers between players on different platforms for those offerings.

In other areas, such as the more competitive playlists, we will have the capability to limit players by input method. In some cases that will mean all players have to use the same input. In other cases that will mean that we will allow squads with some amount of mixed input to play together and balance out those using mouse & keyboard and those playing with controllers. Players will be locked into a single device when they enter matchmaking for those offerings. You’ll be able to see which device other players in the lobby are using as well.

In Design Iteration

  • Additional Mod Support
  • Text Chat Improvements
  • Better ways to Report Players
  • VFR Improvements to Reach & H2A
  • Bringing PC Features to Console (Like FOV Sliders)
  • Additional Accessibility Support
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Saw this on my Twitter feed and my heart sank. Like the tweet says, this was Clutch’s first coach, at Meadowlands 08. That was my first tournament as a ref, and I reffed every series these guys played. I grew to like this guy right away because I could tell he was a great person and loved Halo. 12 years later I bumped into him on a Twitch chat in Snipedown’s stream and chatted with him for like an hour. Still a great dude. Seeing this really bummed me out. Let’s step up for one of our own when he needs us.
https://gf.me/u/yvmzj2

 

 

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4 hours ago, Hard Way said:

Saw this on my Twitter feed and my heart sank. Like the tweet says, this was Clutch’s first coach, at Meadowlands 08. That was my first tournament as a ref, and I reffed every series these guys played. I grew to like this guy right away because I could tell he was a great person and loved Halo. 12 years later I bumped into him on a Twitch chat in Snipedown’s stream and chatted with him for like an hour. Still a great dude. Seeing this really bummed me out. Let’s step up for one of our own when he needs us.
https://gf.me/u/yvmzj2

 

 

Meadowlands huh? That takes me back.

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Turns out shroud likes halo 3. He’s enjoying himself and looking forward to the next game. He wants better movement mechanics but more like better strafing abilities like air control and whatnot. 

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This is painful to watch: https://www.twitch.tv/shroud

 

Watching Snipedown go 28-0 against casual players is horrible. Not sure why they are even playing Hardcore. 

30k people watching Shroud complain about how little fun he is having is great for the scene. :ace:

Edit: Once the event was over a lot of the streamers actually said they had a good time. From what I understand Dr. Lupo's stream turned into a toxic shitshow because they didn't win a map, and Shroud has now clue how to actually play. That and Snipedown evidently having no sense of sportsmanship made it a mixed bag. Overall not bad though. 

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Watching Snipedowns pov is great. Watching everyone else is painful 

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Who the fuck thought it was a good idea to let snipedown in this? It's bullying lol. Terrible impressions aboud. Worst part is you already know the result.

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Just now, Exidrion said:

Who the fuck thought it was a good idea to let snipedown in this? It's bullying lol. Terrible impressions aboud. Worst part is you already know the result.

it's also kind of funny knowing someone was smart enough to ask snip3down and they got him.

tho I agree this is fucked lol

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