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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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10 hours ago, JordanB said:

Gotta say I am a fan of having infinite ammo on the utility weapon. And also grenades. I'd rather grenades be supplied all throughout the map then spawn with 2 and not be able to find any afterwards.

Now do I want to remove reloading, or implement auto-reload after a kill, idk I'd want to play with those settings before going that far. For auto-reload I could see someone getting upset when they shoot 3 enemies once or twice along with a couple misses, gets all assists, but doesn't get credit for any kills and now can't help on the last enemy and dies bec they had to reload.

I actually like that idea of a reload based on a kill, I’ve had many moments of dying to a lack of ammo, but I still believe this is a balancing mechanic. 

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I'd rather get a decently strong utility first before thinking about infinite ammo. 

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Personally, I never thought primary style ammo constraints really promoted movement. Mostly just encouraged consistent weapon swapping and scavenging ammo, which can be done from relative safety. You don't really have to move very far to achieve this when maintaining a position. If your goal is to never leave the exact coordinates you sit on indefinitely, however, and can't be bothered to top off your ammo, then the term "tough shit" comes to mind. If you  want that position soo badly, than that "resourcefulness" stage of it is a part of the process, and necessary in order to present an opening for teams to retaliate. Otherwise, we might as well end games the second the "better" team secures the power position; the rest of the match will become pointless slog.

Infinite ammo is tempting to apply on paper, and something I'm willing to humor on a Utility weapon, but it isn't without it's own issues. For example, prefiring and suppressive fire can get obnoxious fast if the Utility isn't tempered by a slow rate of fire or a slow reload. Haphazardly placing shots is kinda the opposite of a precision shooter, in my eyes. Not appropriate for what we want out of a Utility, at least.

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Perhaps an armor ability that sucks nearby pick ups to the user could aide them in their quest to never move.  

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I don't really understand the "sit in one spot" argument. If all I do is sit in one spot against an equal opponent, I'm probably going to lose bec I'm either A) not playing the objective properly or B) not securing power ups/weapons. So my opponent is either going to beat me by getting the objective or beat me by securing power ups/weapons.

The debate for infinite ammo has nothing to do with "I want to sit in this corner and never move for the entire game no matter what".

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4 minutes ago, JordanB said:

not securing power ups/weapons.

In their version of Halo, there are no pick ups, no power weapons.  That’s what makes their argument especially funny.  “I want to have ammo and grenades delivered to me but others players can’t pick up better weapons to attack my position with”.

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1 hour ago, Boyo said:

In their version of Halo, there are no pick ups, no power weapons.  That’s what makes their argument especially funny.  “I want to have ammo and grenades delivered to me but others players can’t pick up better weapons to attack my position with”.

Was about to point that out but you beat me to it. Lol they probably don’t even want grenades. 

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On 1/12/2020 at 10:51 AM, Ramirez77 said:

Two players spawn in on a flat plane, always facing each other when they spawn.

They both have (HITSCAN!!!) rifles, and infinite ammo.  Health is a fixed amount that does not regenerate to prevent any amount of mid-fight inconsistency.

They both strafe in opposite directions in a completely predictable pattern that is controlled by the computer and does not ever vary between matches, the only thing they are capable of doing is aiming at and shooting each other.  Once one of them kills the other a point is tallied and they both respawn facing each other so as to not introduce any randomness into the strafe pattern.  First side to 25 points wins.

In the team based mode, players would spawn in a + formation with people on the same team being top and left / bottom and right respectively, being restricted to only shooting the person directly across from them, and only being allowed to aid their teammate in their fight once they kill their own designated target first.  But again to prevent unpredictability once anyone gets a kill the remaining players would reset in a 2v1 configuration like /\ as the dead fourth person spectates.  Once the one person on the disadvantaged team dies or manages to kill his two opponents all points are tallied and everyone is again reset in a + formation. First side to 50 points wins.

Thus we can achieve the ultimate goal of eliminating as much brain-hurty depth bad game design as possible.   For a competitive shooter should never exceed the bounds of being a sterile test of pure physical reflexes.

No need to thank me for gifting you with the most competitive FPS ever conceived, just let me have 10% of all the Esports earnings as a royalty.

I think you all forgot this gem from @Ramirez77 because it sums up in a hyperbolic way what exactly is being asked for

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2 hours ago, Boyo said:

In their version of Halo, there are no pick ups, no power weapons.  That’s what makes their argument especially funny.  “I want to have ammo and grenades delivered to me but others players can’t pick up better weapons to attack my position with”.

Funny of you to assume they want grenades.

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On 1/12/2020 at 9:42 AM, My Namez BEAST said:

Grenades are funny. Why do you spawn with 2? Again, it rewards the dead player and is a big reason obj modes like KoTH play so awkwardly. The team that dies the most nades the most. Its garbage. Nades should be on a cooldown timer. Like pretty much every other game has learned. Makes no sense to keep supplying the kids that die with more nukes. 

I’m not sure but I think he wants grenades on a cooldown timer that does not reset upon death.  

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We don't need infinite ammo, we just need more ammo. The Halo 1 pistol has a 12 round clip and you can hold up to 120 in reserve. That's plenty. The Battle Rifle should be 36/360, since it's 3 rounds per shot. The 108 they've been giving us ever since Halo 2 is a joke.

I'll go balls-out and say not only bring back 4 frag starts, but also have 4 grenade types, and let the player carry up to 4 of each.

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7 minutes ago, Larry Sizemore said:

We don't need infinite ammo, we just need more ammo. The Halo 1 pistol has a 12 round clip and you can hold up to 120 in reserve. That's plenty. The Battle Rifle should be 36/360, since it's 3 rounds per shot. The 108 they've been giving us ever since Halo 2 is a joke.

I'll go balls-out and say not only bring back 4 frag starts, but also have 4 grenade types, and let the player carry up to 4 of each.

But then we’ll have even more grenade spam than we have now 

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8 minutes ago, Larry Sizemore said:

have 4 grenade types, and let the player carry up to 4 of each

Frag and Plasma are a given.  What do the other two grenade types do?  What is unique, specific to them?

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17 minutes ago, Arlong said:

But then we’ll have even more grenade spam than we have now 

Okay...

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11 hours ago, Arlong said:

But then we’ll have even more grenade spam than we have now 

Okay, r/halo.

11 hours ago, Boyo said:

Frag and Plasma are a given.  What do the other two grenade types do?  What is unique, specific to them?

TBD, but the vortex grenade from SPV3 (drags closebyenemies, weapons, scenery, and whatever else into the center of its radius, capable of causing gnarly chain reactions) is an idea. Someone pitched teleporter nades (you throw the nade, wherever it lands is where you end up) a while back, I think that's crazy enough to work, with some restrictions in place. Maybe preserve the Halo 1 frag grenades, and spin off some of the traits of the more current frag grenades (bouncing, quick detonation, concussion effect, etc) into a new grenade type.

We could brainstorm this. The goal is to empower the players with weapons and grenades, not shitty spiderman mechanics.

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Spike grenades not only explode but also fire off secondary projectiles that ricochet.  Because the projectiles are always fired perpendicularly away from the surface the grenade is stuck to, they can be used as a directional attack.  Stick it on the ceiling and it will fire downward.  Because the ricocheting projectiles only travel a certain distance before disappearing, the smaller the space a spike grenade goes off in, the greater the chance of dealing damage to a target in that space.  

A spike grenade has an asymmetric blast radius that interacts with the map around it.  Neither can be said for frags or stickies. 

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40 minutes ago, Larry Sizemore said:

the vortex grenade from SPV3 (drags closebyenemies, weapons, scenery, and whatever else into the center of its radius, capable of causing gnarly chain reactions)

While you can trash a play area in campaign because you are constantly moving through them, multiplayer maps don’t have as many moveable set pieces and even if they did, would we really want them to be tossed all over the place after a few vortex grenades?

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Combine grenades and equipment together, allow players to carry a max of 1 or 2 different types of grenades that can be swapped out like normal weapons, and introduce multiple grenade variants. 

A system like this would allow us to cherry pick grenades for game modes and maps better. For example, we could simultaneously have:

1. A normal bounce frag.

2. A CE style wait to settle, but stronger frag.

3. A weak and small blast radius instasplode frag.

4. A Cookable precision frag.

I honestly think that grenade types could massively be expanded upon, and greatly bring some variety in an area of Halo that has stagnated for too long.

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5 minutes ago, The Tyco said:

3. A weak and small blast radius instasplode frag.

4. A Cookable precision frag.

Wouldn’t a Bruteshot and Grenade Launcher fill those two roles?  

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14 minutes ago, Boyo said:

Wouldn’t a Bruteshot and Grenade Launcher fill those two roles?  

If it's in the grenade/equipment slot, not really. Frees up your weapon slots and allows them to be better paired with weapons, while having stricter grenade style ammunition constraints. Could introduce some interesting combos without putting them into a strict power weapon category.

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6 minutes ago, The Tyco said:

If it's in the grenade/equipment slot, not really. Frees up your weapon slots and allows them to be better paired with weapons, while having stricter grenade style ammunition constraints. Could introduce some interesting combos without putting them into a strict power weapon category.

Brute and GL are more interesting and less repetitive. H3 had it perfect, the only thing I'd want is for Fire Bombs to actually be used.

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1 minute ago, HeX Reapers said:

the only thing I'd want is for Fire Bombs to actually be used.

Used for what purpose?  Damage over time?  Lingering area of effect?  Burning something down?  

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Just now, HeX Reapers said:

Brute and GL are more interesting and less repetitive. H3 had it perfect, the only thing I'd want is for Fire Bombs to actually be used.

They were just spitballed examples anyway. The point being I think expanding on grenade types can give us some more options for our competitive settings in the same way weapons can. The problem is we've stuck to a very rigid system for soo long, when we can do it better.

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Just now, Boyo said:

Used for what purpose?  Damage over time?  Lingering area of effect?  Burning something down?  

First two. Basically what the Splinter should have been. I'd also make Frags have a resting fuse like CE.

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3 minutes ago, The Tyco said:

The problem is we've stuck to a very rigid system for soo long

The Conduit is not thrown like a traditional grenade; it is instantly fired from the user’s left hand.  A short range, continuous beam transfers energy shields from an impacted player to the user.  The beam lasts for 7/10ths of a second, raising the user’s shields by 1/10th a shield layer for every 1/10th of a second on target.  

Shield Barriers (objects on maps that players cannot travel through) can be disabled with Conduit grenades.  Fusion coils can be drained of energy, rendering them inert.  Time on target determines the amount of shields a player can transfer before before the burst runs out.  

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