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Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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....That was then published by every major online gaming news outlet the next day.  Do you seriously think that they thought, "well nobody is going to see this anyway so we can say whatever we want?"

 

Its pretty clear that i am the one putting this announcement into context....  It adds up to a little bit.  I'm not jumping for joy over here or putting the cart before the horse.  But i am hopeful that MCC will be fixed, grateful that they decided to actually have a discussion about it (fucking finally) while being skeptical of what the ultimate outcome will be.  NONE of that is unreasonable and you and Arg's insistence that having a measured and varied response instead of pure pessimism is somehow bad is mind blowing.  But this is the internet, so idk why i'm surprised (or even replying).

 

 

Maybe you aren't as pissed because you didn't by an xbox one for the MCC only to have it be a broken pile of shit for 3 years with no acknowledgment from the developer, only for them to break the silence via a fucking forum post that announces they might potentially fix the game and btw you need to buy the newer xbox one edition to use it. Your response simply isn't in proportion with the reality of the situation for people like me. I was at entering my prime trying to go pro at halo 2 on the day Halo 3 came out and then I quit because that game was awful competitively. My point is I have had a stake in halo going a long ways back so I take the MCC shit personally and 343 has failed to do anything redeeming. An out of the blue announcement of some possible fix that requires I buy a new console and reactivate my live account is asinine. Maybe you never had skin in the game so this is just whooshing past your head. You're welcome to be mildly excited and it doesn't bother me at all, what bothers me is your refusal or utter inability to show any empathy in your naive attempt to debate this.

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Just wanted to give a quick shout out to the team of six grinding in BTB tonight. (played against them a few times) They're deliberately not playing the objective and just spawn killing the opposing team. Calling out, timing weapons, and blatantly executing planned strategies, too. I'm talking like parking warthogs and flying banshees over each spawn zone and mowing everyone down for 20 minutes. I understand the concept of playing competitively versus playing casually, but this is unranked BTB, man. I like to goof around, socialize with random teammates, and have fun watercooler moments in-game. When I play MCC, I'm just trying to have a good time. I'll sweat in the competitive playlists.

 

I guess anyone could make the argument that this is a game design issue at its core, but I'm pretty annoyed that there are kids playing MCC like this. It's fucking pathetic. I know for a fact that there are many new players that are getting pushed away just because they feel the game is unfair or not accessible.

Who would do such a thing

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btw you need to buy the newer xbox one edition to use it.

.......Dude they said you don't need the xbox one x to download the bug fixing update and that's been mentioned several times as well on this forum.
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.......Dude they said you don't need the xbox one x to download the bug fixing update and that's been mentioned several times as well on this forum.

 

It was in the IGN article and I haven't seen it on this forum. A link would be appreciated.

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Just wanted to give a quick shout out to the team of six grinding in BTB tonight. (played against them a few times) They're deliberately not playing the objective and just spawn killing the opposing team. Calling out, timing weapons, and blatantly executing planned strategies, too. I'm talking like parking warthogs and flying banshees over each spawn zone and mowing everyone down for 20 minutes. I understand the concept of playing competitively versus playing casually, but this is unranked BTB, man. I like to goof around, socialize with random teammates, and have fun watercooler moments in-game. When I play MCC, I'm just trying to have a good time. I'll sweat in the competitive playlists.

 

I guess anyone could make the argument that this is a game design issue at its core, but I'm pretty annoyed that there are kids playing MCC like this. It's fucking pathetic. I know for a fact that there are many new players that are getting pushed away just because they feel the game is unfair or not accessible. I still get by and can hold my own, but I feel bad for those lesser skilled players.

It's annoying but understandable. I'd do the same thing personally. You know how long it takes to usually get a game when searching with a big party? it can take hours for 1 game. I'm sure as hell not going to finish the game in 3minutes. BTB stomping has happened in every game since halo 2, and halo2, 3, and reach were very very popular. Also happened in halo 4, and happens in halo5 all the time in warzone. 

 

It's just a match making problem. 

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Just wanted to give a quick shout out to the team of six grinding in BTB tonight. (played against them a few times) They're deliberately not playing the objective and just spawn killing the opposing team. Calling out, timing weapons, and blatantly executing planned strategies, too. I'm talking like parking warthogs and flying banshees over each spawn zone and mowing everyone down for 20 minutes. I understand the concept of playing competitively versus playing casually, but this is unranked BTB, man. I like to goof around, socialize with random teammates, and have fun watercooler moments in-game. When I play MCC, I'm just trying to have a good time. I'll sweat in the competitive playlists.

 

I guess anyone could make the argument that this is a game design issue at its core, but I'm pretty annoyed that there are kids playing MCC like this. It's fucking pathetic. I know for a fact that there are many new players that are getting pushed away just because they feel the game is unfair or not accessible. I still get by and can hold my own, but I feel bad for those lesser skilled players.

Whats the alternative?

 

Ending each obj game in 2 minutes and then waiting for 15+ mins to find a match?

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Maybe you aren't as pissed because you didn't by an xbox one for the MCC only to have it be a broken pile of shit for 3 years with no acknowledgment from the developer, only for them to break the silence via a fucking forum post that announces they might potentially fix the game and btw you need to buy the newer xbox one edition to use it. Your response simply isn't in proportion with the reality of the situation for people like me. I was at entering my prime trying to go pro at halo 2 on the day Halo 3 came out and then I quit because that game was awful competitively. My point is I have had a stake in halo going a long ways back so I take the MCC shit personally and 343 has failed to do anything redeeming. An out of the blue announcement of some possible fix that requires I buy a new console and reactivate my live account is asinine. Maybe you never had skin in the game so this is just whooshing past your head. You're welcome to be mildly excited and it doesn't bother me at all, what bothers me is your refusal or utter inability to show any empathy in your naive attempt to debate this.

 

You're right. I have no personal connection to the franchise whatsoever. You really nailed who I am.

 

I haven't made IRL friends through halo or anything. I didn't forge my best college friendships by LANning Halo 2 and 3 for hours.  Nor have i been to multiple MLG tournaments and many smaller locals.  I didn't LAN halo during my bachelor party instead of getting wasted at a titty bar. I haven't played tens of thousands of games dating back to 2004.  Nor did I buy an Xbox One mostly for MCC.

 

 

That was sarcasm. All of those things are actually true.

Your elitist attitude can go die in a hole somewhere.

 

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That's hard to nail down. Due to how the games are designed, players are forced to implement strategies that maximize team-shot and static positioning. It's the most basic form of teamwork: more players shooting at one player = win. Is a map "good" if it allows for that? I'm not sure; it's "good" in the context of working with the gameplay, but it's "bad" as it relates to actual strategic depth and creative map movement. Let's use Lockout as an example. It has literally one or two viable strategies and it's a bunch of exposed walkways connecting two power positions. It's generally regarded as one of the better maps in Halo 2, but it is incredibly static and boring for actual strategic depth. Is that a "good" map? I don't think so, but it was a staple of Halo 2.

 

Digging this up from a while ago - just because the map played slow didn't make it bad. Lockout reminded me a lot of Assault from Unreal Tournament, or Counterstrike. One team has an advantage (Sniper, or BR control), and the other team is forced to play against it. Because the ingress was so constricted, you had to play a very technical game, which involved precise coordination and positioning. Remember grenading window from elbow so that somebody could push to BR1 from bottom center? Or boosting up into library? The meta revolving around lifting to top Blue to push people off front Library door? It was a different style compared to playing ring-around-the-rosie on Chill Out, but it was still cool. Lockout was one place where you got to see actual strategy play out, rather than just team chemistry.

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You're right. I have no personal connection to the franchise whatsoever. You really nailed who I am.

 

I haven't made IRL friends through halo or anything. I didn't forge my best college friendships by LANning Halo 2 and 3 for hours.  Nor have i been to multiple MLG tournaments and many smaller locals.  I didn't LAN halo during my bachelor party instead of getting wasted at a titty bar. I haven't played tens of thousands of games dating back to 2004.  Nor did I buy an Xbox One mostly for MCC.

 

 

That was sarcasm. All of those things are actually true.

Your elitist attitude can go die in a hole somewhere.

 

 

Hence why I said "maybe." I was speculating due to your reasoning that you weren't a competitive player. Glad we're on the same page there then. What's bewildering then is your lack of spite for halo 4, 5, and the MCC. It's generally indicative of a casual player's attitude to be content with whatever is pushed forward with 'halo' in the title.

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Hence why I said "maybe." I was speculating due to your reasoning that you weren't a competitive player. Glad we're on the same page there then. What's bewildering then is your lack of spite for halo 4, 5, and the MCC. It's generally indicative of a casual player's attitude to be content with whatever is pushed forward with 'halo' in the title.

I think there's no shortage of spite by anyone still bothering to post in this glorified "buyer's remorse" thread.

 

That being said there's nothing to gain by stamping our feet. I think it's in our best interests to show 343 that they are doing good by returning their focus back to MCC.

 

"Cautiously optimistic" is the name of the game. No one's bending over for 343 here.

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Hence why I said "maybe." I was speculating due to your reasoning that you weren't a competitive player. Glad we're on the same page there then. What's bewildering then is your lack of spite for halo 4, 5, and the MCC. It's generally indicative of a casual player's attitude to be content with whatever is pushed forward with 'halo' in the title.

 

oh GOD no.  I'm in no way content with what we have.  Far from it.  Reach started it all for me. Bloom, loadouts, sprint. 

4 was a slap in the face.  MCC was a kick in the nuts.

5 is a step in the right direction, but it needed to be a long march.

 

I am incredibly disappointed with the way that the franchise has been handled since basically 2007 (yeah, starting with bungie).

I am not usually angry anymore for the simple fact that i choose not to be.  Its exhausting.  And it saps any enjoyment out of the things that i do still happen to like (85% of HCS playlist for example).  And i try not to be spiteful and spit in the face of (potential) progress for the simple fact that its not useful at all.

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Would any of us honestly be surprised if in 3 months we get: "We tried our best to push these updates out on to the Xbox One, but due to the technical limitations of the older hardware and the systems in place on that hardware, we decided it would be best to focus our efforts on the Xbox One X. We know this isn't what a lot of you want to hear, but we have to do what's best for our entire fanbase."

 

Given the history with this company, I'm almost expecting that.

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I think there's no shortage of spite by anyone still bothering to post in this glorified "buyer's remorse" thread.

 

That being said there's nothing to gain by stamping our feet. I think it's in our best interests to show 343 that they are doing good by returning their focus back to MCC.

 

"Cautiously optimistic" is the name of the game. No one's bending over for 343 here.

 

I get it but I'm still adamant they should keep it to themselves until they release something tangible because their words mean nothing at this point in time.

 

 

oh GOD no.  I'm in no way content with what we have.  Far from it.  Reach started it all for me. Bloom, loadouts, sprint. 
4 was a slap in the face.  MCC was a kick in the nuts.
5 is a step in the right direction, but it needed to be a long march.
 
I am incredibly disappointed with the way that the franchise has been handled since basically 2007 (yeah, starting with bungie).
I am not usually angry anymore for the simple fact that i choose not to be.  Its exhausting.  And it saps any enjoyment out of the things that i do still happen to like (85% of HCS playlist for example).  And i try not to be spiteful and spit in the face of (potential) progress for the simple fact that its not useful at all.
 
Being spiteful is extremely useful and requires zero energy. Example: Nearly every major AAA title coming out these days includes microtransactions, xray vision, campaigns that are just slightly interactive movies, endless paid DLC, and gameplay that requires little to no skill or thought. This shit is disgusting and is turning the gaming industry to shit. How do I respond? I don't buy these games. If everyone else stopped buying them, something that requires zero effort, then our spite would push developers to change their shitty ways.
 
Putting this into the context of MCC:
 
-343 owes us a working MCC because we already paid for a working MCC.
-343 has failed to take ownership of what they did (my definition of ownership for their mistakes would be refunds for all customers, minimum).
-343 has failed to repair their broken game and in less than a week we'll be at the 3-year mark since release.
 
Giving them positive acknowledgement of their announced intention to fix MCC is how you tell them that they can do the above list and there will be no repurcussions. That's not a healthy company-customer relationship and being apathetic only enables it and allows it to get worse.
 
 
Okay thank you, that's good to know.
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Digging this up from a while ago - just because the map played slow didn't make it bad. Lockout reminded me a lot of Assault from Unreal Tournament, or Counterstrike. One team has an advantage (Sniper, or BR control), and the other team is forced to play against it. Because the ingress was so constricted, you had to play a very technical game, which involved precise coordination and positioning. Remember grenading window from elbow so that somebody could push to BR1 from bottom center? Or boosting up into library? The meta revolving around lifting to top Blue to push people off front Library door? It was a different style compared to playing ring-around-the-rosie on Chill Out, but it was still cool. Lockout was one place where you got to see actual strategy play out, rather than just team chemistry.

 

A campfest in an arena-style shooter is never a good thing, it promotes zero of the skills endemic to that kind of game. And strategy is not "strategy" when you are mandated to do the same thing every game, without variation. 

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Something I noticed while playing BC Halo 3 today is the death animations are different from the MCC version...off host on both.

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Just wanted to give a quick shout out to the team of six grinding in BTB tonight. (played against them a few times) They're deliberately not playing the objective and just spawn killing the opposing team. Calling out, timing weapons, and blatantly executing planned strategies, too. I'm talking like parking warthogs and flying banshees over each spawn zone and mowing everyone down for 20 minutes. I understand the concept of playing competitively versus playing casually, but this is unranked BTB, man. I like to goof around, socialize with random teammates, and have fun watercooler moments in-game. When I play MCC, I'm just trying to have a good time. I'll sweat in the competitive playlists.

 

I guess anyone could make the argument that this is a game design issue at its core, but I'm pretty annoyed that there are kids playing MCC like this. It's fucking pathetic. I know for a fact that there are many new players that are getting pushed away just because they feel the game is unfair or not accessible. I still get by and can hold my own, but I feel bad for those lesser skilled players.

 

Trying to get into classic Halo in 2017 is like throwing a toddler into the deep ocean and telling it to swim.  There really aren't any resources for newcomers to improve in MCC atm (sans the series you were doing back in 2014).  What that BtB team was doing is really f'ed up though.  Would love to match them and show em what real skill looks like.               

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A campfest in an arena-style shooter is never a good thing, it promotes zero of the skills endemic to that kind of game. And strategy is not "strategy" when you are mandated to do the same thing every game, without variation. 

 

True, it did reward skills antithetical to the essence of Halo. That's why scrubs like the Ogres and Walshy were able to succeed so consistently. Remember their famous green room oddball strategy, which _every_ other team did because they were mandated to?

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True, it did reward skills antithetical to the essence of Halo. That's why scrubs like the Ogres and Walshy were able to succeed so consistently. Remember their famous green room oddball strategy, which _every_ other team did because they were mandated to?

 

Remember when we were very obviously referring to Lockout slayer? 

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Just wanted to give a quick shout out to the team of six grinding in BTB tonight. (played against them a few times) They're deliberately not playing the objective and just spawn killing the opposing team. Calling out, timing weapons, and blatantly executing planned strategies, too. I'm talking like parking warthogs and flying banshees over each spawn zone and mowing everyone down for 20 minutes. I understand the concept of playing competitively versus playing casually, but this is unranked BTB, man. I like to goof around, socialize with random teammates, and have fun watercooler moments in-game. When I play MCC, I'm just trying to have a good time. I'll sweat in the competitive playlists.

 

I guess anyone could make the argument that this is a game design issue at its core, but I'm pretty annoyed that there are kids playing MCC like this. It's fucking pathetic. I know for a fact that there are many new players that are getting pushed away just because they feel the game is unfair or not accessible. I still get by and can hold my own, but I feel bad for those lesser skilled players.

What in farmnation  :kappa:

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I feel like 343 is starting to tinker with MCC. The hit recognition feels noticeably different for me in H2 and H3. Online play is so erractic though not sure if it’s real or random connection fluctuations. Anyone notice anything?

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Remember when we were very obviously referring to Lockout slayer? 

 

I really don't think we were but whatever. I'm just saying that Lockout standoffs were a feature, not a bug. The sneaky, careful, slow style that it promoted was an excellent change of pace from, say, Warlock, which exercised a completely different type of team coherence. It reminds me a lot of close games on Damnation where each camo is heavily contested. Winning damnation is as much about coordinating unpredictable pushes and using unconventional angles to challenge the powerups as it is about running and gunning.

 

In my opinion, part of what makes Halo great is that the game fluidly moves between many different paces. Sometimes it makes sense to slow it down, sometimes it makes sense to speed it up. A huge part of what defines a team's style of gameplay is how they modulate between these two extremes to play their advantages. Fast-paced gameplay with constant spawn-nading and very aggressive pushes can be really difficult to overcome, but sometimes discipline and carefully choosing your battles can win the day. Maps which can support both styles are my favorite - where else can you have a fast and furious game suddenly freeze at 49-49? The best, most dramatic Halo moments in history are made here. Think about epic standoffs between TDT and StK on Chill Out, or FB coming back by 13 kills on Beaver Creek. Those maps -can- be played ferociously, but it's also possible to camp pink room. And once you do, the counter-play (jump into the window from the rafters in side-room?) can be a fascinating piece of the meta.

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In my opinion, part of what makes Halo great is that the game fluidly moves between many different paces. Sometimes it makes sense to slow it down, sometimes it makes sense to speed it up. A huge part of what defines a team's style of gameplay is how they modulate between these two extremes to play their advantages. Fast-paced gameplay with constant spawn-nading and very aggressive pushes can be really difficult to overcome, but sometimes discipline and carefully choosing your battles can win the day. Maps which can support both styles are my favorite - where else can you have a fast and furious game suddenly freeze at 49-49? The best, most dramatic Halo moments in history are made here. Think about epic standoffs between TDT and StK on Chill Out, or FB coming back by 13 kills on Beaver Creek. Those maps -can- be played ferociously, but it's also possible to camp pink room. And once you do, the counter-play (jump into the window from the rafters in side-room?) can be a fascinating piece of the meta.

 

This argument is counter to your previous argument. I agree with you that the variation in viable play-styles is part of what makes Halo great, and that's also my issue with Halo 2 and Halo 3: they don't support that variety. The standoffs are neither a "feature" nor a "bug," they are the result of a decrease in individual potency in those games. They are the only viable strategy. I get that there was tension in the standoffs and whether or not they will break, but there is also tension in a 300 person championship finals rock-paper-scissors match. It's just a natural result of competition, not proof that it's better or more viable competition than something else.

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