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Kalon

Did button glitches make Halo better?

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For people who played CE and Halo 2, I'm sure everyone knows the famous button glitches. While I played CE, I really got into Halo during Halo 2 and I remember the BxR, BxB, and RRX contributing to what I thought the fluidity and skillfulness of the game. 

Now, I always thought that these things being from the first two Halo's, inherently added something to Halo's core game. I feel as though a lot of the counter arguments can be defeated by just having these button glitches put into the game on 'purpose' and specifically added to the game guide.

 

Obviously, I doubt we'll see any of these return on 'purpose', but I am secretly hoping Halo 5 does allow for some non-game breaking 'extras' to give players more options to have an advantage. Plus, playing and spectating the double beatdown mechanic is extremely boring and dull compared to some of the finesse of pulling off a button glitch. 

Thoughts? 

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For an ideal experience, there should be a close range melee option that has a large risk/reward factor. It doesn't have to be a glitch necessarily.

 

imo

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If everyone is on equal grounds yes however if you don't know about them and you see someone using his BR like an SMG then no.

Segregation seems to be the word of the day :)

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As cT said, there should be a risk factor to performing a combo. BLB is the most ideal, as it didn't make certain weapons worthless, while giving extended use to weapons like the AR.

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Rewarding higher skill is never bad.

 

RRX took more skill than simply shooting and killed faster, so it should gets a higher reward. Good

 

BXB took more skill than simply meleeing twice and killed faster, so it should get a higher reward. Good

 

BXR took some skill, but it was a bit BS at times. At the same time, it takes more skill than simply spamming melee or using a sword. Meh

 

BLB takes some skill, and it has the risk of you blowing yourself up, so it should get a higher reward. Good.

 

XXY (Backpack reload) sped up the game. Good.

 

YY took more skill than simply reloading, so it should get a higher reward. Good

 

So yeah, pretty much every single one either added to the skill or the pace of the game. It is all good IMO.

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Well  Halo 2's melee system was not that skillful but you had a super lunge which you could then BxR which was basically an instant melee+headshot combo which allowed the craziest kills to happen like a 180 BxR on a guy on the 2nd level of Warlock. Walshy infamously BxB's a full overshield guy in seconds to overcome an advantage that would be impossible to overcome in later Halo's in a 1v1 battle. Walshy also infamously RRX's Fonzi in his montage attacking him with noob combo coming back from a situation you were not normally able to do earlier in H2's life. You could instant reload (YY) allowing you to get back into battles quicker, ect.. the list is goes on. There was also various plasma grenade launch tricks, sword cancelling to get out of maps, super-bounce, ect.. glitches were part of what made Halo 2 fun to alot of people. 

 

Now button glitches were only really used by "High-end players" consistently and as we have seen with Halo the devs think armor lock is acceptable because its for noobs but button glitches were not because they made high-level Halo 2 (in particular) more exciting and skillful. 

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In terms of providing emergent gameplay and in turn depth, they're good. But I dislike the fact that they're glitches and therefore artificially raise the barrier for entry when it comes to actually following the game, not just for players but also for an audience.

 

Ideally I'd rather see certain weapons have actual features which mimic the effects of certain glitches that require a lot of dexterity in order to pull off successfully (eg: a headshot capable Plasma weapon capable of overheating at an increased rate in order to double its fire rate, but triggering this would also reduce aim assist drastically or something to that effect which challenges a player's accuracy more than usual, thus implementing a risk vs reward scenario into using that feature) or something melee related like cT suggests.

 

Basically, if there was a way to put the effects of the most beneficial glitches into gameplay features whilst still retaining a way to make them challenging or risky to execute it would be for the best.

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I feel they did make Halo better because everyone had the ability to use them if they practiced them.

 

Having said that, I doubt we'll ever see glitches in Halo like that again. Reason being is that when we had the super nade throw glitch in H4, 343 patched it soon after.

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Forgot to mention dodging beatdowns by crouching (not necessarily a button glitch). Also, some might say that the boltshot serves some of the same purpose as these button glitches. Should we have something like the boltshot again?

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For a weapon that you can spawn with the actual risk of using the Boltshot is pretty low. It's not a bad idea to do something similar, but the risk has to balance the reward much more appropriately.

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Forgot to mention dodging beatdowns by crouching (not necessarily a button glitch).

 

I would like to see this happen again, and then every time you dodge a beatdown you'd get a medal called Bullet Time. 

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I hated all H2 Melee glitches for the main reason of the melees being inconsistent.  Though I just hate the melee system in general

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I've never liked button glitches as we know them to be in Halo itself.

 

1. They were never 'official' nor explained in game. It was solely a community emergent thing that players discovered. They were glitches, and glitches being what they are, consistent results are not guaranteed. Also, with no official explanation, newbs could and were left in the dark. 

 

 

2. There was little to no visual cues as to what your enemy was doing. Essentially, it was a guessing game to know why your opponent killed you. Let's compare it to a favorite activity of mine: Sniping on top of the back wall behind red base on Hemorrhage. Super fun for me, everyone's just a clay pigeon oblivious to me. I got tons of Perfections that way. Awesome for the person doing it. But what about the victim? Just like how they have no idea where you are on Hemorrhage when they get struck by your hand of god from anywhere on the map, they've also no idea what you did in that button combo, or if you even used one in the first place. They just don't know, and it's super frustrating for them. 

 

 

Essentially, button combos as we know them to be in Halo are the anti-thesis of accessibility with lack of visual feedback per character animations and no official explanation from the game or developers. Yes, I know, the word 'accessible' is a hot button these days, but what I said isn't any less true.

 

If we had button combos that were properly conveyed through character animation and killcams, and they're 'official'...well, it might be better.  

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I feel the double shot added a nice increase to h2's skill gap and a much needed boost of a individuals ability to run through players. So yes to that. The BXB & BXR's the game could of done without. So no to that.

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RRX was as broken as people think it is, it takes a lot of skill to master it correctly and even more so to apply in the CORRECT situations(which is where great players excelled  i.e Walshy, Ogre 2 etc..)

 

BxR while it was kinda cheap, it didnt always registered so there is always that trade and might you might get killed asap because of that.

 

BxB , well...I kinda like it but there isnt too much risk  on this.

 

Overall... I would say yes.

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I've never liked button glitches as we know them to be in Halo itself.

 

1. They were never 'official' nor explained in game. It was solely a community emergent thing that players discovered. They were glitches, and glitches being what they are, consistent results are not guaranteed. Also, with no official explanation, newbs could and were left in the dark. 

 

 

2. There was little to no visual cues as to what your enemy was doing. Essentially, it was a guessing game to know why your opponent killed you. Let's compare it to a favorite activity of mine: Sniping on top of the back wall behind red base on Hemorrhage. Super fun for me, everyone's just a clay pigeon oblivious to me. I got tons of Perfections that way. Awesome for the person doing it. But what about the victim? Just like how they have no idea where you are on Hemorrhage when they get struck by your hand of god from anywhere on the map, they've also no idea what you did in that button combo, or if you even used one in the first place. They just don't know, and it's super frustrating for them. 

 

 

Essentially, button combos as we know them to be in Halo are the anti-thesis of accessibility with lack of visual feedback per character animations and no official explanation from the game or developers. Yes, I know, the word 'accessible' is a hot button these days, but what I said isn't any less true.

 

If we had button combos that were properly conveyed through character animation and killcams, and they're 'official'...well, it might be better.  

 

While I agree button glitches were never properly explained, I believe that is why its called a glitch. Maybe I grew up in the "matrix" age of shooters where physic glitches were very common in comp shooters like UT, Quake, TF, CS, early Halo's,ect... but in a tournament/organized setting like MLG or custom games where basically everyone there were aware of them there is nothing "unfair" about them. I struggle to even call a "glitch" inherently unfair because the only difference between a glitch and abusing camo sniping or noob combo(intentional aspects of gameplay) is that button combos were accidental and therefore a "glitch" and I am supposed to think all glitches are bad.  There has been much worse offenders introduced by Reach+H4 that were "abused" to the max and unpredictable (Jet-pack and POD's come to mind) but nobody calls those mechanics unfair.

 

There will always be a huge knowledge gap between players even when it comes to basic mechanics like using grenades, I doubt everyone knows all the nade spots in Halo CE but nobody calls that unfair. When you play a comp game like LoL or Dota 2 where knowledge of game systems and knowing what and when to buy items is essential there is going to be a huge knowledge gap between the average player and pro players and that is what creates depth in a MP game.

 

There are much worse offenders than button combos that were intentional in the Halo series and other games(like kill-streaks in CoD) where its random and abused heavily but only when its a "glitch" does the general public say its unfair. Hypocrisy at its finest folks.

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The superthrow nades were super fun in vanilla H4. Too bad they were patched out. =[

 

Answer to the question, yes and no. YY is super easy, everyone can do it and it's intended to be in the game (or at least it seems like it). Stuff like supernades and BXR does show lack of gametesting, they were found out right away. I'm sure 343 doesn't want to show to lack of testing by leaving them in.

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