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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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1 hour ago, TheIcePrincess said:

I think a big thing to this is that we misconstrue and misuse the term "opinion" like that. Opinions aren't arguments in that sense. It isn't your opinion the Earth is flat, you came to be convinced of that, regardless of whether or not you like it. The "opinion" is just that. The like, regardless of the fact. Not the argument, or validity of the argument with said facts. Hence why you can like something in spite of how poorly made it could be, just because it appeals to you. That's not a proper sentence or rebuttal.

"opinion
[əˈpinyən]
NOUN
a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing."

An opinion is a view or judgement on something. It does not require that "something" to be a subjective matter. I can "view" the earth as being flat; in my opinion the earth is flat. Factually, that's an incorrect opinion. The existence of proof refuting an opinion does not suddenly make it not an opinion, it makes it a factually incorrect opinion. i.e. your opinion can be wrong. 

Your assertion that opinions are only about "likes" is false. Opinions about subjective material, such as enjoyment or taste, cannot be "wrong," but that does not mean that all opinions cannot be wrong. 

It's not a misuse of the term opinion, it's just a dumb opinion.

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1 hour ago, TheIcePrincess said:

I think a big thing to this is that we misconstrue and misuse the term "opinion" like that. Opinions aren't arguments in that sense. It isn't your opinion the Earth is flat, you came to be convinced of that, regardless of whether or not you like it. The "opinion" is just that. The like, regardless of the fact. Not the argument, or validity of the argument with said facts. Hence why you can like something in spite of how poorly made it could be, just because it appeals to you. That's not a proper sentence or rebuttal.

If there's a difference between a "preference" and an "opinion", with the former being a purely subjective statement of personal enjoyment vs. the latter which is vaguely cohesive position on something supported by a nebula of purported facts, then an opinion can absolutely be wrong because the facts on which it is based can be objectively (or as close to objectively as is virtually possible) disproved. 

As far as it pertains to, for example, yours + Beast's eternal struggle in this thread, you both have your preference but you absolutely have an opinion as well. 

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47 minutes ago, BigShow36 said:

"opinion
[əˈpinyən]
NOUN
a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing."

An opinion is a view or judgement on something. It does not require that "something" to be a subjective matter. I can "view" the earth as being flat; in my opinion the earth is flat. Factually, that's an incorrect opinion. The existence of proof refuting an opinion does not suddenly make it not an opinion, it makes it a factually incorrect opinion. i.e. your opinion can be wrong. 

Your assertion that opinions are only about "likes" is false. Opinions about subjective material, such as enjoyment or taste, cannot be "wrong," but that does not mean that all opinions cannot be wrong. 

It's not a misuse of the term opinion, it's just a dumb opinion.

Dude, the definition literally says "not necessarily based on fact or knowledge". That is my point. You have a view or judgement of something, potentially not based on fact or knowledge, just in spite of it. Key phrase being "judgement about something". Now, again, you don't have the opinion the Earth is flat, whether or not it's flat is almost irrelevant to your opinion on it. Your judgement would be based on whether or not you like it being flat, for example, AFTER the fact. However, the Earth is spherical, we know this. Confirmed, as a fact, through observational data. You're making a factually incorrect statement at that point if you say it is flat. It straight up isn't an opinion just because you use the word in a sentence. You're just using words improperly, lol.

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On 6/6/2019 at 11:52 PM, The Tyco said:

Opinions are formed around a factual basis with subjective feelings formed around that information. If that basis is false, or lacking information, it in turn can color and change your subjective feelings toward your final opinion, making the opinion ultimately invalid. This what a real "wrong" opinion is.

Invalid is the key word here. A valid opinion will always hold weight in a conversation, even if its contrary to an alternative opinion. 

An excellent example of two alternative "right" opinions would be hitscan versus projectile.

 

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21 minutes ago, TheIcePrincess said:

Dude, the definition literally says "not necessarily based on fact or knowledge". That is my point. You have a view or judgement of something, potentially not based on fact or knowledge, just in spite of it. Key phrase being "judgement about something". Now, again, you don't have the opinion the Earth is flat, whether or not it's flat is almost irrelevant to your opinion on it. Your judgement would be based on whether or not you like it being flat, for example, AFTER the fact. However, the Earth is spherical, we know this. Confirmed, as a fact, through observational data. You're making a factually incorrect statement at that point if you say it is flat. It straight up isn't an opinion just because you use the word in a sentence. You're just using words improperly, lol.

Let's use a different example:

In my opinion, your opinion is wrong. 

Now where do you go? 

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Just now, BigShow36 said:

Let's use a different example:

In my opinion, your opinion is wrong. 

Now where do you go? 

You'd be making a claim that I may or may not argue against. But at that point the interaction evolves from opinion to argument, so I don't get the point. You're not gonna be proving an opinion wrong, either way.

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Believing that vaccines cause autism is being factually wrong.  It's not an opinion, it's not a value judgement, it's just an incorrect belief.

Believing that vaccines are bad directly because they cause autism is a "wrong opinion".  It's a value judgement based on misinformation.

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10 minutes ago, Ramirez77 said:

Believing that vaccines cause autism is being factually wrong.  It's not an opinion, it's not a value judgement, it's just an incorrect belief.

Believing that vaccines are bad directly because they cause autism is a "wrong opinion". 

No, that's still factually incorrect, it's not opinionated.

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I honestly don't know why I still come to this thread.

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10 hours ago, TheIcePrincess said:

No, that's still factually incorrect, it's not opinionated.

Have you ever held a stance on anything, had a debate/conversation with someone who viewed it differently, and changed your mind based on what the other person has said? It seems you have these "thoughts" (I can't even call them opinions because I don't even know what one is, according to you) and nobody could ever convince you to change your mind.

btw if I say Halo 5 is a terrible game:

  1. Is this an opinion
    1. If yes, am I wrong
    2. If no, how is this not an opinion.
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You don’t choose the contrarian life. The contrarian life chooses you.

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3 hours ago, JordanB said:

Have you ever held a stance on anything, had a debate/conversation with someone who viewed it differently, and changed your mind based on what the other person has said? It seems you have these "thoughts" (I can't even call them opinions because I don't even know what one is, according to you) and nobody could ever convince you to change your mind.

btw if I say Halo 5 is a terrible game:

  1. Is this an opinion
    1. If yes, am I wrong
    2. If no, how is this not an opinion.

1.) Yes, that's an opinion. It's based on your like or dislike of something, without any in depth justification. It could be held on its own, regardless of an argument.
1.1) No, you're not wrong if you feel that way.
1.2) What would not be an opinion would be to say "Halo 5 is a terrible game because x", because then you're beginning an argument. An argument, ideally shouldn't exactly be rooted in opinionated matters, but deal with facts and potential evidence. Your opinion that it's terrible may or may not change based on the argument, too, because of the fact your opinion may not be rooted in the facts presented, but just how the game doesn't appeal to you, etc. You know, in spite of, not because. You wouldn't be proving or arguing against an opinion at that point, either, you'd be debating the argument presented. 

Best way to define the two mostly lays in how the opinion is what you feel about something, and the argument or fact is what that something definitively is, or would be, regardless of your feelings to it. And there is a tangible difference. 

 

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It's my opinion that opinions can be wrong. Can you provide me with facts that I'm wrong?

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9 minutes ago, MultiLockOn said:

There's the hex we all love

You are the dust on my floor and I am the vacuum cleaner

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57 minutes ago, JordanB said:

It's my opinion that opinions can be wrong. Can you provide me with facts that I'm wrong?

As language currently stands, improper word use, sure, lol.

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Sweet.......

Baby........

Jesus.......

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2 hours ago, HeX Reapers said:

You are the dust on my floor and I am the vacuum cleaner

This took me ten minutes

mSgJpkP.jpg

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I have an English degree so I'm the only one here who's qualified to comment on this subject.

Opinions are strictly defined by their relation to my own. Therefore any opinion that matches mine is "right" while any opinion that does not is "wrong." Subsequently, opinions can be wrong. I win Bye bye.

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49 minutes ago, Mr Grim said:

I have an English degree so I'm the only one here who's qualified to comment on this subject.

Opinions are strictly defined by their relation to my own. Therefore any opinion that matches mine is "right" while any opinion that does not is "wrong." Subsequently, opinions can be wrong. I win Bye bye.

Oh so you have an English degree? Interesting. Yeah I'll have fries with that.

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1 minute ago, HeX Reapers said:

Oh so you have an English degree? Interesting. Yeah I'll have fries with that.

This McDonald bich you need be more Pacific than that

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On 9/13/2019 at 4:01 AM, BigShow36 said:

In my opinion the earth is flat. 

That's not an opinion, that's a belief. No-one is "of the opinion" that the earth is flat, they believe the earth is flat.

If you're going to get pedantic at least do it properly. Opinion is a judgement based on facts known to you at that time. A belief is based on faith in the absence or denial of fact.

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