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Could a 4sk DMR work in Halo 4?

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Consistency is also important. Not just the kill time. 

 

I agree. However, lets look at the effects of slow kill time vs inconsistent weapon:

 

Inconsistent weapon: You lose some battles that you should have won

 

Slow kill time: Map control become irrelevant, team shooting is forced in order to do anything, skill is no longer required to be a top player, sprint's effects are multiplied. Positioning is no longer important.

 

As much as I hate random weapons (And I really fucking hate them), I would prefer a gun that makes you lose 20% of the battles you should have won over a gun that has a slow kill time. Random just makes more bullshit, but a slow kill time completely destroys all strategy, positioning, and map control. Of the two, random spread is the lesser of two evils. The bullshit you experience is similar to random spawn bullshit. 

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That's too much in my opinion.

It should be six if anything.

5sk carbine still takes more than a second to kill. The CE pistol took 0.6. 

 

I don't understand what you mean by too much. Do you really enjoy the effect sprint+slow kill times has on the game, and how it destroys all semblance of map control. 

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I agree. However, lets look at the effects of slow kill time vs inconsistent weapon:

 

Inconsistent weapon: You lose some battles that you should have won

 

Slow kill time: Map control become irrelevant, team shooting is forced in order to do anything, skill is no longer required to be a top player, sprint's effects are multiplied. Positioning is no longer important.

 

As much as I hate random weapons (And I really fucking hate them), I would prefer a gun that makes you lose 20% of the battles you should have won over a gun that has a slow kill time. Random just makes more bullshit, but a slow kill time completely destroys all strategy, positioning, and map control. Of the two, random spread is the lesser of two evils. The bullshit you experience is similar to random spawn bullshit. 

 

You're not wrong, but the DMRs kill time isn't that much slower than the BR right? Was it off by a second or less?

I was gonna use an example, but i decided to just leave it at that. 

 

Anyways. kill time is important, so is consistency. So say if you have a weapon that has a kill time at 1.2, but it's a little inconsistent, but you have a weapon that's extremely consistent and has a kill time of 1.3. I think going with the 1.3 kill time is better. It may not have the faster kill time, but it's not 1 more second is terrible and 1.3 isn't that bad anyways. So why not go with the consistent weapon? 

Kinda the same thing that's happened with the BR and DMR. 

 

BR had a worse kill time and had spread while the DMR is was more consistent and had a faster kill time yet the community still chooses the BR. Now the BR has a faster kill time(slightly), but is more inconsistent now and is still chosen has the rifle of choice for competitive play. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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You're not wrong, but the DMRs kill time isn't that much slower than the BR right? Was it off by a second or less?

I was gonna use an example, but i decided to just leave it at that. 

 

Anyways. kill time is important, so is consistency. So say if you have a weapon that has a kill time at 1.2, but it's a little inconsistent, but you have a weapon that's extremely consistent and has a kill time of 1.3. I think going with the 1.3 kill time is better. It may not have the faster kill time, but it's not 1 more second is terrible and 1.3 isn't that bad anyways. So why not go with the consistent weapon? 

Kinda the same thing that's happened with the BR and DMR. 

 

BR had a worse kill time and had spread while the DMR is was more consistent and had a faster kill time yet the community still chooses the BR. Now the BR has a faster kill time(slightly), but is more inconsistent now and is still chosen has the rifle of choice for competitive play. 

 

You aren't wrong necessarily, but there is more to it than that.

 

With no-sprint, a 1.5s kill time is bearable. Any more is ********. In order to make sprint work however, and still have map control you have to cut kill times to AT MOST 1.1s. Any more than that, and sprint degrades the game to a shit hole. That is the primary reason Halo 4 sucks above anything else. Getting as close to that as possible (without breaking things) is the number 1 priority to fixing Halo 4.

 

Every 0.1 second longer makes the game play not slightly worse, but significantly worse. The BR is 1.3ish, and the DMR is 1.42 last I checked. That means that the BR would have to kill in a 3sk for Halo 4 to even be playable, and the DMR would probably have to be 4sk, or 3sk. 

 

None of that is possible however, so taking the kill time down by even a tenth of a second is more beneficial than having a perfectly consistent weapon, so long as the weapon in question isn't too random. With 11 bullets to kill, the BR isn't too random, even though it is still a little random. If it were 12sk, then that would be really bad, but that 1 bullet leway makes it consistent enough that the slightly faster kill time is much, much more than worth it. 

 

The other option is remove sprint.

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I'd prefer No-Sprint to fast kill times and fast kill times to non-random weapons, but how bout we just agree on all three?

I'd love that, but let's be realistic here.

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5sk carbine still takes more than a second to kill. The CE pistol took 0.6.

 

I don't understand what you mean by too much. Do you really enjoy the effect sprint+slow kill times has on the game, and how it destroys all semblance of map control.

It's because we would have three precision rifles that are similar.

The carbine right now could use a slight buff and improved aim assist but that's it.

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I would definitely be ok with it if the range of the DMR was drastically reduced. Wouldn't slow down map movement with a short range.

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See, now the problem is that so many people are concerned about the balance of the weapons. They want the DMR, BR, Carbine, and Lightrifle to all be balanced. 

 

If they want balance, that is fine, but I would rather have one weapon that isn't complete shit, than 4 balanced piles of crap. 

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See, now the problem is that so many people are concerned about the balance of the weapons. They want the DMR, BR, Carbine, and Lightrifle to all be balanced. 

 

If they want balance, that is fine, but I would rather have one weapon that isn't complete shit, than 4 balanced piles of crap.

 

I'd love that, but let's be realistic here.

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I agree that I would rather have weapons that do a certain job well, and can be used more better in different situations, circumstances, along side a well done Utility Precision Rifle. Halo CE had this set-up the best out of all the Halo games, the Halo CE Magnum is a great Utility weapon, that acted as Halo CE's Precision weapon with the rest of the sandbox seemingly built around its capabilities and usefulness, its sandbox was very successful.

 

Every weapon deserves to have their own effect on the games sandbox, and for me in Halo 2, and Halo 3, the weapon I enjoyed picking up the most was the Carbine, I felt it suited its purpose really well in those games honestly. However I feel now in Halo 4 the Carbine takes to many shots to kill, and has a Rate-of-Fire that is simply to fast for my taste and a Aim-Assist, Bullet Magnetism, level that is to high to introduce a true skill-gap with the weapon. In my experience most people simply use the current Matchmaking setting Carbine for easy trigger spamming and clean up kills and the Carbine deserves better honestly, I would prefer it had a more similar set-up to Reach's Needle Rifle to be honest, I love that Rifle.

 

It is honestly time that Halo got back into the groove of introducing unique weapons, alongside a great sandbox with plenty of variety involved within it. Doing this by making one weapon stand out as the Utility Precision Weapon so we can all once again be on a balanced, even, ground from the start of every match would be wonderful.. I really miss that since the past two games have started off with a chaotic, random, sandbox.

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A 6sk Carbine is perfect. The Unity+ settings have one and it's great.

And the only problem here and it's probably on everyone else's minds too. I think if you would make the DMR 4sk, everyone would be complaining how the BR is under powered. Like I said before, I think if you nerf the DMR RoF to Reach's DMR, and enable bleedthrough, it can be just as good as the BR.

 

 

Btw, how did you get your hands on Unity+? I can't seem to find it anywhere.

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And the only problem here and it's probably on everyone else's minds too. I think if you would make the DMR 4sk, everyone would be complaining how the BR is under powered. Like I said before, I think if you nerf the DMR RoF to Reach's DMR, and enable bleedthrough, it can be just as good as the BR.

 

 

Btw, how did you get your hands on Unity+? I can't seem to find it anywhere.

Personally...fuck the BR. I don't care for it. It promotes the type of Halo that i hate. The whole "everyone charge so we can get closer because our shots can't hit anything outside of mid-range" is a pathetic strat. Map control revolves around charging areas over and over and power positions are much less weaker because you can't defend yourself and the area properly. You have to hold a teammates hand to do everything, Individual skill is diminished with this terrible gun. Getting rewarded for sloppy aiming because of spread is no bueno. I hate the BR.

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Personally...fuck the BR. I don't care for it. It promotes the type of Halo that i hate. The whole "everyone charge so we can get closer because our shots can't hit anything outside of mid-range" is a pathetic strat. Map control revolves around charging areas over and over and power positions are much less weaker because you can't defend yourself and the area properly. You have to hold a teammates hand to do everything, Individual skill is diminished with this terrible gun. Getting rewarded for sloppy aiming because of spread is no bueno. I hate the BR.

Honestly the BR just has way too much spread. It makes it inconsistent online. You know you 4sk a guy and he just survives it bc one bullet here and one bullet there went to his side or over his head or whatever.

I'm also noticing some comments about the carbine. The carbine's kill time is currently very fast comparitively. I don't think you can consider making it a 6 shot kill at all (unless of course you slowed the rate of fire to keep a consistent kill time). I am however for increasing the magnetism/aim assist whatever to make the carbine easier. I find very little use for the carbine personally outside of FFA or as a secondary pickup. I feel the carbine has always been a more skill required weapon compared to the br and it should stay that way.

I'm noticing a lot of people wanting DMR to have bleedthrough as well.

Yes, I get people want the precision weapons to behave differently so we don't have the same weapons. But I think the key is to give your weapons very similar if not exact kill times.  Because that alone makes each weapon usable. 

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I would say the Carbine needs a Rate-of-Fire decrease regardless, and it would feel better if it was given a Rate-of-Fire decrease after making it a 6sk, which would greatly improve the weapon. 

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The BR has since H2, been the go to gun. I don't see why anbody would want to change a part of the basic Halo formula. A 4sk DMR? No, just no.

 

You know what was the go to gun before the BR? The Halo 1 pistol. You know which one took more skill? The Halo 1 pistol. You know which one was funner to use? The Halo 1 Pistol. 

 

The DMR is closer to the pistol than the BR is. Why would anybody want to change a part of the basic Halo formula. A burst fire rifle? No, just no.

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You know what was the go to gun before the BR? The Halo 1 pistol. You know which one took more skill? The Halo 1 pistol. You know which one was funner to use? The Halo 1 Pistol. 

 

The DMR is closer to the pistol than the BR is. Why would anybody want to change a part of the basic Halo formula. A burst fire rifle? No, just no.

This comment earned my respect. Thumbs up to anyone who is from CE. With that said I always preferred BR to DMR. I hated the DMR in reach. But when you use the BR online then play on LAN it feels like a completely different weapon (more bc of spread than burst fire). And I for one like as much consistency as I can get with online. 

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