Jump to content
CyReN

Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

Recommended Posts

This guys has to be baiting us if he thinks people spam crouch in Halo 1.

There's nothing wrong with liking the way H3 plays, but a lot of people around here have turned against it in recent years. It's also worth noting that when MCC first came out Halo 4 was the most popular game in the collection for like a year so I wouldn't use popularity to form your opinion unless you're secretly an H4 fan.

H1 is still the best game though :Toxic::fire::Toxic::fire:

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Fire (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post
10 minutes ago, Silos said:

This guys has to be baiting us if he thinks people spam crouch in Halo 1.

There's nothing wrong with liking the way H3 plays, but a lot of people around here have turned against it in recent years. It's also worth noting that when MCC first came out Halo 4 was the most popular game in the collection for like a year so I wouldn't use popularity to form your opinion unless you're secretly an H4 fan.

H1 is still the best game though :Toxic::fire::Toxic::fire:

Lol in recent years. The same people who disliked it 13 years ago dislike it now. 

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
3 minutes ago, Mr Grim said:

Lol in recent years. The same people who disliked it 13 years ago dislike it now. 

That's fair. Halo 3 was when I quit Halo the first time, so I definitely understand that people haven't liked it for a while. But before Halo 3 returned as the main game like 18 months ago I think it's fair to say that people on this forum were excited for it.

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Silos said:

That's fair. Halo 3 was when I quit Halo the first time, so I definitely understand that people haven't liked it for a while. But before Halo 3 returned as the main game like 18 months ago I think it's fair to say that people on this forum were excited for it.

For campaign maybe. H3 multiplayer has never been popular around here.

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, Mr Grim said:

Lol in recent years. The same people who disliked it 13 years ago dislike it now. 

Very true.  I absolutely hated H2 when it came out and after giving it a fair shot on MCC I came to the conclusion that it is still the worst Halo game.

 

Reach is a close 2nd, but the campaign was pretty fun, so it edges out H2.

Share this post


Link to post
4 hours ago, Hootspa said:

Yes my dude, random spread even on LAN. The UTILITY WEPON in h3 is SPECIFICALLY designed so that at average engagement distance, with perfect aim there is something like a 1/4 chance it takes 5 shots to kill instead of 4. We did the math years ago and I forget the exact numbers, but it means that the winner of a BR battle is FACTUALLY more random than halo 2.

How does a team compensate for gunplay where the winner of an individual BR battle is partially random? They get around the randomness by always making sure that one or more of their teammates can shoot at an enemy with them. Teamshot in halo 2 is also extremely effective, but there was also the potential for a single player to take out an entire team with their BR alone so it wasn't as critical to be good at teamshot in h2.

Okay, but I didn't prove that teamshot is bad, I just showed that halo 3 REQUIRES teamshot whereas h1 doesn't at all and h2 doesn't require nearly as much... Well, think about this for a second. If you always need to be in a position where you can help your buddies shoot someone, and your buddies always need to be in positions where they can help you teamshot someone, what does that tell you about where you and your buddies should be positioned? Almost always, you should be near your buddies and they should be near you. In halo 3, if you go off by yourself to do something (besides pick up an actual useful weapon), just using this reasoning alone we can write that off as MOST LIKELY a mistake. In halo 1 or even halo 2, this same action could be part of a larger strategy and could give your team some advantage, but in halo 3 this is simply a mistake because if two baddies roll up on you there's nothing you can do.

Analysis over. Yes I'm only discussing the utility weapon in isolation and there are grenades and power weapons that also affect gameplay and strategies. Now, to deal with the inevitable excuses you're going to come up with to try and explain how grenades/power weapons gives you all the individual power you need and my analysis is wrong, just remember that in the other halo games you STILL have grenades/power weapons that you can leverage in ADDITION to your utility weapon which already has enough power to take out a team by itself alone.

Halo 3 is plain old LESS SKILLFUL. There is NO GETTING AROUND IT.

You would think more people get this, for me it's CE>Reach v7>H2>H3 because teamshot is the most boring shit. While Reach v7 still suffered from teamshot being the only viable strat (feels the same for H2 and H3 even if it's amplified in 3 due to the shitty BR and power weapons being hot garbage) that's what I played the most and eventually figured out why I dislike teamshot so much - it eliminated a ton of strategies and stuff like flanking because you as an individual player can't do much - start shooting somebody in the back? 2 people turn around and finish you off before you kill one of them, if they are missing you might trade one of the 2.
Reach v7 at least had an okay sniper and rocket launcher that could have an impact, camo was okay-ish and overshield was ass being only a single layer, grenade launcher inconsistent at best even if the idea was cool. So we did play a lot of gold pro customs making the DMR a 4 shot kill back in the day, TTK of 1.2 seconds, basically the best you could do if you wanted to make Reach more like CE, fast item timers to encourage movement, room based maps where teams have to set up for items that spawn or think about splitting up to contest multiple items at once - where the "competitive" Halo scene preferred playing midship get some people on the side towers to camp the entire game and shoot their BR at respawning people - no power weapons to worry about, no reason to move unless you are playing CTF where you might only have 3/4 or 2/4 people camping.

This is the entire argument here about utility weapons influencing the game so much, it's subjective after all but in my opinion a good shooter allows individuals to make big plays. In Halo's after CE you cannot really do that all that much, teamshot narrows your decision making into nothingness if you want to stay effective, pair that with slow item timers and you have the boring mess Halo has been for 16 years now.
I am not saying Halo CE is perfect btw, I transitioned from Halo to proper arena shooters like Quake roughly 6 years ago because of the reasons I mentioned above (and some additional ones like PC just being nicer and smoother for shooters), so yeah I am totally biased - like everybody because we are talking opinions.
At the end of the day the discussion shouldn't be about convincing others that your vision of a perfect Halo should be what everyone accepts but it should make for an interesting discussion learning what others like and want from a Halo game, maybe it helps people rethinking what they want themselves as well.

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

I feel like people pigeon hold themselves too much sometimes. Like I love ce style halo where its individualistic but I also love halo 3s brand of close quarters team combat (i say close because of the brs shorter range obviously). I also love vehicle to vehicle combat, and sandbox interaction. It doesn't mean I wouldn't change things about either game, but it does mean I spend less time lamenting and more time enjoying myself.

Its not necessary to just like one thing. I guess the opposite is also true, you don't necessarily have to have diverse set of tastes. All I'm saying is don't force yourself to do anything or be anything. 

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Mr Grim said:

For campaign maybe. H3 multiplayer has never been popular around here.

I wouldn't really go out on that limb. I've found more beyond posters on H3 MCC than any other type of MCC/H5

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Warlord Wossman said:

You would think more people get this, for me it's CE>Reach v7>H2>H3 because teamshot is the most boring shit. While Reach v7 still suffered from teamshot being the only viable strat (feels the same for H2

 

 

Share this post


Link to post

If everybody would consistently pull those off it could have been a point, but they don't.
The fact those are highlight clips gives you a rough idea why the TTK of those combos might not matter as much as the base TTK of the H2 BR.

  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, you only sees BXRs in montage highlights...

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, Warlord Wossman said:

<snip>

Yeah I agree with everything you said. The post I wrote comes across as more apologetic to halo 2 than i really feel.

In my opinion, halo 3 sort of exposed how dominant of a strategy teamshotting is in halo 2 and affected how people went back and played h2. Sort of like if a new chess AI demonstrated that some opening move is optimal and now all other openings go out the window and all anyone is focused on is playing that opening the best. Halo 3 affected how AVERAGE players played halo 2 which is why I’m slightly defensive of it despite its flaws.

Share this post


Link to post

If you complain about a lack of individual empowerment then rank reach over H2, you’re a fucking idiot.  

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Thonking (+0) 1
  • Salt (-1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
8 hours ago, Silos said:

H1 is still the best game though :Toxic::fire::Toxic::fire:

When played on old hardware with the updated mod - it's truly an experience. Imagine if we could have brand new computers running that very same thing.. 

The dream. 

  • Like (+1) 3
  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Fire (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, Warlord Wossman said:

You would think more people get this, for me it's CE>Reach v7>H2>H3 because teamshot is the most boring shit. While Reach v7 still suffered from teamshot being the only viable strat (feels the same for H2 and H3 even if it's amplified in 3 due to the shitty BR and power weapons being hot garbage) that's what I played the most and eventually figured out why I dislike teamshot so much - it eliminated a ton of strategies and stuff like flanking because you as an individual player can't do much - start shooting somebody in the back? 2 people turn around and finish you off before you kill one of them, if they are missing you might trade one of the 2.
Reach v7 at least had an okay sniper and rocket launcher that could have an impact, camo was okay-ish and overshield was ass being only a single layer, grenade launcher inconsistent at best even if the idea was cool. So we did play a lot of gold pro customs making the DMR a 4 shot kill back in the day, TTK of 1.2 seconds, basically the best you could do if you wanted to make Reach more like CE, fast item timers to encourage movement, room based maps where teams have to set up for items that spawn or think about splitting up to contest multiple items at once - where the "competitive" Halo scene preferred playing midship get some people on the side towers to camp the entire game and shoot their BR at respawning people - no power weapons to worry about, no reason to move unless you are playing CTF where you might only have 3/4 or 2/4 people camping.

This is the entire argument here about utility weapons influencing the game so much, it's subjective after all but in my opinion a good shooter allows individuals to make big plays. In Halo's after CE you cannot really do that all that much, teamshot narrows your decision making into nothingness if you want to stay effective, pair that with slow item timers and you have the boring mess Halo has been for 16 years now.
I am not saying Halo CE is perfect btw, I transitioned from Halo to proper arena shooters like Quake roughly 6 years ago because of the reasons I mentioned above (and some additional ones like PC just being nicer and smoother for shooters), so yeah I am totally biased - like everybody because we are talking opinions.
At the end of the day the discussion shouldn't be about convincing others that your vision of a perfect Halo should be what everyone accepts but it should make for an interesting discussion learning what others like and want from a Halo game, maybe it helps people rethinking what they want themselves as well.

I dont know man, sounds like you're just bad at H3. Did you know how popular the game was??

  • Simms (+1) 1
  • Toxic (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
55 minutes ago, Boyo said:

If you complain about a lack of individual empowerment then rank reach over H2, you’re a fucking idiot.  

That's not the only criteria I ranked the games in but call me an idiot if that's all you got to say.
BXR is not saving a bland (from a competitive viewpoint) game, and the combos with melee are also situational, it doesn't really compare to a utility weapon with overall low TTK like the CE pistol. Generally it's pretty insane how some H2 fanboys claim the button combos are the most skillful shit - they might seem like it compared to how shallow the rest of the game is but that's about it.

I would rank Reach higher than H2 because we have a forge that brings huge potential for good maps, people gonna hate me for saying it but their fav H2 maps namely midship, sanctuary, warlock and lockout are not all that great for the specific style of Halo I had mentioned in my longer comment above. Sure Reach v7 also largely had shit maps in the pool but with forge you really enable making maps that are not just the typical 4v4 symmetrical "run at each other and meet in the middle" sort of maps.
Already said individual strength is Reach v7 even with zero bloom is total trash with 1.6s TTK making it as much of a teamshot hell as H3 but that's why we played 4sk DMR setting back in 2013-2014 and modded PC Reach recently to feature a 3sk pistol which was the most similar gun to the CE pistol the series has even seen (even if not official ofc).

I totally understand why people love H2 and H3, they have good reasons to do so but I was discussing another style of Halo were teamshot becomes more optional than mandatory, if you read again I also said that Halo has been teamshot for the last 16 years which includes Reach anyways.

As a bonus if you wanted to see some footage that displays nice mechanical execution in a shooter I would suggest this over H2 button combos:

 

  • Like (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post
10 hours ago, Silos said:

This guys has to be baiting us if he thinks people spam crouch in Halo 1.

There's nothing wrong with liking the way H3 plays, but a lot of people around here have turned against it in recent years. It's also worth noting that when MCC first came out Halo 4 was the most popular game in the collection for like a year so I wouldn't use popularity to form your opinion unless you're secretly an H4 fan.

H1 is still the best game though :Toxic::fire::Toxic::fire:

Halo 1s strafe meta IS limited to crouching. Unless you want to get slammed by 3sks.

Halo 3s out BR on mainstage > 3sk or H2 glitches.

  • Downvote (-1) 6

Share this post


Link to post
3 minutes ago, Toastomgi said:

Halo 1s strafe meta IS limited to crouching. Unless you want to get slammed by 3sks.

Halo 3s out BR on mainstage > 3sk or H2 glitches.

Okay, I finally feel safe saying it. You're bad. :rekt:

Share this post


Link to post

Waypoint and Reddit aren't sending us their best. Some, I assume, are good people. 

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Fire (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
36 minutes ago, Warlord Wossman said:

bland (from a competitive viewpoint) game...insane H2 fanboys...shallow

Forge is great and mods are great but miss a huge part of what made Halo 2 iconic.  The base game was just good, no need for custom maps or modded settings.  

And yes, button combos added a unique, skill based mechanic to the shooter, bringing its overall gameplay to a new depth.  Halo 2 captured something that no other game has been able to replicate.  

Share this post


Link to post
12 hours ago, Toastomgi said:

I think content creators(ex. Red vs blue etc). Montage creators(ex. Phurion etc) and third party (ex. Th3f etc) would all agree H3 is the best game when it comes to entertainment and creativity.

Ar starts tf?

Random spread? LAN my dude.

The sandbox was perfected on H3. Data shows H3 had the most popularity when it comes to  activity and content wise. After H3 everything tanked.

Bungie is the sole reason everyone is on this forum. I dont get the hate here.

 

53 minutes ago, Toastomgi said:

Halo 1s strafe meta IS limited to crouching. Unless you want to get slammed by 3sks.

Halo 3s out BR on mainstage > 3sk or H2 glitches.

Oh man reddit really is leaking. You're going to kill getting (rightfully) shit on here until you begin to acknowledge the many stupid decisions Halo 3 has in its core design. 

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Upvote (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Toastomgi said:

Halo 3s out BR on mainstage > 3sk or H2 glitches.

Yeah I love when I get out-BR'd because the game refunds bullets into my magazine after I mysteriously drop shots

On LAN

  • Like (+1) 5
  • Upvote (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post
43 minutes ago, Boyo said:

Forge is great and mods are great but miss a huge part of what made Halo 2 iconic.  The base game was just good, no need for custom maps or modded settings.  

And yes, button combos added a unique, skill based mechanic to the shooter, bringing its overall gameplay to a new depth.  Halo 2 captured something that no other game has been able to replicate.  

I respect that opinion even if I don't agree with it.
The maps in Halo have been lackluster for arena style gameplay ever since CE, which did only have a few decent ones imo but better than none. I cannot think of a single good arena map in Halo 2 if I am honest, they all seem to focus on something other than creating strong control spots for items and choke points for cycling items which would be one of the biggest parts of arena map design if you ask me.
And it makes sense, they know it's not mainly about items anymore since they slowed down item timers which implies they want people to kill each other with their starting weapon more. Sure there are a lot of pistol kills in CE but the game didn't hesitate rewarding people with different guns more frequently and many maps had more items which lead to maps that are more build around the items themselves than just combat.

But I guess that's Halo for you these days, like you said in the infinite thread just now people like midship because it's constant action, almost seems like a warm up only map compared to any arena shooter, all about combat all strategical decisions based on important items stripped away.
Halo might still have arena elements at that point but it's as hollow as it gets on maps like midship.
Call it elitism I guess but I have the feeling many people here who only played Halo and no pure arena shooter misinterpret what the arena part is about, from what I am reading lately with people wanting weak ass power weapons with slow timers so you don't have to worry about them Halo sounds much closer to Call of Duty with equal starting weapons where it's all positioning and combat, items play little to no role, just that with longer TTK than CoD it devolves into teamshot meta only and at that point I would rather play actual CoD than Halo because it leaves the player with more tactical options.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
20 minutes ago, Warlord Wossman said:

Call it elitism

You play modded settings of reach with forge kids in 2020.  You sound exactly as I would suspect.  

Share this post


Link to post
44 minutes ago, MultiLockOn said:

 

Oh man reddit really is leaking. You're going to kill getting (rightfully) shit on here until you begin to acknowledge the many stupid decisions Halo 3 has in its core design. 

This forum Is the closest to Waypoint when it comes to game choice and and likeability.

Until you proof your opinion is skill based, meaning your good at the game and valid, idgaf about how much you despise H3.

H3 is like The Dark Knight in the Batman series. YOU CANT DENY Its the best in the series. The other two are still great. 

  • Downvote (-1) 7

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use & Privacy Policy.