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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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6 hours ago, Basu said:

Just separate mkb and controllers in Matchmaking. Doesn't the Xbone support mkb or was that a rumor? 

Outside of stuff like Grifball and coop campaign this absolutely has to be enforced because there's no way they're gonna nail aim assist and bullet mag settings to perfectly balance the two. 

This ^

 

They just need to separate matchmaking based on input type.  The xbox supports mouse and keyboard right now, its up to devs to implement it. They could also allow people to "opt in" for mixed matchmaking in social should they desire.  Ranked it should just be off the table entirely.

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Does anyone have the Promod v4 settings back on H4? I'm also looking for the TopMid/EU settings too.

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6 hours ago, Apoll0 said:

This ^

 

They just need to separate matchmaking based on input type.  The xbox supports mouse and keyboard right now, its up to devs to implement it. They could also allow people to "opt in" for mixed matchmaking in social should they desire.  Ranked it should just be off the table entirely.

I think having them both together at first should at least be tested. If it’s a matter of choice to use kbm or controller then it’s kind of fair outside computers running the game better.

Think about how Fortnite is, they let the players choose. And there are some great controller players that have done well in tournies like Ghost Aden and Nickmercs vs kbm pros. Not to mention building is waaaaaay op on that game with keybinds. 

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On 7/3/2019 at 9:35 AM, HeX Reapers said:

Just found out EU settings were a thing in H4.

I’d enjoy watching no sprint settings EU tournaments, I loved promod more though because of its movement speed

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Promod reduced player model size which increased strafing effectiveness.

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@Hard Way You have direct contact to like Postums and all those guys, right? I know it's not technically in your field, but could you PLEASE push for a more streamlined way to obtain Matchmaking maps and game types? Perhaps it could be through the "See maps in this playlist" feature? This would be such a great move for people who want to set up custom lobbies without having to go through a bunch of MM games hoping for the right map/mode combo to come up.

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Man I wish map voting or Veto would come back into halo. You know I never hated map voting simply because it meant I got something good nearly every time. Ain’t no one give a damn because there’s that one asshole who likes snowbound over pit BRS. 

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34 minutes ago, Arlong said:

Man I wish map voting or Veto would come back into halo. You know I never hated map voting simply because it meant I got something good nearly every time. Ain’t no one give a damn because there’s that one asshole who likes snowbound over pit BRS. 

I know there is a negative to Vetoing but I can never remember what it is. 

Someone remind me please?

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Veto is random.  You could veto something tolerable yet non-ideal like Snowbound BR's just to end up with something terrible like Isolation AR's, you have no control.  Map voting has it's own problems too of course but it's better.

I guess I'll just point that out while I'm here. Map voting leads to mob rule.  Only the most popular of gametypes or maps ever get voted, you're shit out of luck if you like something more niche.  You want to play Containment?  Too bad we only play 24/7 Coagulation round these parts.

To me the most ideal system is CSGO's, just let people queue for specific maps/settings, and then implement some sort of priority list for second best choice if no one is currently playing what you queued for.

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Literally nothing wrong with veto, unless there's a shit ton of terrible gametypes in the playlist but that isn't really vetos fault and getting a random gametype would be even worse. 

 

Voting is cancer though. Thank god that shit is gone. You don't want to play Lockout/Middy/Pit all day? Tough luck because that's all you get. 

Veto also allows the devs to collect data on which gametypes are routinely skipped and make adjustments towards better gametype management. It also allows to have niche and special gametype like Shotty Snipers in Social Slayer which are always skipped on veto. 

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15 hours ago, logan said:

I think having them both together at first should at least be tested. If it’s a matter of choice to use kbm or controller then it’s kind of fair outside computers running the game better.

Think about how Fortnite is, they let the players choose. And there are some great controller players that have done well in tournies like Ghost Aden and Nickmercs vs kbm pros. Not to mention building is waaaaaay op on that game with keybinds. 

They have like 1 or 2 console players finishing in the top 100. KB&M should be separated from console with only social playlists as an exception. Maybe the custom browser too.

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I've been playing today, and I feel like my shots aren't working most of the time.

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14 hours ago, HeX Reapers said:

@Hard Way You have direct contact to like Postums and all those guys, right? I know it's not technically in your field, but could you PLEASE push for a more streamlined way to obtain Matchmaking maps and game types? Perhaps it could be through the "See maps in this playlist" feature? This would be such a great move for people who want to set up custom lobbies without having to go through a bunch of MM games hoping for the right map/mode combo to come up.

I’ll definitely bring that up. It’s a great idea.

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1 hour ago, Hard Way said:

I’ll definitely bring that up. It’s a great idea.

and bring up the east us 2 issue for Europe players

 

Americans dont like it, we don't like it. 

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8 hours ago, ripharambe said:

They have like 1 or 2 console players finishing in the top 100. KB&M should be separated from console with only social playlists as an exception. Maybe the custom browser too.

Still should be tested first before separating the community. Plus you gotta think that sweaty halo controller players will be more common even if crossplat is on since console has been halo’s legacy, people just like what they’re used to a lot.

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Veto is the way to go hands down. 

  • It gives immediate feedback to devs about which maps/gametypes are total shit.  They try to do that now based on quit rates... but that's such a shitty metric because people quit for all kinds of reasons. If you veto a map, its because you don't want to play it.  there is no other reason.
  • The uncertainty of what the next gametype could be means that by default, people tend to not veto things that are at least OK, increasing variety.  While nobody wants to play shit, you should play things that are "Meh" every once in a while.  Variety for variety's sake is a good thing. It allows the really good shit to never get stale.
  • Veto rules can be setup multiple ways.  It could only be a map veto, gametype veto or both so you can set that for whatever will serve the playlist best.  Voting is binary. The only way to change it is to change how many choices you have. Or have a "none" option and start another round of voting... which makes it worse.

 

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@HeX Reapers, ticket submitted. I got a direct response from Duck asking after I posted the idea, and he asked me to submit an official ticket for it. I just did it. Fingers crossed.

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15 hours ago, Apoll0 said:

Veto is the way to go hands down. 

  • It gives immediate feedback to devs about which maps/gametypes are total shit.  They try to do that now based on quit rates... but that's such a shitty metric because people quit for all kinds of reasons. If you veto a map, its because you don't want to play it.  there is no other reason.
  • The uncertainty of what the next gametype could be means that by default, people tend to not veto things that are at least OK, increasing variety.  While nobody wants to play shit, you should play things that are "Meh" every once in a while.  Variety for variety's sake is a good thing. It allows the really good shit to never get stale.
  • Veto rules can be setup multiple ways.  It could only be a map veto, gametype veto or both so you can set that for whatever will serve the playlist best.  Voting is binary. The only way to change it is to change how many choices you have. Or have a "none" option and start another round of voting... which makes it worse.

 

I disagree, once you get something meh it makes you realize how good you had it when you played good maps(like pit or narrows) 

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1 hour ago, Arlong said:

I disagree, once you get something meh it makes you realize how good you had it when you played good maps(like pit or narrows) 

But if the "best" stuff is all you play shit gets boring real quick. At least half my Reach MLG matches were on Sanctuary because that's all kids voted for. Similar trends could be observed when MCC had voting, it was nothing but Standoff and Valhalla in BTB even though there were like 30 maps in the playlist. 

Then there's also the fact that what's "popular" usually isn't actually good, case in point Blood Gulch and all its remakes. Awful map but if you ever got to play CE or H2 in old MCC BTB you could be sure it was Gulch, Coag or Bloodline. 

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2 hours ago, Arlong said:

I disagree, once you get something meh it makes you realize how good you had it when you played good maps(like pit or narrows) 

Right, you kind of just made my point.  Nobody wants to play shit, so veto let's you avoid shit.  But if you only ever play your favorites, it gets stale eventually.  You make it sound like with veto you never get to play your preferred stuff when in reality you probably only have to wait through one 12 minute game.  Plus you have to consider that not everybody likes the same stuff as you.  For the greater good of matchmaking (not to get too hippidy dippidy) you have to take a population-level look at it.  A little randomness in selection is good.  If you are really dead set on only playing exactly the limited set of stuff you want, you can run customs. That's what they're for, not matchmaking.

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If a veto system is in place, then there needs to be weighting in each lobby player's past maps/gametypes. If one map or gametype is overplayed for the players that have matched up, then it falls off the list and they have to choose from other combinations. 

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1 hour ago, Cursed Lemon said:

If a veto system is in place, then there needs to be weighting in each lobby player's past maps/gametypes. If one map or gametype is overplayed for the players that have matched up, then it falls off the list and they have to choose from other combinations. 

Why should frequency play a part in it though? That would just increase the opportunity to get maps that are vetoed constantly (i.e. Snowbound, Orbital, etc) because of the lack of quality of said maps. Sometimes its just the luck of the draw that we played Heretic a few times over the course of day. I don't really think we should decrease the frequency of good maps to potentially play crappier ones just for the sake of variety, you know?

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50 minutes ago, -DeucEy- said:

Why should frequency play a part in it though? That would just increase the opportunity to get maps that are vetoed constantly (i.e. Snowbound, Orbital, etc) because of the lack of quality of said maps. Sometimes its just the luck of the draw that we played Heretic a few times over the course of day. I don't really think we should decrease the frequency of good maps to potentially play crappier ones just for the sake of variety, you know?

If the developer is too inept to put map/gametype combinations into rotation that don't suck ass, then this whole conversation is a non-starter because we have to work that issue out firstly and separately. 

The idea is to let the veto system clue developers in on "less desired" gametypes. Not "complete and utter abortion" gametypes. 

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