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Could some AAs, Powerups, and Equipment be reworked?

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I posted this yesterday and I'd like to give this some more thought. While a return to a "simpler Halo" certainly would be nice for many, I think some of the ideas we've gained going forward don't necessarily have to be retired yet. Could the most viable of these additions to Halo all coexist in Halo 5 without altering its fundamental core? Looking at Halo 5 hypothetically, I think we can build off of this question. You're welcome to post your ideas, and my own are as follows:

 

 

Replacing Sprint with Sidestep 

 

Halo-Reach-Sangheili-Elite-11-ZEALOT-GRE

 

 

 

It's the same dodge the Elites do in the Campaign. It takes the idea of the Thruster Pack and makes it more of an ability to enhance strafes. It only has one use before it recharges for 5 or 7 seconds; it shouldn't happen too often in a firefight, and certainly not more than once in a 1v1.

 

Power-Ups:

 

 Overshield | Overshield - I'm leaning towards 3x OS where the pink and green shield will both last 30 seconds undisturbed.

Active Camo | 45 seconds moving; 25-30 seconds idle. i.e. less time if you get it and camp. 

Damage Boost | 150% damage for 15 seconds. Not active until you fire your first shot, then the timer starts.

Speed Boost | Same as Halo 4 for 15 seconds. 

Moon Jump (Jetpack) | If you hold the jump button, you can ascend either to its max alt. or cut it off before. Doesn't replace your normal jump. This could be 15 or 30 seconds. 

 

 
Again, this is hypothetical of course, so you're welcome to share your own versions or dismiss these ones entirely. The most important thing for me is that everything that alters a player or gives them an advantage is on the map to be contested. 
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I like the idea of equipment, but I feel like past games haven't done very well at balancing them.

I wouldn't give a player a default ability, as normal movement is fine, and I would have powerups override the AA/Equipment for however long the powerup lasts.

 

I was thinking a grenade that when thrown, emits a hologram. Similar to the current Hologram, but doesn't reveal your position, and is only single use.

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Movement Abilities: each species has a unique recharging movement ability

 

 

Spartans - Thruster - performs like the Halo 4 Thruster Pack on 120% movement speed, user stays in first person view while thrusting, tapping jump while airborne does a vertical thrust propelling the user straight up about one jump height, one thrust fully drains the meter whether horizontal or vertical

 

Elites - Evade - functions like Halo Reach Evade on 100% movement speed, while airborne pressing Evade plus a stick direction does a flip that moves the user in that direction on a parabolic arc about one evade length, evade drains half the meter, flip drains half the meter

 

Forerunners - Teleport - user can teleport a short distance even through walls, user can teleport in any direction including up and down through floors or ceilings, teleport fully drains the meter

 

 

 

Equipment: single use on map pick ups

 

 

Regenerator - tap to drop Equipment that creates a green sphere that eliminates shield recharge delay for players inside, limited duration

 

Detection Field - tap to drop Equipment that creates an invisible sphere that marks the first enemy to pass through it with a waypoint visible only to you, active until destroyed or tripped

 

Power Drain - tap to roll a ball a short distance that creates a blue sphere that drains shields, ball pulls players towards it and eventually explodes

 

Gravity Well - tap to roll a ball a short distance that creates a hole in the ground that kills any players or vehicles that fall in

 

Flare - tap to throw a lit flare that will illuminate dark areas and ignite flammable substances or items

 

Cryo Canister - tap to throw a canister that temporarily freezes players or water impacted by it, frozen water can be walked on, frozen players are alive and will thaw after a few seconds, frozen players can be smashed with a melee attack, smashing a frozen objective carrier resets the objective

 

Grapple - tap to fire a grappling hook, impacting an immovable surface pulls the user to the point of impact, impacting a movable object pulls that object to the user, impacting a player pulls that player to the user, impacting a vehicle pulls the user to the vehicle

 

Hologram - tap to send a visual copy of the player forward, disappears if shot

 

Engineer - tap to release a Huragok that will repair a proximate vehicle, vehicle occupants take damage during repair, duration of repair depends on damage taken and size of vehicle, Engineer will die to small arms fire, limited duration

 

Sonic Sentry - reflects slow moving projectiles like grenades, rockets or mortars in a 90 degree field of view

 

Optical Cloak - tap to switch to the enemy team's color and species, active until user shoots or gets shot

 

Spotting Scope - tap to temporarily mark the enemy you are aiming at with a waypoint visible to you and your team

 

Electromagnet - tap to pick up a metal crate, tap again to drop a metal crate

 

Hard Light Shield - tap to toggle a barrier in front of the player on or off

 

Hard Light Glider - tap to toggle a hang glider on or off, slows descent speed and increases forward movement speed while the player is in freefall, thrusting while gliding will propel the player in the direction he chooses with the thumbstick including up down left and right, active until destroyed

 

 

 

Power Ups: limited duration on map pick ups

 

 

Overshield - extra shield layers

 

Active Camo - become invisible when not firing

 

Hype - increased movement speed, faster reload, shorter shield recarge delay

 

Scout - all enemies are marked for you with a waypoint

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We did have discussions a while back about a Double Jump Height type mechanic, similar to your Moon Jump idea, where you would hold down the Jump Button for a extra boost to your Jump Height and distance. The idea was that it would only give you the ability to Jump 2x Higher or farther depending on if you were moving or on your forward movement, but it would be very fluid and useful for making trick jumps and jump ups, while not breaking the Map Designs like Jet Pack. Of course, Halo really needs no such thing, and I would rather see other things worked on instead of Halo's Movement Mechanics, I am not a fan of the Thruster Pack, Jet Pack, or Evade myself.

 

I am still not sold on the idea of AA's or Equipment, but some would work well as grenades, weapons, and new types of Power-Up's, instead of AA's, and they would be better off as such and remain Map Pick Up's only in that case.

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These sound like it'd make Halo 5 the worst Halo by far. CLASSIC is what we need.

 

Eh, perhaps the AA/Equipment ideas are a stretch. As a fan of the simpler, classic style, I too would love to return to OS, Camo, and get rid of everything else. However, i'm beginning to think that it's highly unlikely that every single AA, Equipment, and new Power-Up added in the last 6 years is going to be removed for default matchmaking. A "return to roots" will come with some baggage, in other words. Therefore, I'd like to theorize how some (not all) could be properly integrated rather than dismiss the idea entirely.  

 

 

I would not mind halo 3 equipment on maps- as long as their aren't so many that it pollutes the maps.   There should just be one or two max- and they should be replaced with the AAs, since the AAs are actually useful.

 

I mean, bubble shield and regen were useful, but those promote camping/static gameplay.

 

Would rather see on map aas like jetpack/thruster/possibly prom vision (as a central pickup for both teams to fight over of course.) since those aas promote movement.

 

 

That's a very valid point. I also forgot that Drop Shield/Regen were basically the same thing. 

 

I think I'll slightly reword the OP a bit. 

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I would not mind halo 3 equipment on maps- as long as their aren't so many that it pollutes the maps.   There should just be one or two max- and they should be replaced with the AAs, since the AAs are actually useful.

 

I mean, bubble shield and regen were useful, but those promote camping/static gameplay.

 

Would rather see on map aas like jetpack/thruster/possibly prom vision (as a central pickup for both teams to fight over of course.) since those aas promote movement.

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im not sure if this is what u meant by ur equipment idea, but if u cud pick up equipment after theyre used, it wud be awesome. like someone drops a bubble shield, u can simply rush in and pick it up provided it has HP left, and then re-use it any time whilst killing the guy who deployed it (assuming he deployed it because he was weak). this wud somewhat lower the effectiveness and defensive capabilities of equipment, and adds a bit of dynamic risk/reward. but to balance this so players cant use it in cover, pick it up, then re-use it in cover over and over, the equipment cud have a HP decay.

 

i think jetpack wud be a good powerup. i dont like damage boost; its just too powerful especially with sniper.

 

personally i like armour abilities; in a thread i suggested u can choose an AA in loadouts, but they require fuel to use and fuel canisters are only found on the map. nevermind the fact that this was a suggestion and gametype options wud be able to turn it off, the response by people like doju was "No". this idea allows a compromise between loadouts, fans of AAs, and the ideology that "everything that alters a player or gives them an advantage is on the map to be contested". i dont really like a 'sidestep' or 'double jump' ability; theyre so ineffectual you might as well not include AAs (another option which im okay with).

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personally i like armour abilities; in a thread i suggested u can choose an AA in loadouts, but they require fuel to use and fuel canisters are only found on the map. 

 

That's a really neat idea actually. Especially having to even get fuel off spawn, and not having access to your ability until you get fuel. Then, when a jetpacker overtakes map control, it's balanced because they earned it. The other team failed to stop the jetpackers from getting fuel. 

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I would not mind halo 3 equipment on maps- as long as their aren't so many that it pollutes the maps.   There should just be one or two max- and they should be replaced with the AAs, since the AAs are actually useful.

 

I mean, bubble shield and regen were useful, but those promote camping/static gameplay.

 

Would rather see on map aas like jetpack/thruster/possibly prom vision (as a central pickup for both teams to fight over of course.) since those aas promote movement.

Yep I agree, they promoted camping, but at least Reach's bubble shield was more of objective AA and was a little bit balanced (You can destroy it)

In my opinion it is much better having that Bubble Shield than Regen, because it promotes more tactics when objectives is in your mind. (Putting bubble shield on the bomb site for example)

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That's a really neat idea actually. Especially having to even get fuel off spawn, and not having access to your ability until you get fuel. Then, when a jetpacker overtakes map control, it's balanced because they earned it. The other team failed to stop the jetpackers from getting fuel. 

do not like.   This would still make a halo a class shooter- which it is not and should never be.

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i think side step could be awesome if it havd like a 7.5 sec recharge so only like once per battle 

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You cannot have AAs, item pickups, perks, POD, and weapons on map in the same game. You cannot. You CANNOT.

 

These ones I'd actually rather just see retired entirely. Reworking an AA or equipment into a map pick up doesn't fundamentally change Halo like earning weapons and spawning with different traits does. 

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do not like.   This would still make a halo a class shooter- which it is not and should never be.

this is a silly argument. firstly, since reach its already a class shooter and the idea is meant to be a compromise. secondly, ur assuming that custom game options and playlists and OTHER PEOPLE'S PREFERENCES dont exist. i got heaps of friends who love loadouts and dont mind halo turning into a class-based shooter (they just dont like it when its turned into a shit class FPS). thirdly, contrary to the popular belief of competitive players, halo isn't "arena FPS" or "4sk BR". there is only one thing halo has consistently been and that's sandbox. the inclusion of the option to play with loadouts etc only adds to the variety of tools u can use in the sandbox and thus benefits the replayability of halo and broadens its appeal.

 

the problem with halo 4 is that it replaced aspects of the sandbox rather than added to it. what if maps were designed with no sprint in mind, and 4v4 playlists primarily were no sprint, but sprint was available as an option. would u be opposed to this?

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this is a silly argument. firstly, since reach its already a class shooter and the idea is meant to be a compromise. secondly, ur assuming that custom game options and playlists and OTHER PEOPLE'S PREFERENCES dont exist. i got heaps of friends who love loadouts and dont mind halo turning into a class-based shooter (they just dont like it when its turned into a shit class FPS). thirdly, contrary to the popular belief of competitive players, halo isn't "arena FPS" or "4sk BR". there is only one thing halo has consistently been and that's sandbox. the inclusion of the option to play with loadouts etc only adds to the variety of tools u can use in the sandbox and thus benefits the replayability of halo and broadens its appeal.

 

the problem with halo 4 is that it replaced aspects of the sandbox rather than added to it. what if maps were designed with no sprint in mind, and 4v4 playlists primarily were no sprint, but sprint was available as an option. would u be opposed to this?

and reach was garbage- it decimated competitive halo.  We should not be making games like reach.   Also the first 3 games have always been arena shooters in that everyone spawns on the same exact footing differing only in spawn location so I'm not sure what you're trying to say there.  

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These ones I'd actually rather just see retired entirely. Reworking an AA or equipment into a map pick up doesn't fundamentally change Halo like earning weapons and spawning with different traits does.

 

But what would we use that we haven't already gotten?

 

Camo

Overshield

Damage boost

Invulnerability for 30ish seconds

Unlimited ammo until next death

 

These are the only powerups I can think of thag would actually be worth it.

 

Speed boost is almost worthless, jetpack is stupid, radar jammer has no point in competetitive play, nobody would fight for power drain, regen is broken and promotes camping, flare never even worked right, PV is broken, etc.

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this is a silly argument. firstly, since reach its already a class shooter and the idea is meant to be a compromise.

Halo 4 and Reach are NOT class shooters. They are slow arena shooters with loadouts.

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Halo 4 and Reach are NOT class shooters. They are slow arena shooters with loadouts.

 

Yes the last few games have been 1-foot-in shooters, which is why I think Halo 5 either needs to go full blown class shooter, or dial things down and keep enhancements map-focused. Naturally, I'd want to expand the menu in the latter a bit so I don't have déjà vu when I boot up the game. They can make Halo 5 fresh and fair - for competitives, hardcores, and casuals alike - without alienating any part of its fanbase. 

 

I think 5 powerups would be fine. It was mentioned in another post that all CE's maps had both Camo and OS on them. There'd be no reason for excess. 

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There's no problem with having a bagillion possible powerups. We just have to contain power items on map to about five or so - any more, and you've got strong evidence that the map is too big.

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this is a silly argument. firstly, since reach its already a class shooter and the idea is meant to be a compromise. secondly, ur assuming that custom game options and playlists and OTHER PEOPLE'S PREFERENCES dont exist. i got heaps of friends who love loadouts and dont mind halo turning into a class-based shooter (they just dont like it when its turned into a shit class FPS). thirdly, contrary to the popular belief of competitive players, halo isn't "arena FPS" or "4sk BR". there is only one thing halo has consistently been and that's sandbox. the inclusion of the option to play with loadouts etc only adds to the variety of tools u can use in the sandbox and thus benefits the replayability of halo and broadens its appeal.

 

the problem with halo 4 is that it replaced aspects of the sandbox rather than added to it. what if maps were designed with no sprint in mind, and 4v4 playlists primarily were no sprint, but sprint was available as an option. would u be opposed to this?

 

How does this sound: You have 4 different classes for each team and there can't be more than one of each class. Makes it interesting without taking away the even team starts

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-list of equipment and powerups-

 

WAY WAY WAAAAAAY too many pieces of equipment, many of which are pretty overpowered and would just clutter maps trying to use all of them in the game, even with only putting 2 or 3 on map. 

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@makeitstop: please read my post; u repeated the same mistake in assuming im suggesting the base game be with fuel-dependent AAs. ur argument is based on the assumption that this mechanic is forced into every playlist and non-optional, and also that because reach had AAs they are bad.

 

im not sure wat ur trying to say either. to clarify, im saying:

-AAs and the like are fun personally. some players like myself enjoy AAs, and halo loses nothing by allowing more people to enjoy the game.

-AAs and the like can be an addition to the sandbox, without damaging the 'core' (a horribly subjective and stupid term, but meh). this can be achieved via custom game options and additional varied playlists.

-though you may think halo isnt and shud never be a class FPS, it already is since the release of reach, and worsened with halo 4. u cant just ignore reach's existence, and exclude it from the halo series because u dont like it.

-fixing AAs is more realistic than expecting them to be gone. i have no problem with a pure arena shooter like CE (which is my favourite halo), but in the (99%) chance that these class shooter elements return, a compromise where AAs are nerfed and still somewhat fit into the philosophy of 'equal starts' is preferrable over full-blown armour lock and shit.

 

@shzlss: sounds like an interesting gametype, but not the standard settings for halo.

 

@drewski: u dont have to neg the guy for brainstorming.

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Classic powerups on static timers, DB and Speedboost are also viable.

 

OFFENSIVE armor abilities (if movement modifiers like thruster pack or evade, retain the ability to shoot) that can be picked up and come with limited fuel/uses but also alter the appearance of your spartan slightly but noticeably.

 

Stop giving people a thousand ways to escape death, for the love of god.

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