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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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this wait got me like

 

ani_tyrone-biggums-scratch.gif

 

Imperium
Society
Shixon
Droid

LAUNCH NIGHT TEAM OF FOUR?

I want to play big team just so I get to play with everyone.

I need my dose of yoseph duji saustin and all y'all.

 

SCRUBS....ALL OF YOU

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Halo 4 is hitscan, so no, but can you explain to me why having client-side authority hit detection with projectiles is problematic? Actually, now that I think about it, one problem I can see would be the case where a person who's getting shot at would have the bullet go past them at the location they were previously but still get hit (this could cause a syncing issue where the bullet that "hit" him and caused him damage, actually missed him from his pov and hit a power-up or other dynamic object on his xbox, knocking down a power up or something and causing damage at the same time), but isn't there a way to solve that? Hopefully I'm making sense here, but could we have a pseudo-hitscan model where projectiles aren't tracked by the server, but only when and where they land? So in other words, could instances of projectiles be only created and tracked by the client's xbox who fired them and then just communicate the spot where they stopped moving? Let me know if something like this isn't possible or if it just causes a butterfly effect, I'm curious. Sorry if that was hard to follow, it's tough describing technical stuff like this.

See this talk by Bungie's David Aldridge if you're interested in various solutions to network programming in games. His examples mostly focus on the decisions made for Halo Reach's netcode, but the general concepts are applicable to other games.

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Could timer be tracked by server?

Another update.  Loaded up dammy again after syncing with the cloud and playing online.  Powerup spawns are still half a second off each minute.  Played around with the spawns after that and spawns appear to be pretty much the same.  The random area down in rocket pit seemed to be a bit more favored towards the big ladder side than on the original.  All the nade points I tried for blowing down camo worked.  One thing that didn't work as expected.. after making OS jump to the left side I'd bank a nade off the column to blow rockets so when I jumped over to small ladder I could catch them.  Couldn't replicate this.  It's possible the dammy PC version the column is off a bit, also, I can't recall off hand (I suppose I could load up halo on a normal box) but the rockets were lying parallel with the rocket pit if that makes sense.  I'm pretty sure on original rockets are lying across the center line instead of with the center line, which would have an effect on how they are blown by nades.

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Nah dude, MLGv7 was pretty awesome. If it had better maps it would be above Halo 2 in my opinion (negrep incoming).

Maybe if the movement wasn't a slip and slide and melee wasn't quite so boring V7 could be compared to H2. Oh and if the maps weren't trash. About the only thing I'd really give V7 over H2 was weapon spawn timers being on a better system and the rifle being a single shot rather than burst. 

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See this talk by Bungie's David Aldridge if you're interested in various solutions to network programming in games. He mostly focuses on the decisions behind Halo 3's netcode, but the general concepts are applicable to other games.

Yeah...good post.

 

I can't wait for when we get quantum teleportation working so we can instantly send data and not deal with bullshit lag issues anymore. ;)

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this wait got me like

 

ani_tyrone-biggums-scratch.gif

 

 

SCRUBS....ALL OF YOU

 

 

Maybe Shixon but I'm confident in our abilities. My backpack has plenty of room.  :lxthul:

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this wait got me like

 

ani_tyrone-biggums-scratch.gif

 

 

SCRUBS....ALL OF YOU

Sounds like we're gonna have to run some customs.

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Another update.  Loaded up dammy again after syncing with the cloud and playing online.  Powerup spawns are still half a second off each minute.  Played around with the spawns after that and spawns appear to be pretty much the same.  The random area down in rocket pit seemed to be a bit more favored towards the big ladder side than on the original.  All the nade points I tried for blowing down camo worked.  One thing that didn't work as expected.. after making OS jump to the left side I'd bank a nade off the column to blow rockets so when I jumped over to small ladder I could catch them.  Couldn't replicate this.  It's possible the dammy PC version the column is off a bit, also, I can't recall off hand (I suppose I could load up halo on a normal box) but the rockets were lying parallel with the rocket pit if that makes sense.  I'm pretty sure on original rockets are lying across the center line instead of with the center line, which would have an effect on how they are blown by nades.

Yeah, they rotate the rocket spawns on some maps. I know it is like that in hang em, too. 

 

So the times are still off even after doing the update? This is crazy...other streams seem to be fixed...

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Yeah, they rotate the rocket spawns on some maps. I know it is like that in hang em, too. 

 

So the times are still off even after doing the update? This is crazy...other streams seem to be fixed...

It's like this on Chill Out as well.

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Well, I know I will be neg repped into oblivion for this post, judging how others are repped for even the slightest complaint, but I feel I have to say this.  Seeing as how I have like 2 posts total on this site, oh well, I'll deal with the rep - I have to voice my opinion somewhere.

 

Anyway, the gist of this post is that I don't understand all of you who are so quick to bash people complaining about the game.  All of you immediately dismiss them, and say they are bad for the community, but ironically enough, you're the ones who are hurting the community.   Yes, some people just have pure hatred, but many of these complaints are justified, and should be so readily neglected with, "Oh well, at least we have the game."  Or, "It could be worse, I just want to play the game again."  That right there is the problem, but you don't understand it.  Settling for something mediocre or not up to par IS the problem, not the complainers.  Let me explain.

 

Since when has the Halo community settled for less than exceptional quality?  Not until Halo Reach.  In Halo 2 MLG prime, even Halo 3, all of us thought that Halo was the best game in the world.  We thought people should look up to us and all the pros because we played Halo and we were good at it.  It meant something to us; Halo mattered and we cared about it.  We would defend it against any game, even against Starcraft or Counterstike, because we knew Halo 2 deserved a spot internationally in the competitive scene.  The game is that good and skillful.  Now, Reach and Halo 4 hit us so hard that many of you are willing to just brush off complainers and say, "Just be happy we have Halo again."  No, we shouldn't be settling for mediocrity, especially when we have been deceived as a result.

 

All of you know the problems.  Halo 2 using the PC build, H2A being forced in competitive play even though H1 and H2 blow it away competitively, buying out classic H2 tournaments like UGC, no superbounces, no day 1 ranks, etc.  These are things that are not perfect, and thus, need to be complained about - need to be voiced.  By just accepting these falsifications, you're indicating to 343 that this is acceptable; that they can continue doing this.  They now know that everyone is just desperate to play the game again, and that you'll settle for any blasphemous shit they try to pull.  So, in essence, trying to quiet the complainers is the MAIN problem.  Shortly after everyone recognized Halo Reach was trash, I became heavily invested in PC games, and things like this would NEVER fly in PC games, let me tell you why.

 

I started playing LoL, and like everyone else who enjoys competitiveness and skill, I switched to HoN, and then Dota 2 and CS.  I've played Dota 2 extensively for years now, since about 2010, and have become heavily invested in the community, have followed everything about the scene, and all the tournaments.  I'd like to give an example how, in PC games, the community decides what is best, NOT the developer.  Last Christmas, Valve decided that they were not going to put their holiday Christmas mode game type in the game, and they would just skip it.  The community wasn't having it.  They petitioned for Valve to add it in the game, and when Valve ignored them, they revolted.  Forums and Reddit threads were filled with petitions and complaints, and as a result, 100,000s of people flooded Volvo's (car manufacturer) Facebook page spamming "Volvo plz add Christmas mode". - Since Valve is always referred to as Volvo.  Volvo had no idea what was going on, but they couldn't interact with customers online, they couldn't even post information about their products.  Sure enough, Christmas mode was added ASAP.  Immature of the community? Yes. Effective?  Almost immediately.

 

I'll give one more general example, since this post is getting very long.  In general, if the community doesn't like a game, they DO NOT play it.  They don't blindly follow the newest game out that the developers want to push.  There are 20 million Dota players in China alone, millions still have not switched to Dota 2 because they love the first one so much, and as a result, there are still Dota 1 tournaments.  If you look at Steam store stats, CS Source and 1.6 are STILL 2 of the most played games on Steam, to this day.  My point is, that if the community bonded together, to boycott something they didn't like, it would be changed.  Instead of settling for average-ness, if the community came together and all agreed they would not give the Halo 2 Anniversary League views on Twitch until more games were added, more games would be added.  The community on consoles needs to be more tightly knit, and not dismiss every complaint - most are valid.  Again, why settle for this when something can be better.  That's why Dota and SC2 are at the top of Esports - because they're perfect games.  H2A isn't going to get there, so don't be happy you just have "something" and settle for it.  One last time: If we all promised to not watch the Championship league unless changes were made, the league would be a mix of Halo 1, Halo 2, and even Halo 3.  That sounds like a tournament I want to watch.  A competitive tournament where pros have to be ready to play every game.  That sounds awesome.  And we can do it, but not by silencing complainers, but by joining them to change things.  "A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves."  Society doesn't change unless people are mad and revolt.  If not, the people at the top are happy to continue raking in money.

 

If you've made it this far, you're probably ready for this to be over.  I understand how long this was, and it was just off the top of my head, so apologies for any grammatical errors.  I know this post won't be well received, but it's what needs to happen.  Don't get me wrong, I know they need to push H2A for the first tourney, I get it.  But, not adding other games in afterwards and then buying out smaller H2C tourneys?  No.  They already said H5 will replace MCC as the league game as soon as it is out.  That's what is wrong with console.  We don't even know if it will be decent yet - it probably won't be.  If we boycotted watching it, it would be changed.  It is that simple.  All in all, don't be so harsh on complainers, because ironically enough, the problem may be you.  Don't be so quick to hate, just think about what I said.  If you truly believe H2A should be the tournament game, then all the power to you.  But, do not just settle for it as I see so many people talking about how things could be better, but oh well at least it is something.  No.  Finally, don't be hypocritical.  I see so many posts on here from the same people about how the community needs to stick together, and then as soon as someone complains, you all say "Don't buy the game then we don't want you."  YOU just got done saying how the community is dwindling and needs to be built back up.  I saw one post, that got tons of positive rep saying, "Start thinking about what is best for the community, and not best for you."  WHAT?  You're playing a video game...you know, something for fun?  Why would you not want to do what is best for you.  I spent $500 to play this game - my money - I'll do what I feel is best for me, and the community, and that's why I posted this.

 

Take all my +reps. Great post man. This needs to be read by everyone.

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Just a question to anyone that decides to listen, if my Master Chief collection goes from 45gbs to 59 does that mean that I have the day 1 patch downloaded?

 

P.S That question may have sounded really stupid, but I just want to make sure.

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Maybe Shixon but I'm confident in our abilities. My backpack has plenty of room.  :lxthul:

 

 

Sounds like we're gonna have to run some customs.

 

 

I'll see you in the playlist Mr. New York!

 

 

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no but seriously....this wait tho :(

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With the embargo up, my god the Halo 1 mp ping noise is so annoying. Hope they patch it out, going to try and stream some competitive Halo 1/2/A tonight.

 

are ppl allowed to stream matchmaking today?

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no but seriously....this wait tho :(

Just remember, Bart Scott lost the game after that interview.

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Just a question to anyone that decides to listen, if my Master Chief collection goes from 45gbs to 59 does that mean that I have the day 1 patch downloaded?

 

P.S That question may have sounded really stupid, but I just want to make sure.

Yes! That means you have the day 1 patch downloaded. Congrats! 

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Yeah, they rotate the rocket spawns on some maps. I know it is like that in hang em, too. 

 

So the times are still off even after doing the update? This is crazy...other streams seem to be fixed...

Just ran around in prisoner for 12 minutes.  At the 12 minute mark camo and rockets spawned at 12:02.  For the first 6 minutes you couldn't tell if it was off or not so I had to let it run and played around with the spawns.  Your teammate would spawn for the most part how you would expect them to except for two spots.  The corner on the floor under window you'd expect your teammate to spawn on the second floor in the same corner, for the most part he was getting top spawn by the door.  The other spot was tunnel leading from bottom floor to second floor.  When halfway up your teammate usually spawns second floor right by rockets under OS 3rd floor spawn.  Instead in 6 out of 6 tries he would spawn 3rd floor OS right above it.  It's not much testing so could certainly be RNG.

 

*Edit*  I have to head out for a while but I can continue testing in a few hours if anyone wants to leave suggestions.  I'll probably test out hang 'em next since it has so many different things to test out.

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Halo PC Port Causing Halo 1 MCC’s Grenades and Weapons to Behave Improperly

 

Warning: Long read!

Hello everyone. I’m the author of the FoV thread last week that lead to a dev response and a confirmed fix. Now that the 20Gig patch is out, some Halo players have been able to test Halo 1 for other bugs and problems resulting from Halo 1’s PC port. This thread is intended to outline these problems and invite support from the Halo community to get 343 to fix them.

 

I know that many Halo 1 complaints are met with responses such as "This doesn't bother me so I don't think this is a big issue," but please hear me out. The issues I am about to outline affect gameplay, and as such change the way Halo 1 is played. Halo 1's should be respectful to the original to be "as we remember it" as we've been promised. So even if you don't care about Halo 1, please support Halo 1 players in getting these problem fixed.

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Starting Grenade Count Broken in 2v2

Status: Unfixed

*Link to image(s) here*

In Halo PC, players always spawn with 2 grenades, unlike Halo Xbox which changes starting grenade count based on the number of players in the game. In 2v2, players should start out with 4 Frag grenades each. MCC Halo 1 uses the PC system, with absolutely no option to use the original grenade settings.

This is a big issue because Halo 1’s 2v2 meta revolves around the use of powerful grenades to control spawns, control space, and bunker-bust defensive players. Using Halo PC’s grenade settings is a huge nerf to the 2v2, 1v1, etc meta specifically because it halves the number of grenades players are supposed to spawn with.

We ask that the original Xbox grenade settings be available for the sake of Halo 1 2v2.

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Hitmarker Sounds on Grenades

Status: Unfixed

Halo PC was intended to work on dial-up connections, causing many limitations. As a result, players needed to lead their shots significantly to hit targets, but the shots visible on a player's screen weren’t representative of how much lead was required. To deal with this problem, hitmarker sounds were added to let players know when their shots were hitting.

*link to chump’s lag video?*

Note that the shot lead shown in this video is no longer required in MCC, but there are still hitmarker sounds. Unfortunately, these hitmarker sounds also apply to grenades. This is a problem because Halo 1’s grenades have very large blast radiuses, and players can use the grenade hitmarker sounds to detect players that would otherwise be undetectable.

This can be greatly abused in Halo 1 when it comes to controlling player spawns. Because of Halo 1’s natural spawn system. Halo 1 player Bonesaw puts it quite well:

*Can someone get Bonesaw’s (I think it was Bonesaw’s) explanation of how spawn killing can become too abusive here? Thanks guys*

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Weapons and Powerups not Respawning Properly

Status: Potentially Fixed

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Looks good but for the hitmarkers I'd focus more on the fact that its feeding information to players in regular combat than the spawn killing aspect. Spawn killing has a very negative connotation in the general gaming community and is probably better if you dont even discuss it in this post.

 

If I'm walking by needler side of a base in BC and I casually toss a precautionary nade down the base tunnel as I wander by, hearing a beep or no beep fundamentally changes my next move. That kind of information should not be made available to a player due to a latency mechanic. My next move should not change based on a design element that was put there help people understand lag. It allows a player to essentially see through walls in a limited way and this is in no way beneficial to competitive play.

 

Leave them on for bullets and disable them for anything that uses explosive splash damage. If it's easier to remove them entirely, remove them. It would be a net gain.

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The corner on the floor under window you'd expect your teammate to spawn on the second floor in the same corner, for the most part he was getting top spawn by the door.  The other spot was tunnel leading from bottom floor to second floor.  When halfway up your teammate usually spawns second floor right by rockets under OS 3rd floor spawn.  Instead in 6 out of 6 tries he would spawn 3rd floor OS right above it.  It's not much testing so could certainly be RNG.

They could have increased the teammate spawn-block distance, and given it a "chance to block" that fades to 0 as you get farther from the spawn. If someone wants to waste an hour of their life by pulling a trigger a couple hundred times, that would be greatly appreciated ;) (HH camo corner or catwalk corner spawns would be good to test for this, since they're isolated from other spawns).

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Take all my +reps. Great post man. This needs to be read by everyone.

 

People need to do more than read it, they need to act upon it, but this community won't do that, they'll just go along with what ever 343 tells them to do.

 

People will end up settling for sub-par pseudo competitive H2A gameplay with lots of twitch viewers rather than actively working to get the most competitive Halo played at tournaments. 

 

Really, the power is in the communities hands. 343 have obviously invested HEAVILY into this e-sports malarke and it's some thing they've thought about in depth. If the community decided to boycott H2A and demanded the likes of H2C and Halo CE to be added to events then they would have no choice but be forced to use those games that WE the community have demanded. The ball is well and truly in our court, but people seem to think that 343 have all the power and that there is nothing we can do. Ironically, it's now the other way round. If enough people demand some thing, 343 MUST comply, or else they completely abandon their e-sports investments.

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