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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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25 minutes ago, careh said:

good job fucking up the shared space where you would actually get any discourse.

rude. ive made 4-5 actual posts clearly stating the core principles behind hitscan in a comp environment so im not sure what youre on about. ive been met with "omg so ridiculous amirite guys?" and attempted parallels from multi about fighting games, rockets and nades that dont address how strafe movement at distance void the possibility of not missing when it is always technically possible with hitscan. some real discourse when people dont actually argue and instead piggy back off of one forgers posts and rage downvote instead

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Just now, JordanB said:

There are certainly lines that should not be crossed. Religion and politics are the big ones. 

Okay. But why. Why can we just mock people based on what they feel here, and not make snide remarks about other extraneous beliefs, should we choose too. Not saying I would do either it's a dumb way to argue, but the line being drawn is stupid when you're still making the move to mock someone. I've been told my opinion should not be listened to or respected here because I hold a different idea of what Halo should be that goes against what seems to be a general consensus. Why is that not bad but somehow religion is that line that can't be crossed. You're still being a dick in general.  

More to the point, how hard is it to not take it personally, and just ignore it, lol. If we make lines for stuff and treat this shit as a big problem, we're part of the problem and the reason it becomes a touchy subject. If we just took a moment to remember it's wording and didn't take it like it was a knife wound, then no one would give a shit and it would cease being a problem. And we could move on and just debate points, however faulty or gucci they are.

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1 hour ago, arglactable said:

That's probably because no one made that claim. I said that when projectile travel time is so small that no one is accounting for it, it is effectively random variance. This becomes a problem at the edge of its "basically hit-scan" range. And the example I provided was the H3 sniper on Arena-sized maps.

Forgive my wording. Anyways, how does it become effectively random when the engagement distance that leading becomes important is always the same for a given projectile speed? That makes it predictable and your fault when you don't predict it.

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34 minutes ago, TheIcePrincess said:

Okay. But why. Why can we just mock people based on what they feel here, and not make snide remarks about other extraneous beliefs, should we choose too. Not saying I would do either it's a dumb way to argue, but the line being drawn is stupid when you're still making the move to mock someone. I've been told my opinion should not be listened to or respected here because I hold a different idea of what Halo should be that goes against what seems to be a general consensus. Why is that not bad but somehow religion is that line that can't be crossed. You're still being a dick in general.  

More to the point, how hard is it to not take it personally, and just ignore it, lol. If we make lines for stuff and treat this shit as a big problem, we're part of the problem and the reason it becomes a touchy subject. If we just took a moment to remember it's wording and didn't take it like it was a knife wound, then no one would give a shit and it would cease being a problem. And we could move on and just debate points, however faulty or gucci they are.

I think blatant disrespect shouldn't be allowed either, but I also know that there are lines that shouldn't be crossed. You can add family as a big no no as well. 

Yes in general all of those are being a dick, but there's a big difference in what people say and to what level of being a dick they are. Maybe it's just how I was grown up, but basically family politics and religion you don't talk about. You can make fun of me but don't you dare talk about my family. 

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8 minutes ago, JordanB said:

I think blatant disrespect shouldn't be allowed either, but I also know that there are lines that shouldn't be crossed. You can add family as a big no no as well. 

Yes in general all of those are being a dick, but there's a big difference in what people say and to what level of being a dick they are. Maybe it's just how I was grown up, but basically family politics and religion you don't talk about. You can make fun of me but don't you dare talk about my family. 

Generally a sick rule of thumb on the internet is to not mention what offends you. You're just opening yourself up to get upset when people mention exactly that. Another sick rule is to not bring up your religious views ON YOUR OWN if it's something you're sensitive about. Of course both those things wouldn't matter if you just didn't act like a dick but alas sometimes some people can't help it. If someone is going to start being a meany head and someone responds you can't hold the later to a higher standard. Or draw an arbitrary line in the sand. Quite frankly don't start attacking someone in an argument if you can't handle what they'll throw back. That's just life. 

Hope this helps clear things up champ! Stay positive!

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None of that relates to me, I just offered my opinion on how subtle religious insults are more offensive than just saying "moron". 

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The most frustrating part about reading this debate is that MultiLockOn and Hard War actually know what they're talking about, provide examples and solutions whereas the other party have literally no idea what they're talking about and seem to forget everything that was said previously.

I've never thought about the projectile/hitscan debate but Multi is dead on the money that hitscan turns into cross-mapping at all distances with M&KB. Projectile is the superior mechanic.

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1 hour ago, S0UL FLAME said:

Active Camouflage was a mistake. 

How dare you insult my religion.

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13 minutes ago, Shekkles said:

 MultiLockOn and Hard War actually know what they're talking about, provide examples and solutions whereas the other party have literally no idea what they're talking about and seem to forget everything that was said previously.

this is incredibly stupid because i can say the same exact thing. please point out a single time where i ignored their points and mine werent. 

"provide examples and solutions" thats all i did.

"seem to forget everything that was said previously" literally out of thin air

also you werent paying attention at all because hardway didnt say a single thing yet here you are telling us he 
"knows what hes talking about" give me a break dude 

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1 minute ago, cH_ said:

this is incredibly stupid because i can say the same exact thing. please point out a single time where i ignored their points and mine werent. 

"provide examples and solutions" that all i did.

"seem to forget everything that was said previously" literally out of thin air

I don't mind reading your posts.

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1 minute ago, Shekkles said:

I don't mind reading your posts.

im very sorry pls continue :beyond:

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17 minutes ago, Shekkles said:

The most frustrating part about reading this debate is that MultiLockOn and Hard War actually know what they're talking about, provide examples and solutions whereas the other party have literally no idea what they're talking about and seem to forget everything that was said previously.

I've never thought about the projectile/hitscan debate but Multi is dead on the money that hitscan turns into cross-mapping at all distances with M&KB. Projectile is the superior mechanic.

I dipped out of this a long ass time ago, but man, you can't be serious. Ch specifically provided so many examples, specifically. Well written ones that brought in new viewpoints from different games, and perspectives. Excluding which side of the fence I fall on, the lack of providing examples isn't the issue, nor is "forgetting" past statements an issue when they're directly dealt with. 

Arguments aside, this is a super disingenuous statement, dude. 

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A trend I've noticed during this debate is there really hasn't been a direct back and forth between two people, quotes and all. There's been some, but not enough to reach a concensus. It's like people keep hopping in and out of the debate at random. It'd be easier to follow the debate and points being made if everyone directly addressed and [multi]quoted each other instead of dropping walls of text.

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5 minutes ago, TeeJaY said:

A trend I've noticed during this debate is there really hasn't been a direct back and forth between two people, quotes and all. There's been some, but not enough to reach a concensus. It's like people keep hopping in and out of the debate at random. It'd be easier to follow the debate and points being made if everyone directly addressed and [multi]quoted each other instead of dropping walls of text.

That's literally why we wanted to go into a party chat. Like the exact reason. Interesting huh. 

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2 minutes ago, My Namez BEAST said:

That's literally why we wanted to go into a party chat. Like the exact reason. Interesting huh. 

Yeah but I don't blame them one bit for not wanting to after seeing all the posts you guys made these last few pages.

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11 minutes ago, TeeJaY said:

A trend I've noticed during this debate is there really hasn't been a direct back and forth between two people, quotes and all. There's been some, but not enough to reach a concensus. It's like people keep hopping in and out of the debate at random. It'd be easier to follow the debate and points being made if everyone directly addressed and [multi]quoted each other instead of dropping walls of text.

And they all have the same avatar so it feels like talking to someone's split personality.

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45 minutes ago, Shekkles said:

The most frustrating part about reading this debate is that MultiLockOn and Hard War actually know what they're talking about, provide examples and solutions whereas the other party have literally no idea what they're talking about and seem to forget everything that was said previously.

I've never thought about the projectile/hitscan debate but Multi is dead on the money that hitscan turns into cross-mapping at all distances with M&KB. Projectile is the superior mechanic.

CSGO would disagree with him there then.  Although that game has spread(although controllable in a way) it’s not bullets going completely straight. There’s this weird opinion that cross mapping is a bad thing? Why is it bad? You put yourself into that position to get cross mapped. And apex shows me with a high strafe accel that mouse and keyboard isn’t perfect accuracy. Apex’s shots work a lot like hitscan(fast projectiles) so that says something at the very least. And even then hitscan for controller is completely ok. A mouse and keyboard is more accurate and faster where leading shots appropriately is easier than it would be on a controller.

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The issue with moderating this thread is that I don't want to ban people, but there's a lot of heated discussion going on. I don't particularly want to refresh the page every 5 minutes to read the posts so I usually only check a few times a day.

The issues lie in the derailing of discussion into argument, which can be ok until it becomes petty. Then it becomes a question of where to draw the line (which post to remove as the inciting one and then all the posts that follow) without feeling like I'm just closing one side of the debate out.

In addition I have my own opinion which makes me bias towards one side so it skews the above. If I see direct insults, however, they will be removed.

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10 minutes ago, TeeJaY said:

Yeah but I don't blame them one bit for not wanting to after seeing all the posts you guys made these last few pages.

I disagree. I thought that was the right move after it got heated. Let's be honest, they could've just said fuck it and made fun of everyone in the private discord. Instead they extended an olive branch. Beast even admitted he said some shit as well.

 

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It probably was the right move for both sides to reach an understanding. I just don't blame Multi for not wanting to given the trolllololol vibes of their posts. You can't come across as uncivil in your forum posts and then expect people to believe you're civil in party chat (which they most likely are, but that's not the point).

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