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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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No, just because you fight your gun doesn't mean it takes the most skill by default, lol. And I'd argue a gun with inherent random properties takes less skill than one that's simply easier to use. Because randomness and the difficulty generated from that isn't a skill, and if anything, the extra aspects to the H3 BR do nothing but exacerbate the issues with its use, and make it less skillful, over the opposite intended effect.

 

Sure, if it was refined, it'd be perfect. So could any other BR in Halo. But it is not the best BR because it has perceived good traits when said traits do nothing but hinder performance due to the type of weapon it is. Just because leading your shots is good in CE or Battlefield doesn't mean it works or is good in Halo 3.

 

I'm not blaming the BR for anything, I don't have "many" personal issues with it, but I'll never say H3's was the best when its functionality was pretty broken by default.

What do you mean "fight your gun"? It's the hardest BR because it doesn't vacuum-suck your reticle to your target, it doesn't bend your bullets in to the target, and you have to lead. Mitigating spread isn't the hard part of the weapon. You just aim for the fattest part of the target to accommodate maximum bullet deviation. It's not that complicated. It's random properties are easily controlled within the weapon's intended range, but it's still something you have to learn. Or in other words, a skill. So tell me again how that's actually easier than something that you admitted is easier. Yes, you can get lucky with the H3 BR sometimes and get kills faster than average at certain ranges. That doesn't make it easier than a point and click laser beam with massive aim assistance. Give me a break. I don't like randomness either, but Jesus, be objective. No one is getting kills with the H3 BR when they miss.

 

And as far as its "extra aspects" and "perceived benefits" (I'm assuming you're talking about lower AA and being projectile), well no shit they hinder the performance. That's the point. It makes it harder to use. Within its intended range, thats a good thing. The important thing is that it can be accounted for, controlled, and mastered within its intended range. And outside of it, projectile doesn't make the weapon bad (just lead better), and AA is irrelevant because you won't have red reticle anyways. You're not going to convince anyone that lower AA and projectile are actually a bad thing in H3. You'd rather have it be hitscan and stick like glue? Give me a break.

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This.

 

We've had the H1 pistol, the BR, the DMR and the Halo 5 magnum.

 

For some reason everyone acts as if the BR "defines" Halo when it hasn't even been the primary weapon in many games.

Halo 1 - Pistol

Halo 2 - BR

Halo 3 - BR

Halo Reach - DMR

Halo 4 - BR/DMR (Loadouts)

Halo 5 - Magnum

 

I have no freakin' idea why people love the BR so much. That's 2.5/6 games. Halo 4 barely even counts as a Halo game so you've got the Halo 2 BR which was awful in every way possible vs the Halo 3 BR... It's not exactly flattering to say Halo 3 had the best BR when it was still garbage.

 

I mean, if anything, my small amount of time playing Halo 4 I kinda prefer it because my shots can actually kill shit past 20m and it doesn't require you to have LAN connection to actually work. Halo 2 and 3 out BR American host is only possible if your opponent has downs. Halo 4 I out BR people all the time since my shots actually register.

well the br is in 2/3/4/2a/5 so thats 5 games. I'd say 2a has the best BR it's just the strafe speed on 2a is terrible. 

 

tho in 5, it's not the main gun. and really the dmr was arguably better in halo4, it was just the br was easier to use so it was the choice weapon as their kill times were almost the same plus u got the carbine/light rifle. its a bad gameidk. i'd just compare 2a/2/3

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If you're not aiming for the body before the killshot in any Halo, you're wrong, especially in H3. The fact that you should aim center mass to mitigate spread doesn't make a difference. It's not like you should be aiming for the head on the first 3 shots in other Halos anyways.

 

Also, comparing the BR to anything that isn't a BR is irrelevant to the topic. So talking about the burst fire nature doesn't really make sense, since anything you're comparing it to has the same trait.

 

@@TheIcePrincess, which one do you think is the best?

aiming for the body is not optimal because you waste a shot if they are weak. it's not realistical to know if someone is exactly 1 shot from a call out or 1.33 shots. in halo 1 "1shot in the head" is a realistic callout whereas in halo3 while people may say that, it's not always true because you cant tell if all 3 bursts hit perfectly because shield flare isn't accurate online. if you have the skill to perfectly hit heads then you shouldn't be punished for it. 

 

 

and for another reply from you. the br in halo3 does give you kills lol. you can get kills aiming solely for the chest if the spread goes north. i mean we also have the nutsack halo2 br. tho h2's br has dubshot and quadshot. 

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If you're not aiming for the body before the killshot in any Halo, you're wrong, especially in H3. The fact that you should aim center mass to mitigate spread doesn't make a difference. It's not like you should be aiming for the head on the first 3 shots in other Halos anyways.

 

Also, comparing the BR to anything that isn't a BR is irrelevant to the topic. So talking about the burst fire nature doesn't really make sense, since anything you're comparing it to has the same trait.

 

@@TheIcePrincess, which one do you think is the best?

"Best" is a nebulous term. For what Halo 2 was, I find it's BR to be a tad too easy, Halo 3's was inconsistent and I fought it more than I fought with it, whereas I think Halo 4 nailed the mix of precision, range, and "ease of use" relative to its weapon type. Especially given its movement allows for a good strafe, jump, and crouch. Halo 2: Anniversary is probably my favorite favorite, though, and while it's a bit easy, I do like how it just feels in my hands. Halo 5's beta BR was also great for not being stupidly easy, which was compounded by movement abilities. Week 2 had slayer on super campy and bad maps, but the actual gunfights were pretty good. Then launch came. Shit's basically autoaim city. Made BTB bearable at least, lel. Then the 2017 patch hit. And the weapon's garbo for anything but Firefight.

 

I don't think any of them is "the best", given what the BR is, butttttt, I have my favorites and likes. Those being the consistent ones, lel. So any barring 3's. I don't really hate them as long as I'm not fighting them, even if fights can turn into first shot victories.

 

Wait, your two favorite Halo games is the Halo game where you can beam power weapons directly on your position without having to go and fight over them, and the one that broadcasts there spawn location and how long left until they spawn, making them more accessible and less of a map knowledge, timing item.

 

lmao.

See, anything without context or justification can sound laughable or dumb. What a surprise one laughs at the idea someone likes a different Halo more than someone else, without asking why. Hmmhmmmm.

 

Although, I find this funny in the sense that I once argued timing a power weapon is a skill, because I was originally annoyed at weapon pads myself, back in 2015. I was then subject to a debate where many people actually disagreed with the idea timing's a skill, and considered it more habitual, like knowing a weapon's location, and that pads are QoL. Just funny. Shit can change, but I'll never forget that argument because it's now been reverse coursed here.

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The h3 BR is horrible because it makes the teamshot meta inconsistent and the weapons are too shitty in Halo 3 to have individuals empowered, so they have to rely on teamshot rather than getting quick kills. At least in Halo 2 doubleshot can take a guy off guard before he escapes.

 

So basically halo 3 is a watered down halo 2 where punishment can be determined by luck almost as much as skill especially at the edges of the BRs range.

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Weapon pads increase the skill gap lol. The skill is in obtaining the power weapon remember guys? Allowing everyone to see when they're coming up allows the fight over it to be much more of a challenge. And timing shit at a high level is just a chore since everyone already knows when shit is spawning anyway. Pads just help less experienced players (or kids that don't wanna use a timer lmao) contest the free kill weapons. H5 just implemented it poorly with having it reveal when it's picked up.

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Agree to disagree. There will still be 2 camos. But this is one of the most obviously flawed gametypes in the history of Halo. EVERYONE that plays it complains about it, outside of a few super old school guys that refuse to look at it objectively. Honestly, in a social 4v4 playlist, people would fucking HATE that layout, and it would get bitched about constantly. Tell me I'm wrong. The team in control is stacked to a comical degree. The spawns are vulnerable enough without 2 camo/snipes and a rocket up top (and a 2nd rocket bottom mid). Play it with pistols and suddenly it'll actually be a close game where control can shift more than once a game. I guarantee this will upset less people than the default layout would. Guarantee.

 

Just got it again.

 

I 100% agree.

 

Just quit out of the game. The enemy team had 2 rockets and were just sitting top destroying us off spawn. They capped 2 flags and then just started stat padding. They kept getting the flag, tossing it into our spawn and leaving it or they'd get it all the way to their base and then not cap it.

 

BTW - IDIOTS - If you want it to get harder to find games in Halo 1 on MCC, this is a great way to do it. Just end the fucking game FFS. What you're doing isn't skilful and impressive and you'll only make sure social players NEVER queue for Halo CE again.

 

The game type in its current state is completely broken. Since we can't expect 343 to actually put any effort into changing power ups and weapon positions on the map for CTF it should just be pistols only.

 

If someone like me can't stand the map - enough that I quit the game - something I NEVER do, then clearly it's fucked and I'm not surprised at all that one of my other team mates quit out of the game in the first 2 minutes.

 

I managed to TSK the rocket guys multiple times and then I'd just get killed by a 2nd guy with rockets. The default pickup placements on the map are just dumb.

 

 

well the br is in 2/3/4/2a/5 so thats 5 games. I'd say 2a has the best BR it's just the strafe speed on 2a is terrible. 

 

tho in 5, it's not the main gun. and really the dmr was arguably better in halo4, it was just the br was easier to use so it was the choice weapon as their kill times were almost the same plus u got the carbine/light rifle. its a bad gameidk. i'd just compare 2a/2/3

 

H2A is barely worth mentioning IMO.

 

It's had, what? One major tournament?

 

The game barely has any maps in it.

 

As far as I'm concerned the game is just a spin-off and I don't consider it a real Halo game. It never had it's own release like every other game and it's never had its own tournament scene. It was just part of the MCC bundle.

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Wait, your two favorite Halo games is the Halo game where you can beam power weapons directly on your position without having to go and fight over them, and the one that broadcasts there spawn location and how long left until they spawn, making them more accessible and less of a map knowledge, timing item.

 

lmao.

I think we should give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she preferred the best version of H4, post patch, where Infinity settings were pretty much extinct. And map knowledge and weapon timing are bogus skills in my opinion. Map knowledge is fleeting and nothing to be proud of. Congrats, you rocketed a kid that didn't even know where they spawned. Better ice down that boner. And weapon timing is whack too. Yes, it does require presence of mind and being alert, but it's way more impressive to come away with an item when everyone knows it's coming up than it is to have done more Halo homework and have a better memory (or a fucking coach, which is what happens when it actually matters). You know how I know? Because my average battle for rockets and camo in H1 are way more intense and difficult than quietly waiting for a powerup grab that no one else even knows is coming up, which is usually the case in later Halos. Timing items is one of those skills that I always thought it was so bizarre that people take pride in.

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Weapon pads increase the skill gap lol. The skill is in obtaining the power weapon remember guys? Allowing everyone to see when they're coming up allows the fight over it to be much more of a challenge. And timing shit at a high level is just a chore since everyone already knows when shit is spawning anyway. Pads just help less experienced players (or kids that don't wanna use a timer lmao) contest the free kill weapons. H5 just implemented it poorly with having it reveal when it's picked up.

i must have missed the weapon pad debate. but yeah they are 100% good for the game and I agree with you 100%. it's not fun playing CE when the other team doesnt even try to go for the power weapons and then they get frustrated because I seemingly pull rocket camo out of my ass. all it does it help people learn to play the game. 

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aiming for the body is not optimal because you waste a shot if they are weak. it's not realistical to know if someone is exactly 1 shot from a call out or 1.33 shots. in halo 1 "1shot in the head" is a realistic callout whereas in halo3 while people may say that, it's not always true because you cant tell if all 3 bursts hit perfectly because shield flare isn't accurate online. if you have the skill to perfectly hit heads then you shouldn't be punished for it. 

 

 

and for another reply from you. the br in halo3 does give you kills lol. you can get kills aiming solely for the chest if the spread goes north. i mean we also have the nutsack halo2 br. tho h2's br has dubshot and quadshot. 

Well okay, that's a totally different example. If you're trying to clean up a teammate's kill or you're playing FFA, then yeah, obviously aim for the head. I'm talking about starting your own kills. But the brightness of the shield and the lights on the knees are a pretty good indication of whether he's 1,2, or 3 shots.

 

And that's a fair point, but you'd be a fool to rely on an outlier like that. The smartest way to shoot it (depending on range) is waist, waist, waist, neck. That gives you the highest chance of getting every bullet to hit. At closer ranges where spread isn't as much of an issue and the aim adjustment to the head is more pronounced, then chest chest chest neck is gonna be the most reliable way to kill someone.

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Hahaa.

to be fair you don't contest the weapon spawns on 4v4 dere ctf like other maps and gamevariants. on that map you just sit and wait for them to spawn while killing people 0-1second off spawn until the other team makes some amazing plays then its their turn.

 

I still think it shouldn't be pistol set only because it's just boring. the pistol on MCC CE is the most unsatisfying gun and the sniper is the only consistent gun on that game right now. we'll already have our pistols only map in 4v4 wizard ctf, we don't need another

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to be fair you don't contest the weapon spawns on 4v4 dere ctf like other maps and gamevariants. on that map you just sit and wait for them to spawn until the other team makes some amazing plays then its their turn.

 

I still think it shouldn't be pistol set only because it's just boring. the pistol on MCC CE is the most unsatisfying gun and the sniper is the only consistent gun on that game right now. we'll already have our pistols only map in 4v4 wizard ctf, we don't need another

I.... Didn't say anything. I'm just laughing my ass off. 

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I.... Didn't say anything. I'm just laughing my ass off. 

Well I was replying with what I knew u were thinking (the irony) then the 2nd paragraph is more directed to hardway and pyro

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Well I was replying with what I knew u were thinking (the irony) then the 2nd paragraph is more directed to hardway and pyro

You don't even know what I'm thinking fam. I was confused as hell in the first place as to what I could've said that would've warranted that response, given what I planned to originally say. Don't be that arrogant, boyo. You can't read minds, lol.

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to be fair you don't contest the weapon spawns on 4v4 dere ctf like other maps and gamevariants. on that map you just sit and wait for them to spawn while killing people 0-1second off spawn until the other team makes some amazing plays then its their turn.

 

I still think it shouldn't be pistol set only because it's just boring. the pistol on MCC CE is the most unsatisfying gun and the sniper is the only consistent gun on that game right now. we'll already have our pistols only map in 4v4 wizard ctf, we don't need another

 

I know, and I agree with you. I'm not excited about it being pistols only either. But I do like the geometry of the map for CTF, and I think it's better than the alternative. If there was a way to play the map with a custom layout, I'd absolutely have a sniper on it. I just don't think they're worth the inevitable, toxic spawn raping, especially in a social list. At the very least, pistols only should make for some close games.

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You don't even know what I'm thinking fam. I was confused as hell in the first place as to what I could've said that would've warranted that response, given what I planned to originally say. Don't be that arrogant, boyo. You can't read minds, lol.

I thought the same thing Riddler did. If you weren't pointing out the irony of someone advocating for a pistols only set after that long debate, then what did you mean?

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I thought the same thing Riddler did. If you weren't pointing out the irony of someone advocating for a pistols only set after that long debate, then what did you mean?

Well, hahaa means laughter, so, I laughed at the post, if that's what you mean. I focused on the pistol aspect, only because it didn't really clog up a page with a one word response that's not really gonna be committed to. The entire thing was just fucking hilarious to me.

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Weapon pads increase the skill gap lol. The skill is in obtaining the power weapon remember guys? Allowing everyone to see when they're coming up allows the fight over it to be much more of a challenge. And timing shit at a high level is just a chore since everyone already knows when shit is spawning anyway. Pads just help less experienced players (or kids that don't wanna use a timer lmao) contest the free kill weapons. H5 just implemented it poorly with having it reveal when it's picked up.

I totally agree.

 

Except for the dumb pickup reveal, there really shouldn't be any major complaints about H5 weapon pads when competitive CE players always use an external timer or now have it outright included in a modded version of the the game. It literally does the exact same thing, and is required for the game to play at the optimal level.

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Hahaa.

I knew this would happen, lol.

 

What Hard Way said, although I don't really think there is anything negative about the laughter either. I too thought it was funny when I read the sudden pistols-only proposal(although I agree with the legitimate specific implementation) after that drawn out discussion.

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I knew this would happen, lol.

 

What Hard Way said, although I don't really think there is anything negative about the laughter either. I too thought it was funny when I read the sudden pistols-only proposal(although I agree with the legitimate specific implementation) after that drawn out discussion.

Basically, lol.

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Anyone wanted to play CE BTB? Hahaha me neither! Thanks 343 for almost completely removing it from BTB like the CE haters you are. No problem though, there's plenty of gooooood ole Halo 4 and Zanzibar/Stonetown snowballing to keep everyone quitting.

 

This was fun though, Halo 2 is fun at times.

Funny, the 3 games I played of BTB tonight were all Halo CE.

 

With that being said, just why exactly is Hang 'em High in the BTB playlist??? EDIT: at least I was on blue team, lol. Timberland Slayer and Blood Gulch CTF were fun to goof around in though.

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Funny, the 3 games I played of BTB tonight were all Halo CE.

 

With that being said, just why exactly is Hang 'em High in the BTB playlist??? EDIT: at least I was on blue team, lol. Timberland Slayer and Blood Gulch CTF were fun to goof around in though.

hang em high ctf is in btb? otherwise there aren't set spawns.

 

hang em high is fine for 8v8 nonsense honestly, it's just annoying it only goes to 50 kills. you can end the game in less than 2mins

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I think we should give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she preferred the best version of H4, post patch, where Infinity settings were pretty much extinct.

H4 Turbo was actually pretty damn fun, for those that stuck around to play it, as I know you did. I kinda miss those days.

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hang em high ctf is in btb? otherwise there aren't set spawns.

 

hang em high is fine for 8v8 nonsense honestly, it's just annoying it only goes to 50 kills. you can end the game in less than 2mins

Yeah it is there, at least as CTF. Honestly not going to lie, I did kinda really enjoy the nonsense of it. The extra snipers instead of shotguns for CTF on that map make it all the better, lol

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