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CyReN

Halo: The Master Chief Collection Discussion

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It's very easy to say that when ignoring literally any redeeming factor of any element of a game.

 

Ah, the "ur a closed-minded doo doo!!!1" argument. Always a classic.

 

I can take solace in the fact that the attitude you're preaching drove MLG Reach straight into the ground. And Halo 4 for that matter, with fucking armor abilities and ARs and whatever else Ghost fucking threw in there.

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It's not hard to miss a shot with Rockets. The problem with recent Halo games is the rockets(and almost every other weapon in Reach & 4) are too easy to use. Every explosion is so big that anything within 20 ft gets killed. If the explosions are dialed back a little bit, it would make them a lot harder to use. Same with grenades and all the other explosives. 

Halo 1 Rockets and Grenades had a huge blast radius. Rockets don't provide as large an advantage when they make a little pop instead of a bang. Even worse when they are put on a 3-minute timer.

 

 

People don't fight for jetpack, but they do for rockets. Jetpack might be worthy of the sandbox if it was more powerful useful and had limited uses.

What about the Reach v7 Jetpack? Where it was limited to the role of an on-map pickup?

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yes, would the game be more skillful if it was ar vs ar?

Harder to kill them, so yeah.

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Halo 4 grenades have a splash damage radius of about 0.3 centimeters. How much smaller do you want it?

 

Halo 2 and Halo 3 had the paper rockets that you're talking about, and they fucking sucked. They were barely worth making the effort to control. The entire point of rockets is that they're meant to serve as the super weapon/BFG. Their purpose is to direct map traffic. The more powerful they are, the better the job they will do.

 

I get hit from distance by the grenades in H4, I don't know what grenades you use, but the ones I have thrown at me hit me from a decent distance. They are annoying as hell. 

 

The rockets are a power weapon and should be powerful, but there is a difference between a power weapon and one that is too powerful to counter. I feel the rockets from Halo 2/3 were a great balance and not too powerful that someone with a decent brain can take out the average rocket guy. In H:R and H4 you don't have to land the rocket any closer than the general area of an opponent and they die. That's just my opinion. Same about Jetpack. It's a shit thing, some people like it, but I'm not one of them. 

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Ah, the "ur a closed-minded doo doo!!!1" argument. Always a classic.

 

I can take solace in the fact that the attitude you're preaching drove MLG Reach straight into the ground. And Halo 4 for that matter, with fucking armor abilities and ARs and whatever else Ghost fucking threw in there.

You provided no argument against Jetpack at the time of that post.

It provides a new layer of control as a powerup. You certainly don't want the disadvantaged team to fly up to kill you, so you either control the Jetpack, or bait it.

 

I disagree with removing sandbox elements "just because."

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You provided no argument against Jetpack at the time of that post.

It provides a new layer of control as a powerup. You certainly don't want the disadvantaged team to fly up to kill you, so you either control the Jetpack, or bait it.

 

I disagree with removing sandbox elements "just because."

 

That argument could be said about any Armor Ability that was in the game. Thus giving justification for AAs to stay in the game. Just because they are less abundant and you can't spawn with them doesn't mean they aren't still game breaking or horrible. 

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What about the Reach v7 Jetpack? Where it was limited to the role of an on-map pickup?

It would work if it was a game-changer with limited uses, which it currently isn't. Having it as a pickup is better, but if there's no competition over it (as there would be with rockets or OS), then the person who picks it up will only do so if they happen to spawn nearby, automatically negating the purpose of having it there in the first place. There is some competition over it, but not enough to warrant it as a map pickup.

 

As a rule of thumb, if you've never heard someone calling out that [item] is up, then the [item] doesn't belong in the game.

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I get hit from distance by the grenades in H4, I don't know what grenades you use, but the ones I have thrown at me hit me from a decent distance. They are annoying as hell.

 

Whoever's throwing them must have explosives at their support upgrade. Without that they are absolutely useless.

 

The rockets are a power weapon and should be powerful, but there is a difference between a power weapon and one that is too powerful to counter. I feel the rockets from Halo 2/3 were a great balance and not too powerful that someone with a decent brain can take out the average rocket guy. In H:R and H4 you don't have to land the rocket any closer than the general area of an opponent and they die. That's just my opinion. Same about Jetpack. It's a shit thing, some people like it, but I'm not one of them.

 

Someone with a decent brain can kill a rocket guy in any Halo game, unless they let him scurry away from the rocket spawn and get to a good spot on the map. In which case they deserve to get owned.

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As a rule of thumb, if you've never heard someone calling out that [item] is up, then the [item] doesn't belong in the game.

 

I don't hear people calling out BR or carbine respawns very often...

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You provided no argument against Jetpack at the time of that post.

It provides a new layer of control as a powerup. You certainly don't want the disadvantaged team to fly up to kill you, so you either control the Jetpack, or bait it.

 

Jetpack's not a golden egg, it's an annoyance. What's your next argument, that MLG should have kept armor lock in the settings because the disadvantaged team wouldn't want to get AL meleed?

 

I disagree with removing sandbox elements "just because."

 

And your mentality played a big part in ruining the competitive Halo scene. Congratulations.

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That argument could be said about any Armor Ability that was in the game. Thus giving justification for AAs to stay in the game. Just because they are less abundant and you can't spawn with them doesn't mean they aren't still game breaking or horrible. 

 

Exactly, it's just like Halo 3 equipment. It's either going to be irrelevant or game-breaking. But it will never be a positive addition to the sandbox.

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I don't hear people calling out BR or carbine respawns very often...

 

When I would play at what I thought was a competitive level in H3, if the game was AR starts, my team would always be checking BR spawns. It wasn't a callout more so than just part of our flow to prevent the other team from getting a BR, but we still did our best to control the BR spawns as best we could. 

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When I would play at what I thought was a competitive level in H3, if the game was AR starts, my team would always be checking BR spawns. It wasn't a callout more so than just part of our flow to prevent the other team from getting a BR, but we still did our best to control the BR spawns as best we could. 

 

Yeah, but those weren't competitive settings, that was Bungie trolling their fanbase.

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Nothing valuable as in "it wasnt in Halo 3 so it cant be good "?

 

More like it wasn't in Halo 1 so it can't be good. I mean if you're gonna play the nostalgia card, at least play the correct one.

 

You could get pretty creative with jetpack in Reach MLG settings. Countdown flag comes to mind.

 

So someone makes a kewl jetpack flag toss once every 15 games or something, and that suddenly forgives the fact that it breaks any vertically focused map? Ooookkkkaaaayyyyy.

 

Rockets on the other hand are often just placed on a map because if nobody gets them and collects the 2-4 "free" kills nothing ever happens.

Pit ts/ctf games are a good example for this.

 

It's called map flow.

 

 

Never talked about Halo 1. H3 had by far the most stripped down sandbox and dismissing anything if it isnt Rockets/snipe/br is exactly what is wrong.

 

Your argument is all over the place. On ONE hand you say "So someone makes a kewl jetpack flag toss once every 15 games or something"

 

Which implies it didnt have a noticeable effect on gameplay, (wether good or bad) on the other hand you say "and that suddenly forgives the fact that it breaks any vertically focused map?" Implying it is so powerful it changes the whole game.

 

Either Jetpack is useful and makes a difference or its can be disregarded because nobody uses it as it isnt very good.

If it WAS op people would have used it all the time.

 

By that line of thought camo is incredibly overpowered and breaks ANY map because you can sneak around pretty much as much as you want for the entire duration.

Get a sniper and you are incredibly powerful.

 

 

Also what do rockets have to do with map flow? If you are saying a power weapon creates map flow around that area just put a sniper there instead so the weapon atleast needs some kind of proficiency to be useful.

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I don't hear people calling out BR or carbine respawns very often...

I don't hear people saying the Carbine is a good weapon very often. :maven: 

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That argument could be said about any Armor Ability that was in the game. Thus giving justification for AAs to stay in the game. Just because they are less abundant and you can't spawn with them doesn't mean they aren't still game breaking or horrible.

Yeah, no pickups ever. Just BR(DMR and Pistol noobs go back to CoD). Players spawn every 3 minutes.

 

 

It would work if it was a game-changer with limited uses, which it currently isn't. Having it as a pickup is better, but if there's no competition over it (as there would be with rockets or OS), then the person who picks it up will only do so if they happen to spawn nearby, automatically negating the purpose of having it there in the first place. There is some competition over it, but not enough to warrant it as a map pickup.

Of course, the system is not without flaws, and could certainly use some changes; having a powerup that is burned so quickly isn't the most ideal. Something like Quake's Quad Damage(Drops on death, can be picked up by other players, but with limited use overall) would be a start.

 

As a rule of thumb, if you've never heard someone calling out that [item] is up, then the [item] doesn't belong in the game.

 

Players aren't sitting in main room on Chill Out every 30 seconds for a Plasma Rifle, but that doesn't mean the weapon has no place in Halo 1 as a whole.

 

Jetpack's not a golden egg, it's an annoyance. What's your next argument, that MLG should have kept armor lock in the settings because the disadvantaged team wouldn't want to get AL meleed?

Jetpack is different from the other AAs because it can directly give players an offensive ability. It allows the controller to make pushes more easily. Every other AA was designed around defense.

 

And your mentality played a big part in ruining the competitive Halo scene. Congratulations.

Yeah, Halo 4 was trash just because Ghost decided to incorporate the Assault Rifle, a weapon that finally got a buff after 12 years.

Nah, no other reason. Not sprint, not ordinance, not the lack of descope, it was just that damn AR!

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Jetpack's not a golden egg, it's an annoyance. What's your next argument, that MLG should have kept armor lock in the settings because the disadvantaged team wouldn't want to get AL meleed?

 

 

And your mentality played a big part in ruining the competitive Halo scene. Congratulations.

 

So if you don't automaticly hate on something because its "not halo" (whatever that even means) you "play a part in having ruined the competitive halo scene" ?

 

People with this mindset dont actually want a good game. They just want something they can say plays like "halo".

 

Since apparently shitty br spread, 2 power weapons and 2 powerups and midship remake number 23 constitutues to halo.

Carbine or Lightrifle starts? OMG it's pink/yellow it cant be good because it doesnt have a br skin.

 

If you ask me, thats exactly what killed competitive halo.

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Yeah, but those weren't competitive settings, that was Bungie trolling their fanbase.

 

That's why I made the distinction by saying, it was what I thought was competitive. I am a competitive person, but I'm not a competitive person as many Halo competitive people are claiming to be. That being said, I like the competitive settings and design of the old Halo games because like I said, I'm a competitive person by nature. It sucks to lose, but I'm not good enough to really be competitive in the competitive Halo scene.

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So if you don't automaticly hate on something because its "not halo" (whatever that even means) you "play a part in having ruined the competitive halo scene" ?

 

People with this mindset dont actually want a good game. They just want something they can say plays like "halo".

 

Since apparently shitty br spread, 2 power weapons and 2 powerups and midship remake number 23 constitutues to halo.

Carbine or Lightrifle starts? OMG it's pink/yellow it cant be good because it doesnt have a br skin.

 

If you ask me, thats exactly what killed competitive halo.

 

The things that killed competitive Halo are the things that killed Halo. AAs killed Halo. Sprint killed Halo. Randomness killed Halo. People wanted a fair game that is predictable. Having spread on the BR is random. That made people dislike the BR in some aspects. Letting people be different by giving them AAs made more randomness in the game. Then loadouts and perks which made people less equal and less predictable. What feels like Halo is when everyone spawn with the same weapon (that actually has some viable use towards protection) and everyone is equal in terms of equipment. Sprint gave people a burst of speed at random times at the press of a button. 

 

I honestly wouldn't care if they got rid of the BR and put in only DMRs or even Carbines as long as everyone spawned with it and I could protect myself from any other weapon. That doesn't mean I can kill someone with any other weapon, it just means that if I'm being shot at by a sniper, I can hit him and descope him so he has to work for his kill. Or if an AR or sword comes charging at me, I can still put up a fight. 

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Nothing valuable as in "it wasnt in Halo 3 so it cant be good "?

 

More like it wasn't in Halo 1 so it can't be good. I mean if you're gonna play the nostalgia card, at least play the correct one.

 

 

 

 

Have you seen a lot of the people that post here? All Halo 3 all the time.

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The things that killed competitive Halo are the things that killed Halo. AAs killed Halo. Sprint killed Halo. Randomness killed Halo. People wanted a fair game that is predictable. Having spread on the BR is random. That made people dislike the BR in some aspects. Letting people be different by giving them AAs made more randomness in the game. Then loadouts and perks which made people less equal and less predictable. What feels like Halo is when everyone spawn with the same weapon (that actually has some viable use towards protection) and everyone is equal in terms of equipment. Sprint gave people a burst of speed at random times at the press of a button. 

 

I honestly wouldn't care if they got rid of the BR and put in only DMRs or even Carbines as long as everyone spawned with it and I could protect myself from any other weapon. That doesn't mean I can kill someone with any other weapon, it just means that if I'm being shot at by a sniper, I can hit him and descope him so he has to work for his kill. Or if an AR or sword comes charging at me, I can still put up a fight. 

I don't think any single person in this thread arguing for Jetpacks wants them off-spawn or in loadouts.

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Yeah, no pickups ever. Just BR(DMR and Pistol noobs go back to CoD). Players spawn every 3 minutes.

 

I'd love to see where I ever said that. I was merely talking about Jetpack specifically, but expanded the argument to include all AAs.

 

Weapons are different. If there was only BRs, no other weapons, and no AAs, it would still be more competitive and 100x better than H4.

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Have you seen a lot of the people that post here? All Halo 3 all the time.

 

I see more H:CE and H2 than H3. What threads are you reading?

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