Jump to content
CyReN

The Great Halo Debate Thread

Recommended Posts

There was a ZB mod very early on, it might be what he's talking about. But it was nothing like 343's fix; the mod could not be done on a retail console, and did not use the Megalo extensions 343 added in the TU.

Yeah I remember that video, I don't think that's what he's talking about though as the phrasing implies more than speculation.

Share this post


Link to post

Sometimes I wonder if 343i gave us ZBNS in Reach only to look like to good guys and earn our trust, only to f all of us up with Halo 4. *sigh*

 

Please..no more Projectile BR, I dont want to go back to the nightmare that was Halo 3 online.

I think it was easy for them to give us what we wanted in Reach, they heard our complaints, it wasn't their game so they didn't really have a problem with changing it when it was nearing the end of its lifespan. Also, I'm sure they did it to make them look like the good guys so they'd be more popular come H4 launch time.

 

They didn't intentionally fuck us up with Halo 4. They didn't plan on having a bad MM population, it's what happens when you bring in a new company who have no experience with making a Halo title from the ground up, when the lead MP Designer previously worked on a car racing game and has no experience in FPS games, when you outsource parts of the game to different companies/contractors, when you rush the game to beat the launch of your rival FPS title (CoD), when you attempt to draw in a new type of crowd that may like this CoD/Halo mashup.

 

Honestly, that's really the only thing that's giving me a small glimmer of hope that Halo 5 will be decent/good, in that 343 tried something, they saw the results and how it wasn't popular so hopefully they'll swallow their pride and give us a game that the fans have been asking for. But, I'm not holding my breath. 

  • Upvote (+1) 8

Share this post


Link to post

The majority of that video was abusing the pistols OP power at close range in ZB DMR start games, and I dont see how coming back from shots happened more(it actually happened less) with the DMR portion of that montage than any H2 montage I linked. I believe that is why the pistol was never included as a starting weapon in comp settings.

 

As to your first point, he only shot with the DMR like 4 or 5 times in that whole vid, so obviously there wouldnt be a ton of those clips.

 

I would have loved to see a ZB pistol start MLG gametype. It was just faster than what everyone was used to, but it was awesome. OP is hardly the right term, esp if everyone spawned with one. I was really irritated that everyone seemed to dislike it so much. Oh well.

  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

As to your first point, he only shot with the DMR like 4 or 5 times in that whole vid, so obviously there wouldnt be a ton of those clips.

 

I would have loved to see a ZB pistol start MLG gametype. It was just faster than what everyone was used to, but it was awesome. OP is hardly the right term, esp if everyone spawned with one. I was really irritated that everyone seemed to dislike it so much. Oh well.

People disliked it because of the massive spread the ZB pistol had

  • Upvote (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post

People disliked it because of the massive spread the ZB pistol had

lol if only the halo 4 people would choose a starting weapon based on that reason.

  • Upvote (+1) 5

Share this post


Link to post

Source? Interesting if it's true, seems pretty unbelievable though.

To be fair, I'd have to dig around se7ensins and YouTube more than I want to, but there were videos of ZB mods floating around months before the TU even was announced. Modders have that kind of power, it's just hard to share to other people who don't have the proper hardware / software to make use of them.

 

And there's almost no way of getting online with modded content in the first place without risking a permanent ban.

 

Even for H4, there have been multiple mods and 343 hasn't been afraid to use them as their own. Mini Slayer from Action Sack is not something 343 made. But they never credited anyone for it, just grabbed it and tossed in MM.

 

If anything, it should show that it's not something they care very much about, so long as it's available and that there's demand for it.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
But they never credited anyone for it, just grabbed it and tossed in MM.

To be fair, they did tune a bunch of the weapons completely separate for Mini Slayer, and modified community maps specifically for the gametype. Why would they give credit to modders who are just changing the values 343 already added to the game, and who are modifying the game against the Xbox Live Terms of Service to begun with?

  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

To be fair, they did tune a bunch of the weapons completely separate for Mini Slayer, and modified community maps specifically for the gametype. Why would they give credit to modders who are just changing the values 343 already added to the game, and who are modifying the game against the Xbox Live Terms of Service to begun with?

Do you feel it only fair to acknowledge the concept was from modders.?

  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Downvote (-1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

To be fair, they did tune a bunch of the weapons completely separate for Mini Slayer, and modified community maps specifically for the gametype. Why would they give credit to modders who are just changing the values 343 already added to the game, and who are modifying the game against the Xbox Live Terms of Service to begun with?

That's like saying if someone created a map and its whole concept, as well as Forged it, they don't deserve the credit because it was made within the in-game engine, or because I placed the spawn points or the weapons on it.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Does the Master Chief even lift?

 

Discuss.

 

 

Inb4 do you even flip Scorpions bro?


 

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

That's like saying if someone created a map and its whole concept, as well as Forged it, they don't deserve the credit because it was made within the in-game engine, or because I placed the spawn points or the weapons on it.

It's like saying you created a gametype, then refined it and made it a polished-enough experience to work in matchmaking.

 

Why are you complaining about this when Bungie blatantly stole Zombies and included it in Halo 3 as a real gametype with no credit given?

Share this post


Link to post

It's like saying you created a gametype, then refined it and made it a polished-enough experience to work in matchmaking.

 

Why are you complaining about this when Bungie blatantly stole Zombies and included it in Halo 3 as a real gametype with no credit given?

Difference is that Mini Slayer was working fine without any action required on 343's side.

 

And Halo 3 Infection was something that the players were not able to create on their own, yet was very much requested and very popular. Bungie gave the players the tools to make it happen. No one can ever take credit for the creation of Halo 2's honor rules which allowed for Zombies, because it wasn't an actual mode with a name on it.

 

I'm sure I can go spend 15 minutes on Se7ensins and find the original creator of Mini Slayer. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if their personal GT was the one tied to the actual mode.

 

I don't think there's anything else to debate here, so take it as you will. The initial point is that 343 does not seem to care to entitle themselves the credit for someone else's work.

Share this post


Link to post

It's like saying you created a gametype, then refined it and made it a polished-enough experience to work in matchmaking.

 

Why are you complaining about this when Bungie blatantly stole Zombies and included it in Halo 3 as a real gametype with no credit given?

 

 

We are talking about 343 not bungie. Nothing has changed...

Share this post


Link to post

ZB was created by a modder, 343 just took the credit for it, thus creating a nasty PR stunt.

 

It says something when they can't even edit their own game because the code is too shit, nor H3 because it's "legacy tech".

 

Really? That is surprising if true 

Share this post


Link to post

Really? That is surprising if true 

Yeah, That's true. Modders created NBNS first and posted videos and gametypes on the web. Those video's and gametypes blew up majorly in like hours. Not to long later we were getting a NBNS patch.

  • Upvote (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, That's true. Modders created NBNS first and posted videos and gametypes on the web. Those video's and gametypes blew up majorly in like hours. Not to long later we were getting a NBNS patch.

I'm not that surprised,  thing is...they did used the same tools 343i used the same tools (or this case vice versa) to create those gametypes ?

Share this post


Link to post

Or 343i was planning to decrease bloom when they was working on CEA.

 

C'mon man.

 

They did not see that mod video and decided at that very moment they should decrease bloom on the magnum so it slightly resembles the CE pistol.

Share this post


Link to post

Or 343i was planning to decrease bloom when they was working on CEA.

 

C'mon man.

 

They did not see that mod video and decided at that very moment they should decrease bloom on the magnum so it slightly resembles the CE pistol.

Here's a knowledge bomb for you.

 

The "decreased" bloom we saw in the TU is just how your weapons behave when you crouch and spam. It wasn't hard editing of the values, it was just added as a passive thing.

 

If anything, they've proved they can edit the RoF of weapons. But you'll know that if you ever have played Halo 3 online and had the misfortune of meeting a modder on a Jtag, it's something modders have been able to do since forever. That, soar like 100 meters high and spam a sniper that shoots as fast as you can pull the trigger with bottomless clip (before that was even a custom game attribute) with AI-based auto aim.

 

In Reach, not even a single month in post-release, all I did was run Arena 24/7 and I met a modder who was abusing the same stuff. He had a DMR that could shoot with an incredible RoF. I still have the film saved with the original date.

 

343 is hasn't been doing anything new and takes forever to release most of the stuff. Worst part is that they can't be bothered giving us the ability to edit those attributes ourselves. I think that tells a lot about the effort they're willing to put into it.

Share this post


Link to post

CE veterans; how do you think Halo 2 and following Halos would have turned out if Bungie kept the E3 Campaign BR (not the burst-single hybrid shown in multiplayer)?

 

 

It was single shot and seemed to be more powerful than the CE pistol. Assume that all the other core changes for H2 were the same (weak, bouncy, grenades, higher jump height, duel wielding, high aim assist). 

  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

I never actually realized that the ZB DMR in Reach actually had a tiny bit of spread, I thought it had none.

Only when unscoped, and it really doesn't affect the shot at all. I would even say the spread on the ZB DMR matters less than the Pistol.

 

 

The "decreased" bloom we saw in the TU is just how your weapons behave when you crouch and spam. It wasn't hard editing of the values, it was just added as a passive thing.

Did you really expect 343 to completely delete bloom in a TU? Too many players started with Reach and/or preferred bloom. This was the only way they could actually change bloom values while still giving players the option to play vanilla.

It's asinine to think everything 343 has made only exists because of modders.

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, That's true. Modders created NBNS first and posted videos and gametypes on the web. Those video's and gametypes blew up majorly in like hours. Not to long later we were getting a NBNS patch.

Modders.

 

Saving Halo since god knows how long.

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, That's true. Modders created NBNS first and posted videos and gametypes on the web. Those video's and gametypes blew up majorly in like hours. Not to long later we were getting a NBNS patch.

Are you fucking ********?

Share this post


Link to post

Are you fucking ********?

No?

I'm not saying 343 saw those videos and thats what made them do a TU. But modders definitely help pave the way.

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use & Privacy Policy.