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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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I disagree, TS could easily be option number 1 in Social 4v4 and require a veto for Obj. Doing this gives each game a Team Slayer option with Team Skirmish Lite mixed in.

 

Also, they just need to change Team Hardcore to Team Arena and call it a day. It's been done in Halo 5 it should be done in all other Halos as well.

I guess I wouldn't be too opposed to this idea but it should require like 6 vetoes imo. Some people want to just play team slayer and not think. If you put them in objective we'll just get idiots who go for kills the entire game.

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so what are they suppose to trick people now?

lol what? His suggestion is to remove people being tricked. Some people think hardcore is the opposite of fun which isnt true. Thats why it should get a name change
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I'm sorry but this just reeks of elitism and forcing people to play shit that they don't want to play because you think it sucks.

 

Team slayer is popular. We have to live with that. Forcing unpopular and not well thought out playlists on the community is what got us here. That will lead to underpopulation of the game overall.

 

I would agree with not making it the number one playlist on the list. Getting people to scroll by the other lists might help them gain population. But it should stay in the game.

I'll gladly have a discussion about a ranked 4v4 "Arena" playlist so Team HC isn't the only ranked playlist for H2/3. But there is just no space for a dedicated Slayer playlist when we have so little to work with. And especially having a cross-game Team Slayer playlist, because it's going to suck up all the players, then the other playlists die and then even more people have to play Team Slayer to even get a match (aka current MCC). Plus it being cross-game swiftly reintroduces the quitting and griefing problems we have now in TS and BTB. It's just stupid to go through all this effort of making separate playlists, announce "we're done with cross-game playlists guise!!" and then just completely flip flop on that.

 

 

With that said, I like your suggestion about putting it at the bottom of the list. It has been proven time and time again that most people don't even bother scrolling down and the top playlist is usually the most popular one.

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I think we could get away with having FFA and BTB be permanent playlists, but rotate through games on a weekly basis.

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Was I talking about quality? No

As a person who likes to enjoy games, quality is more important than the desires of the vast majority of Halo 3 players who probably couldn't figure out how to play with their dick.
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The idea of just putting non AR/SMG start options into the same playlist as the MLG variants is probably the best idea for H2/3. Just make sure it goes option 1 - MLG TS option 2 - MLG OBJ  option 3 - BR start/radar normal TS 

 

You can still have the big casual ar/smg start with radar multi game playlist at the bottom of the list somewhere. There just isn't room to have totally separate TS and competitive playlists for both games and still hit other modes like FFA for H2 and BTB for H3. Its also just stupid to try and split those populations because someone is randomly afraid of a playlist name. The reason players avoid those playlists is a legacy problem directly from bungie. There's nothing inherently wrong or less fun about those game modes. In fact as long as you aren't looking for "silly" gamemodes for fun they're intended to be the most balanced/diverse modes you can get from the games. Why would you even have another basic TS/OBJ playlist ranked following that logic? The reason people avoid HC/MLG is because bungie decided to separate it and try to designate that playlist in a way that said "only really competitive players here" which doesn't really do anything but intimidate new players for no reason. It should be unneeded with matchmaking restrictions forcing them to play the appropriate players. One of the few things 343 got right was Team Arena at the start of H5 before they refused to really update the playlist and then split it into its own HCS one (which they recently flip flopped on again)

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The relationship between chief and cortana as she is dying honestly kind of writes itself.

It really doesn't, and as part of my undying love for the campaign, I'm obliged to defend it.

 

Their relationship could've gone a number of ways, and what we got was probably the best version. Halo 4 brought up the ethics of the Spartan II program, whether or not Chief is more man or machine, personal struggle over world-ending threats—and these ideas echo throughout the campaign. It keeps reminding you both in dialogue and in character reactions the inevitable doom that is to come, till eventually Chief talks to Lasky about being more than a machine. Halo 4 has actual narrative flow, where scenes are appropriately timed to fit character motivations and themes, while other Halo games seem to not give a shit. Halo 4 also has character development, that is, its characters actually remember and reflect on recent events. I agree the whole Librarian thing was confusing, but that's about the only thing they executed poorly. The Didact was a pretty great villain. He's far more threatening than the Prophets, and unlike the Gravemind he actually does stuff. And if you're lore-savvy he's a tragic villain whom you can easily sympathize with.

 

In a nutshell, what makes Halo 4's story great is that it focused on individual struggle, while other Halo games relied more or less on "save the world" tropes. The only other game that comes close is ODST, but that's ruined by some pacing issues and underdeveloped plot points.

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It really doesn't, and as part of my undying love for the campaign, I'm obliged to defend it.

 

Their relationship could've gone a number of ways, and what we got was probably the best version. Halo 4 brought up the ethics of the Spartan II program, whether or not Chief is more man or machine, personal struggle over world-ending threats—and these ideas echo throughout the campaign. It keeps reminding you both in dialogue and in character reactions the inevitable doom that is to come, till eventually Chief talks to Lasky about being more than a machine. Halo 4 has actual narrative flow, where scenes are appropriately timed to fit character motivations and themes, while other Halo games seem to not give a shit. Halo 4 also has character development, that is, its characters actually remember and reflect on recent events. I agree the whole Librarian thing was confusing, but that's about the only thing they executed poorly. The Didact was a pretty great villain. He's far more threatening than the Prophets, and unlike the Gravemind he actually does stuff. And if you're lore-savvy he's a tragic villain whom you can easily sympathize with.

 

In a nutshell, what makes Halo 4's story great is that it focused on individual struggle, while other Halo games relied more or less on "save the world" tropes. The only other game that comes close is ODST, but that's ruined by some pacing issues and underdeveloped plot points.

It really does. The whole thing was more than hinted at during basically all of Halo 3 if you pay attention. Even more so if you read the older books dealing with those two. They took the obvious route, which was good, but still obvious

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Speaking of Halo 1 LANs, I'll hopefully be locking in a fourth for a LAN at my place Saturday. Assuming I can get a fourth, it'll be our first time trying NHE. I'm the only one fairly familiar with spawns, especially randoms, so playing training mode with random zones visible is hopefully going to help even the playing field a bit.

Quoting myself to brag a little and also ask for advice. Our fourth confirmed so I'm going to be LANning H1 NHE on Saturday. Any tips for things to skip? I was thinking of going through every map, but quickly looking at Double Take it looked way too big for 2v2, and Zero Hour to me looked bad for 2v2 due to layout.

 

Should we play those two anyway? We'll have time, and who knows maybe they're really good, but I'm having doubts looking at them. Is there anything we should definitely skip, or anything we should definitely play other than 2v2 slayer? It's only four of us, so anything beyond four people is out.

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LOL no. Its ranked. "Ranked" should actually fucking mean something. Its not tricking anybody. Its only giving a ranked designation to playlists that actually deserve it, diversifying the map and gametype pool beyond what the competitive map pool is and allowing for a more varied set of "other" playlists by removing the totally redundant, often also-ranked, other 4v4 playlists that more often than not exist on the same core set of maps and everything. The separation of the "sweaty ranked" and "regular ranked" 4v4 playlists has been an issue since Halo 2. Its the messaging that has turned the "MLG-ish" lists into graveyards of sweaty zombies and that shitty messaging and separation needs to stop

halo in hindsight should be one ranked playlist but halo fans are used to this not being the case.

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I'm assuming this list comes from the survey that anyone could join. Which means that the vast majority of players still have no idea how bad a game Halo 3 is.

your opinion isn’t changing anyone else’s you know.

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your opinion isn’t changing anyone else’s you know.

It's not intended to. People stick to their guns on the most ridiculous of stuff and I've long given up on trying to change those opinions.

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lol what? His suggestion is to remove people being tricked. Some people think hardcore is the opposite of fun which isnt true. Thats why it should get a name change

opposite of fun huh. What gives you the right to decide that? I personally hate radar but there’s a good reason for it. It’s what you meee when you’re alone. Halo has become no mic paradise. Too many people mute their whole team, without radar it becomes the sweat fest known as mlg. Changing the name isn’t going to do ANYTHING. These players know the settings for hardcore, they’re not dumb.
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Quoting myself to brag a little and also ask for advice. Our fourth confirmed so I'm going to be LANning H1 NHE on Saturday. Any tips for things to skip? I was thinking of going through every map, but quickly looking at Double Take it looked way too big for 2v2, and Zero Hour to me looked bad for 2v2 due to layout.

 

Should we play those two anyway? We'll have time, and who knows maybe they're really good, but I'm having doubts looking at them. Is there anything we should definitely skip, or anything we should definitely play other than 2v2 slayer? It's only four of us, so anything beyond four people is out.

Look at Hang 'Em and Dammy.  These maps are enormous.  Every map shrinks once you know it and know where to look.  Zero Hour is actually one of my favorite new maps.  It was made as a 4v4 CTF map but plays really well for 2's if everyone knows it.  Almost feels like a less devastating Derelict.

 

 

Edit:  When I play at my place, I play every good 2v2 map in a row...basically every normal 2v2 map and all of the new maps on NHE.  No Chiron or big maps.  And often we skip Longest and Wizard, just preference.

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Look at Hang 'Em and Dammy.  These maps are enormous.  Every map shrinks once you know it and know where to look.  Zero Hour is actually one of my favorite new maps.  It was made as a 4v4 CTF map but plays really well for 2's if everyone knows it.  Almost feels like a less devastating Derelict.

 

 

Edit:  When I play at my place, I play every good 2v2 map in a row...basically every normal 2v2 map and all of the new maps on NHE.  No Chiron or big maps.  And often we skip Longest and Wizard, just preference.

We're definitely down to play new maps, the two I mentioned I was unsure about, but I'll make sure we try all of the new maps then. Thanks for the advice!

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It really doesn't, and as part of my undying love for the campaign, I'm obliged to defend it.

 

Their relationship could've gone a number of ways, and what we got was probably the best version. Halo 4 brought up the ethics of the Spartan II program, whether or not Chief is more man or machine, personal struggle over world-ending threats—and these ideas echo throughout the campaign. It keeps reminding you both in dialogue and in character reactions the inevitable doom that is to come, till eventually Chief talks to Lasky about being more than a machine. Halo 4 has actual narrative flow, where scenes are appropriately timed to fit character motivations and themes, while other Halo games seem to not give a shit. Halo 4 also has character development, that is, its characters actually remember and reflect on recent events. I agree the whole Librarian thing was confusing, but that's about the only thing they executed poorly. The Didact was a pretty great villain. He's far more threatening than the Prophets, and unlike the Gravemind he actually does stuff. And if you're lore-savvy he's a tragic villain whom you can easily sympathize with.

 

In a nutshell, what makes Halo 4's story great is that it focused on individual struggle, while other Halo games relied more or less on "save the world" tropes. The only other game that comes close is ODST, but that's ruined by some pacing issues and underdeveloped plot points.

 

I enjoyed this post. H4 was underrated in its character development. The insubordination cutscene on board the mammoth with Del Rio is my favorite Halo cutscene. It made me long for a Halo movie, even if it was entirely CGI.  I was totally with you until you mentioned Didact being a great villain. I thought Didact had the potential to be a great villain, if it had some more in-game explanation, and he didn't have force powers that made conflict with him feel futile. I agree that he is a tragic villain, and is very interesting as a result. It's a shame it played out the way it did. He had potential with a little more in-game explanation, and i don't know, maybe not killing him off in a quick time event in the very first game he was in. 

 

I'm curious to hear you elaborate on the pacing issues and underdeveloped plot points in ODST.

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AR/SMG start shouldn’t exist in this game in any of the decent playlists eg BTB/FFA/2vs2 just have BR/AR, BR/SMG, AR/pistol as the default starting weapons for all the aforementioned game types H1/2/3. Just make the automatic the weapon be equipped by default so the casuals can use there automatics this setup pleases all groups and removes garbage game types.

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Quoting myself to brag a little and also ask for advice. Our fourth confirmed so I'm going to be LANning H1 NHE on Saturday. Any tips for things to skip? I was thinking of going through every map, but quickly looking at Double Take it looked way too big for 2v2, and Zero Hour to me looked bad for 2v2 due to layout.

 

Should we play those two anyway? We'll have time, and who knows maybe they're really good, but I'm having doubts looking at them. Is there anything we should definitely skip, or anything we should definitely play other than 2v2 slayer? It's only four of us, so anything beyond four people is out.

 

Doubletake is underrated for 2's. It's a perfect example of what I'd like to see with symms going forward in Halo. It has an asymmetrical layout in Slayer, with Camo on blue side tucked into the corner, and OS on red side under the flag. It's not so big that it will feel unusually long. It's a solid map. Not my favorite, but worth trying if only to see how viable asymmetrical layouts on symmetrical maps could be (especially if we could implement delayed item spawns).

 

Zero Hour is absolutely worth playing in Slayer. Just ask @@Missingno. There are no randoms in bottom middle, but rockets are top mid, and the powerups bracket the 50 yard line, which makes going for the power items extremely dangerous to spawn traps if the other team chooses to bait from both bases. It has a super unique meta and is absolutely worth your time.  Edit: I posted this before I saw MissingNo had already replied. Not bad, eh?

 

And I'm a sucker for Longest CTF 2v2. And @@Stoppabl3 (I think) made Wizard oddball sound pretty fun in 2v2.

 

As for skips, Longest, Wizard, Boarding Action and BG are the only ones I'd say you should skip for Slayer.

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They should make a playlist that is Halo 2/2A/3 with AR or SMG starts only. Additionally it will be the only playlist with Halo 4 in it.

 

All other playlist have BR starts.

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They should make a playlist that is Halo 2/2A/3 with AR or SMG starts only. Additionally it will be the only playlist with Halo 4 in it.

 

All other playlist have BR starts.

Only if the game intentionally crashes in the loading screen every time.

 

SMG/AR starts need to be expunged, and I'm pretty sure Postums agrees with me :)

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Only if the game intentionally crashes in the loading screen every time.

 

SMG/AR starts need to be expunged, and I'm pretty sure Postums agrees with me :)

 

The worst part about pro-SMG start players is that being battered and beaten by BR players (especially on lockout with it's 3 BR's) is that it reaffirms to them that BR's are stupid and not that SMG's are a pathetic waste of a starting weapon. Literally useless.

 

One team gets sniper, sword, 3 BR's. The other team literally cannot win. Ever.

 

"BRs are bullshit!!!!!!1!!1" 

- Player who thinks the BR is OP when it's the SMG that is useless.

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The worst part about pro-SMG start players is that being battered and beaten by BR players (especially on lockout with it's 3 BR's) is that it reaffirms to them that BR's are stupid and not that SMG's are a pathetic waste of a starting weapon. Literally useless.

 

One team gets sniper, sword, 3 BR's. The other team literally cannot win. Ever.

 

"BRs are bullshit!!!!!!1!!1" 

- Player who thinks the BR is OP when it's the SMG that is useless.

I will NEVER understand how someone can play Halo for longer than a month and not come to the conclusion that SMG starts are bullshit, especially when you get to experience BR starts side by side with it. I will never forget spawning in front of a wraith with an SMG on Coagulation, 100 feet from anything resembling cover. That was my moment. That was when I FULLY understood how stupid SMG starts were.

 

In early H2 I understood it because people didn't know any better. Since then, after they added BR starts to MM, there's no excuse. If you advocate for SMG starts, I have to assume you've never played a single game against competent opponents, and I can all but conclude that your understanding of Halo in general is stunted.

 

And fyi Lockout had 2 BR's. BR3 and Top Lift.

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I will NEVER understand how someone can play Halo for longer than a month and not come to the conclusion that SMG starts are bullshit, especially when you get to experience BR starts side by side with it.

 

In early H2 I understood it because people didn't know any better. Since then, after they added BR starts to MM, there's no excuse. If you advocate for SMG starts, I have to assume you've never played a single game against competent opponents, and I can all but conclude that your understanding of Halo in general is stunted.

 

And fyi Lockout had 2 BR's. BR3 and Top Lift.

 

Oh yeah, I keep thinking there is one on elbow for some reason but you're right. IT'S EVEN WORSE.

 

Guardian is just as bad. One carbine, one BR. Awful.

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Oh yeah, I keep thinking there is one on elbow for some reason but you're right. IT'S EVEN WORSE.

 

Guardian is just as bad. One carbine, one BR. Awful.

 

H2A put a Carbine down there, to their credit. It's a good addition.

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Doubletake is underrated for 2's. It's a perfect example of what I'd like to see with symms going forward in Halo. It has an asymmetrical layout in Slayer, with Camo on blue side tucked into the corner, and OS on red side under the flag. It's not so big that it will feel unusually long. It's a solid map. Not my favorite, but worth trying if only to see how viable asymmetrical layouts on symmetrical maps could be (especially if we could implement delayed item spawns).

 

Zero Hour is absolutely worth playing in Slayer. Just ask @@Missingno. There are no randoms in bottom middle, but rockets are top mid, and the powerups bracket the 50 yard line, which makes going for the power items extremely dangerous to spawn traps if the other team chooses to bait from both bases. It has a super unique meta and is absolutely worth your time.  Edit: I posted this before I saw MissingNo had already replied. Not bad, eh?

 

And I'm a sucker for Longest CTF 2v2. And @@Stoppabl3 (I think) made Wizard oddball sound pretty fun in 2v2.

 

As for skips, Longest, Wizard, Boarding Action and BG are the only ones I'd say you should skip for Slayer.

Cool! I'll add Longest CTF and Wizard oddball to the list. I appreciate hearing about Double Take as well. I was hesitant at first, but I'll make sure we try it out.

 

-----

 

On a side note, had some really good games in the Halo 1 playlist with @@Sandman tonight.

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