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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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34 minutes ago, Arlong said:

But that’s not really a story, and deep down has no depth at all, especially if that’s all a player can take from that. 

Then what's the point of a 4 minute cutscene if it has no depth and no meaning.

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34 minutes ago, Arlong said:

But that’s not really a story, and deep down has no depth at all, especially if that’s all a player can take from that. 

Then what's the point of a 4 minute cutscene if it has no depth and no meaning.

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2 hours ago, JordanB said:
  • Didact can still throw us around but Cortana sacrifices herself to help defeat Didact. We win but at the cost of Cortana. 

I never understood how Cortana became a real-life entity and could physically hold the Didact so Chief you execute him in a quick-time event (I cringed just rewatching this scene). Space magic? That shit was way too Harry Potter-ish for me to take it serious and I laughed when all the tiny cortanas appeared out of nowhere.

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15 minutes ago, Basu said:

I never understood how Cortana became a real-life entity and could physically hold the Didact so Chief you execute him in a quick-time event (I cringed just rewatching this scene). Space magic? That shit was way too Harry Potter-ish for me to take it serious and I laughed when all the tiny cortanas appeared out of nowhere.

You can easily debate that tech enhanced her as an AI. And I mean halo already has magic according to the books. 

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38 minutes ago, HeX Reapers said:

Yeah that's cool and all, but what if we had a utility weapon that shot straight and actually hit people?

Just pace your shots kid

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56 minutes ago, Arlong said:

You can easily debate that tech enhanced her as an AI. And I mean halo already has magic according to the books. 

"Tech" turns an AI into a floating ghost that can physically interact with people? lol

Also out of curiosity where was magic mentioned in the books? I stopped reading the books after H4 came out.

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1 hour ago, Basu said:

I never understood how Cortana became a real-life entity and could physically hold the Didact so Chief you execute him in a quick-time event (I cringed just rewatching this scene). Space magic? That shit was way too Harry Potter-ish for me to take it serious and I laughed when all the tiny cortanas appeared out of nowhere.

The nerdy responses I've heard is that when Cortana was plugged in, she took control of a hard light bridge (which you and the didact are standing on) that's how she's able to physically hold and interact with the world.

 

Hard light. 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, JordanB said:

Halo 4 went like this for me - 

  • oh we're fighting the covenant again? OK
  • Cortana is being weird
  • ah new enemies. Knights can teleport. Cool /s
  • Guy in a big ball has been trapped in there for a long time. He seems to be the leader of the new enemy. He tricks us into freeing him and he pretty much threw us to the side like we're a plastic toy. How will we stop him?
  • Long cutscene with a strange woman (not to mention completely random, where even are we? Where did she come from? I'm trying to figure out all this while she's explaining all this new stuff to me). "Mantle of responsibility" "Composer" ... a lot of new terms to me all at once. I understand the Didact a little more but I'm still confused about other things and feel overwhelmed with too much new information at once.
  • Scientists just exploded in front of our faces and we survived... weird
  • Didact can still throw us around but Cortana sacrifices herself to help defeat Didact. We win but at the cost of Cortana.

In CE I don't have to understand the Covenant or their religion to understand why they're attacking us. They're aliens that have their own guns and their own technology. Knowing why they are attacking us would be nice but I'm not sitting in the first mission of CE like "why is an alien race even attacking us it doesn't make sense".

We learn what they are after in bits and pieces throughout the game. We're told Halo is a super weapon, so it makes sense we want to stop them from using it. Thus, war. 

There's another argument you could make.

 

The didact, unlike the covenant, is the primary antagonist. The covenant in every game except reach and odst, get relegated to secondary or even tertiary villains behind the flood and 343 guilty spark. Their war with humanity seems to be more of a vehicle into those conflicts. It's the background/setting for the halo ring and it's mysteries in the first game. The questions the player has about the war aren't as important and thus don't need to be put on front Street. So it doesn't really bother me that the covenant is explored in greater depth in the EU rather than the games. They really aren't the most important aspect most of the time. In odst and reach, yeah it's a different story.

In those games, I'd say it'd be convenient to have the terminal entries and data pads expand more on the human covenant war. While I generally liked what was presented in those games, at this point it couldn't have hurt to bring some EU lore into the forefront to give players who may want to know more a direct avenue to that information. Without it having a negative impact on the flow of the story or the characters.

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On 11/3/2019 at 1:05 PM, Hard Way said:

Then I started thinking, what if when you get shot you had to go back to base to reactivate? That would fix the positioning problem, but would restrict you to symmetrical layouts and create a spawn trapping issue. 

"Recharge" stations existed in my first ever laser-tag experience, and it was definitely one of my most fun experiences as a child, and the only time I really enjoyed the game.

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My halo campaign ranking (never read any books or other sources, probably read/watched terminals and such once each, played each campaign multiple times but certainly missed some of the finer details you all seem to know):

1. Reach - I thought the story was decent enough. Had good feels as you lost each member of the team. Only part that didn't make a ton of sense to me was getting Cortana to chief's ship since HCE implied they had been on lots of adventures together (I'm sure you halo readers can explain all this). The action shifted often enough to stay interesting (helicopter gunner & space pilot are two I recall).

2. H4 - Yea, as others have noted the story was confusing at points and the baddies could be annoying to fight, but I'm a fan of the ending. Cortana saying goodbye hit me in the place my gf says I should have a heart. Action-wise, had some good stuff going for it. Mantis was a cool new toy and more space-piloting helped break up the run and gun. 

3. HCE - Classic. Yea gunplay is a little repetitive but all of the maps/levels feel (cliche incoming) iconic and for some reason were extremely replayable on increasing difficulties. Story was simple compared to later editions, but had a great twist with the introduction of the flood.

4. H3/ODST - Probably should be separated, but they'd still be in this section anyway, just one above the other. Plus ODST was the one I didn't replay during MCC since it came out so much later so my memory is fuzzy. H3 story I thought was pretty so-so but I can't complain majorly about it. ODST was a unique concept in the approach, but didn't do much for me. I don't recall gameplay adding anything that hadn't been there before.

5. H2 - Wasn't a fan of this one though I guess others seem to really like it. I was always a bit confused by the whole gravemind part, the alliance, and where everybody is after that piece. Gameplay didn't add much new that I can recall and I remember being super excited to finally fight covenant on Earth, only to be zipped away after level ?2? Also, when replaying in the last 4 years or so, there was a lot more arbiter levels than I remembered, all of which felt pretty stale.

6. H5 - I really cannot find anything positive to say about this one. Played it the most recently so it's fresher. Hated how they brought back Cortana (not the choice to do so necessarily, but the how). Also didn't enjoy the 2 teams aspect as you couldn't really get to know any character since they had so little screen-time. From a gameplay standpoint, I thought they were really trying to find excuses to use all of the spartan abilities, which was both obvious and... tacky?

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5 hours ago, Basu said:

"Tech" turns an AI into a floating ghost that can physically interact with people? lol

Also out of curiosity where was magic mentioned in the books? I stopped reading the books after H4 came out.

Basically the flood or the precursors and the primordial himself(which the flood are made from)  are magical beings that created the universe and every living creature in it. 
and YES. Technology could do that, especially in halo. I don’t get why it’s so far fetched?  Heck’s the h4 story was about chief being human, him coming to realize that he’s not a machine, which he sees himself as. But people couldn’t figure out who the didact was(mostly because they bummed rush the game and didn’t watch the terminals scattered through out, guess 343 should of made it so people HAD to do that) and they wanted to know who he was. Mantle of responsibility sure, you probably need to read the book(or watch halo legends) and you’d know what that is.  All in all let’s face it this isn’t about bad story it’s about bad gameplay. No one likes fighting the promethions they aren’t FUN! Heck’s if people cared about story reach be recognized better than it was worth. 

343 overestimated the people’s desire for halos story is all that can be said. 

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That’s what I enjoyed about H4s story. Since chief was a kid he’s been trained to kill people, and because of the covenant it would later turn to doing that. But at the end of the day him and the other 2s and 3s they’re just weapons. It’s hard to see yourself as human when your only purpose is to kill. Heck’s chief probably couldn’t see himself living a life of piece because I’d imagine for him it couldn’t work. Cortana is an AI, whim is an actual machine with more humanity than chief and her goal is to make him understand that he’s human, that he shouldn’t just think of her as his everything, when technically she was all he had. The h5 story really just retconned and destroyed everything h4 had built which frustrated me the most. 
locke wasn’t even bad of a character they just gave him no development, and the dialogue sucked. 
 

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There's one argument that the didact was more of a backdrop for the chief+Cortana dynamic was the real heart of the story. Ergo, something that was ripe for exploration in later games. His simplicity and or murky motives may not really be as big an issue as some make it out to be.

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3 hours ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

343 rolling hard for that 3-peat of shitty aiming on release I see. 

Gosh not another h5, otherwise I’m sticking with my controller

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On 11/2/2019 at 2:27 AM, Mow said:

So who wants to make bets that despite all the "It's ready when it's ready" talk about MCC PC it's still going to launch a complete buggy mess?

Ok after reading this now I'm REALLY starting to worry about this game... I'm not the only one to get a sour taste in their mouth after reading this am I? It's pretty much dismissing player feedback as 'piling on' and 'anecdotal noise' and I don't know how the hell he think the PR team *cough* sorry, I mean the 'Pro' team, have any kind of experience or expertise with something complex like mouse aiming/input just because they were pros in past Halo titles, y'know, the ones that were on console... He even revealed his own bias and admits he tends towards a more negative view of player feedback when he said 'I have to believe a lot of noise is the latter' seriously what the actual fuck did I just read?? It's super revealing and concerning about the kind of mentality 343 employees truly hold towards feedback behind all the fake positive vibes they try so desperately to give off.

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You'd think if you, as a company, had introduced fucking terrible aiming systems consistently and in one game repeatedly called it fixed only to have to fix it more multiple times in a row you'd just shut up and know when you see the feedback that its bad that its actually bad. That sounds pretty rude but I mean really come on this is an FPS game you can not screw this up. Responsive controls with as small a delay as possible is the number 1 priority for any FPS that has ever or will ever exist assuming you're trying to make a good product anyways

The pro team comment is actually hilarious. We need the Ghost post stat that tried to explain how H5 aiming wasn't bad. That pretty much sums up what I think of pro teams opinion on anything related to aiming. Maybe that's unfair since that guy in particular isn't even there anymore afaik and they're not all the same person but just seeing someone mention pro team as an almost defense that aiming could be fine just gives me flashbacks.

The bottom line is that there isn't room for anything other than raw input options with close to no latency when you're talking to PC players. If they're trying to put any kind of Halo sauce on how aiming feels with a mouse they're setting up a disaster

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18 minutes ago, Mow said:

Ok after reading this now I'm REALLY starting to worry about this game... I'm not the only one to get a sour taste in their mouth after reading this am I? It's pretty much dismissing player feedback as 'piling on' and 'anecdotal noise' and I don't know how the hell he think the PR team *cough* sorry, I mean the 'Pro' team, have any kind of experience or expertise with something complex like mouse aiming/input just because they were pros in past Halo titles, y'know, the ones that were on console... He even revealed his own bias and admits he tends towards a more negative view of player feedback when he said 'I have to believe a lot of noise is the latter' seriously what the actual fuck did I just read?? It's super revealing and concerning about the kind of mentality 343 employees truly hold towards feedback behind all the fake positive vibes they try so desperately to give off.

The same pros who made the improved aiming to halo 5? the aiming Ghost said would  "feel a little bit harder to control at first, but in the long run, you will all learn to adjust to it for the better. "?

 

 

Nah no wayyy.

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It's funny watching 343 realize that they can't trick/dismiss PC players as easily as they can console players. PC players on average are lot more knowledgeable and expect only the very best, so that crap won't fly. 

Also that pro team comment was an absolute joke, there's no such thing as a PC Halo pro. So how would the "console" pro players know what RAW mouse input is supposed to feel like?

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On 11/4/2019 at 12:43 PM, II AdamanT II said:

My halo campaign ranking

Decent ranks. These are mine.

  1. ODST (GOAT)
  2. Reach
  3. H3 / H4
  4. H1/H2 (Played very little of these)
  5. H5

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If anyone at 343 seriously thinks the mouse aiming is in a good state (yes I've enabled FPS lock and it "helps" to a marginal degree) or that the Reach netcode is anywhere near acceptable then they should just be removed from the MCC team at this point. What games are they using as reference here? It can't be CSGO/Apex/OW or any other top 100 game on steam because Reach PC feels like total dogshit compared to any PC FPS, even the shittiest CoD port feels better to play.

Oh and the game crashes any time you even think about alt-tabbing (PC gamers are gonna LOVE that!), and hey sometimes it just crashes randomly because you try to move your right thumbstick. So I definitely share the sentiment that we should be more worried than excited about MCC PC. Let's not forget that MCC Xbone still has a ton of unfixed issues and porting over the other 4 games AND fixing those AND adding a custom game browser is probably going to be a disaster.

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2 hours ago, Snipe Three said:

You'd think if you, as a company, had introduced fucking terrible aiming systems consistently and in one game repeatedly called it fixed only to have to fix it more multiple times in a row you'd just shut up and know when you see the feedback that its bad that its actually bad. That sounds pretty rude but I mean really come on this is an FPS game you can not screw this up. Responsive controls with as small a delay as possible is the number 1 priority for any FPS that has ever or will ever exist assuming you're trying to make a good product anyways

The pro team comment is actually hilarious. We need the Ghost post stat that tried to explain how H5 aiming wasn't bad. That pretty much sums up what I think of pro teams opinion on anything related to aiming. Maybe that's unfair since that guy in particular isn't even there anymore afaik and they're not all the same person but just seeing someone mention pro team as an almost defense that aiming could be fine just gives me flashbacks.

The bottom line is that there isn't room for anything other than raw input options with close to no latency when you're talking to PC players. If they're trying to put any kind of Halo sauce on how aiming feels with a mouse they're setting up a disaster

One thing to note is it’s possible they’re not experiencing it, because the DEV build is better. I’m so sick and tired of these game devs ONLY playing the DEV builds. Heck’s a lot of times I hear “we didn’t see these issues on our DEV builds, and I’m like Gee I wonder why”

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