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Frank O'Connor On The Future Of Competitive Halo

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 I think one of the issues about that is, it tends to be Team Slayer, Pros only.

 

That's funny, I'm pretty sure Team Slayer, has consistently been one of the most played playlists throughout Halo's history. 

 

 

 

 

 It's a significant hurdle for people to enter something as mainstream as this; getting a good team together [is] probably the single-hardest aspect.

 

I agree, but unless it's a direct 1v1 game, almost all top eSports games are team oriented. I don't forsee Halo being anything less than being a team oriented game, because Halo 1v1 only went so far and in a game like Halo, it's very hard to watch some 1v1's and with mechanics like sprint in the game, there is less punish to people being out of position / more escapes...so it turns more into a cat and mouse game, waiting for powers which becomes dull to watch.

 

 

As you know, the competitive community, while it's big as an idea, a concept, and a population, on a per-game basis, pro teams and good teams represent a fairly small fraction of the overall user base.

 

This may be true, but while small, it's all the most sustainable playerbase. Numbers do not lie, a lot of the people who continue to play the game over time, become better over that same period of time. Anything you put time into, you get better, and that goes hand in hand with being competitive. I believe Gamesager is a testament to that, he's not the biggest 4v4 guy, but he is skilled at the game. A lot of people will get better at the game, and thus be on equal footing with others if they had a reason to play. 

 

Match making also plays a big role. Whereas in games like League of Legends or SC2, if you are not as good, you will get matched up against people who are also not as good, and as you improve you will face people who are closer to your skill level. This is something that prevents people from being stomped, as well as allowing people to improve gradually, while still having fun at their OWN pace.

 

 

 

We're trying to make this more accessible, more widely available to everybody to enter. FFA was the first gametype you look at; the challenge with teams is that you have to get three extra players, which I think is no small feat.

 

Accessibility should not be through just entering the game. It should be through people wanting to LEARN the game and get INVOLVED. If we increased the number of people viewing the game, that would have a positive affect on people wanting to PLAY it. That's how all successful games have been going. Everywhere you look now, you see Call of Duty, League of Legends, et cetera et cetera. Pro gaming has become a legitimate ADVERTISEMENT from the players to other players to get better, learn new things, do cool stuff that they did not know they could do. No numbers went up from the FFA tournament, that's not because the tournament was bad, it's because you did not get anyone who doesn't already play Halo interested.

 

 

 

 I'd love to work with MLG again in the future, and there's nothing actually preventing that. It's more about what they're interested in, what they want to get out of it. We worked with them for the launch of Halo 4 and it was really fun. We'd be happy to work with them again in the future.

 

This right here makes me dislike MLG. No offense to what they have done, but having monopolized the scene, to only bring up Halo, then bring in SC2 and LoL (and now neither of them NEED MLG to be successful, in fact it was probably a hindrance) they go with other games. Infinite Crisis is most likely a bust, and DOTA 2 is something that Valve is hands off with, but will allow MLG to do all the work. If it doesn't succeed, then MLG is left with Call of Duty: Ghosts and a few random titles. MLG is a business, but I think they are way more greedy and unrealistic than we obviously see.

 

 

 

 It's not to say it will never happen, but bluntly speaking we should be spending our resources for the future and not for the past. I wish it was in there.

 

I have even less hope for spectator mode than I did before. I literally cannot fathom how one of Microsoft's most important developer of their biggest exclusive franchise cannot have the resources to implement a spectator mode. I guarantee that was just mismanagement on their part and a lot of last minute resources put to something they thought they could do, and ended up back firing. Regardless of it being implemented, I don't think it'll be how we think of it as being, or how good it should be. Just my opinion, hopefully will be proven wrong fully. 

 

 

 

I think we want to make the multiplayer and the competitive game more accessible to people. At the same time, we want to take the core community much more seriously. 

 

Accessibility starts with allowing people to learn at their own pace. If you put someone against someone who is better, than obviously that will deter them. That's a barrier of entry that fighting games have, and have had for a long time. Whereas in DOTA 2, I can load up a game and start against people who are scrubs like me, and the same goes with League of Legends and even Heroes of Newerth implemented it. I feel like, the fact he sees these as two different aspects, when they are one in the same. 

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Pretty basic interview. It sounds like spectator mode and more tournaments are almost a given. Those are the main positive things I took away from it.

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Good interview.

 

Some people are disapointed that this was not an announcement.  Of course it's not a an announcement of a new tournament or halo 5 features- it's just an interview.

 

And if you read between the lines two things were pretty much confirmed with like 75% accuracy:   a team-based tourney run by 343 and spec mode for halo 5.

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Meh, I was hyping up this interview way more than it turned out to be. Still, nice to hear Spec Mode is basically confirmed and there's a possibility of a 4v4 tourney this year. 

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Spectator mode was kind of obvious at this point... oh well, it's good news at least. Didn't expect much anyway, i'll definitely going to watch the next event tough.

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Overall that was a much more agreeable article than I was expecting, however in failing to mention Microsoft's attitude towards eSports in the last answer I have to remain somewhat sceptical. Until the publisher gets it and will help fund tournaments and such Halo will still be much smaller than it could potentially be.

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Looking through Frankies Twitter I found this fQyzMs2.png

 

Also he didnt confirm Spectator mode at all. He said it would be hard to implement and that it might be better to just focus resources elsewhere. I hope they have it, but it is not confirmed.

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Because MLG doesn't see enough potential (revenue) out of Halo 4. It was about MLG the whole time. They didn't want to pick up Halo 4. They may have tried to make it seem like VG was some kind of obstacle but it really wasn't.

 

 

 

Black Ops was in the circuit while Halo: Reach was too. :o

And halo reach was shortly removed when it stopped making money.

 

 

So was halo 4.

 

Halo simply does not generate enough revenue for mlg to justify running at tournaments anymore.

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These are the same things we heard after the announcement of halo 4..

What did they after the announcement of halo 4?

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Normally I'm not a huge Slasher fan, but with this interview he seemed to ask some poignant questions such as the spec mode and the future of publisher support for competitive events. The vague nature of many of the answers though left me feeling identical to how I felt around the time the game launched, doesn't really seem like they have much new to announce towards competitive support. Still a nice read, thanks for the post BE

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Can you really blame MLG for not picking up the game? If anything, I think it was a good thing to send the message, and hopefully 343i understands that the 'halo title' isn't alone going to put it on the circuit. 

 

I completely understand why MLG did what they did. I think it was a little underhanded and left a lot of people hanging, especially with the way Sundance kept toying with everyone, but I understand.

 

It's more about coming to terms with the fact that even if 343i wants Halo on the circuit, it's not going to happen unless 343i/MS throw a ton of money at MLG or the game becomes sustainable and popular.

 

I honestly don't think Halo will ever be on the circuit again, unless Halo 5 is an incredible game. I'm not saying competitive Halo will die, because I think 343 will continue to host tournaments as well as smaller leagues like AGL. I just think for MLG to ever pick it back up its going to have to be purely because their is enough interest and competitive merit for the game.

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Looking through Frankies Twitter I found this fQyzMs2.png

 

Also he didnt confirm Spectator mode at all. He said it would be hard to implement and that it might be better to just focus resources elsewhere. I hope they have it, but it is not confirmed.

That's not what he said at all.

 

He said that for halo 4 that was the case, that they really wanted spec mode but due to time constraints they could not implement it.  And he also said that that's one of the main things they will want in the future since they didn't get it in with halo 4.

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"A perfectly accurate and powerful, but difficult to use utility weapon"

 

Those words and 90% of my fears for the competitiveness of Halo 5 would disappear.

 

(Because there's no way 343 would implement sprint and descope as base abilities again, amiright?) :)

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I completely understand why MLG did what they did. I think it was a little underhanded and left a lot of people hanging, especially with the way Sundance kept toying with everyone, but I understand.

 

It's more about coming to terms with the fact that even if 343i wants Halo on the circuit, it's not going to happen unless 343i/MS throw a ton of money at MLG or the game becomes sustainable and popular.

 

I honestly don't think Halo will ever be on the circuit again, unless Halo 5 is an incredible game. I'm not saying competitive Halo will die, because I think 343 will continue to host tournaments as well as smaller leagues like AGL. I just think for MLG to ever pick it back up its going to have to be purely because their is enough interest and competitive merit for the game.

I agree that Sundance cut the cord in a way that left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

 

EDIT: I think that making money the way MLG wants to, and having a competitively sound game goes hand in hand. I don't think we can fault MLG at all for not picking the series up. If it was good enough, it would be a good financial decision for them. 

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so what im hoping happens is that they tease a 4v4 tournament and then announce a 2v2 tournament since finding one teammate is easier than 4 and they want the tourney to be more accessible :kappa:

 

In all honesty, despite the vagueness that comes with a frankie interview im actually pretty stoked. I can definitely see more support coming for h4 in the next couple months. will they take the open approach of riot? probably not but we will have support for halo 4 and honestly thats good enough for me. like he said sometimes its better for them to look at implementing features in the future rather than implementing a good feature terribly now

 

its too bad about spectator mode, despite halo 4's flaws i still enjoy post update H4 more than blops2 and a spectator mode would have kept us in contention with the big dogs of competitive esports.

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Looking through Frankies Twitter I found this fQyzMs2.png

 

Also he didnt confirm Spectator mode at all. He said it would be hard to implement and that it might be better to just focus resources elsewhere. I hope they have it, but it is not confirmed.

 

I died.

 

 

And if you read between the lines two things were pretty much confirmed with like 75% accuracy:   a team-based tourney run by 343 and spec mode for halo 5.

 

At least he admitted that Spectator Mode was in their mind but due to time, they couldn't make it happen.

Hopefully, now that he said that they had their team, they have time and they resources... there will be not only a spectator mode, but maybe a little bit more. Such as "Coach Mode" like Saucey said and 343 were interested.

 

(Just sayin' lemme be)

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I have even less hope for spectator mode than I did before. I literally cannot fathom how one of Microsoft's most important developer of their biggest exclusive franchise cannot have the resources to implement a spectator mode. I guarantee that was just mismanagement on their part and a lot of last minute resources put to something they thought they could do, and ended up back firing. Regardless of it being implemented, I don't think it'll be how we think of it as being, or how good it should be. Just my opinion, hopefully will be proven wrong fully. 

 

 

 

why? he was definitely speaking about h4 in regards to spectator mode, instead of putting in a below average spec mode they decided to hold off until halo 5. at least thats what it sounds like to me

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I agree that Sundance cut the cord in a way that left a bad taste in everyone's mouth. However, you're contradicting yourself where I bolded.

 

 

Not really. By sustainable and popular I was referring to exactly what I said in the last sentence.

 

"343i/MS throw a ton of money at MLG or the game becomes sustainable and popular."

 

"enough interest and competitive merit for the game."

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Not really. By sustainable and popular I was referring to exactly what I said in the last sentence.

 

"343i/MS throw a ton of money at MLG or the game becomes sustainable and popular."

 

"enough interest and competitive merit for the game."

Yeah, you're right. I edited my post too late. Sorry about that. 

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why? he was definitely speaking about h4 in regards to spectator mode, instead of putting in a below average spec mode they decided to hold off until halo 5. at least thats what it sounds like to me

I prefer to be like that, lets be honest... We dont want a Halo 4 Spectator Mode after 8 months. We want a next gent Halo Spectator Mode Holy Halo with all the features, time, resources they needed.

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Looking through Frankies Twitter I found this fQyzMs2.png

 

I don't get it. Am I missing something?

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why? he was definitely speaking about h4 in regards to spectator mode, instead of putting in a below average spec mode they decided to hold off until halo 5. at least thats what it sounds like to me

 

"Competitive play, spectator mode, any kind of video-based or tournament-based activity is something we're taking very seriously for the future. Being careful not to promise anything, you can take it for granted that something we'd have loved to put in last time, should be applied to what we want to do for the next game in the Halo series."

 

[After that he goes into a small rant about how hard it is, to back up and show that he's still not 100% confident in it]

 

"The Halo engine is built on years and years and years of legacy stuff, and it's frankly not all that easy to make significant changes to it. We've done it in the past, but it's a tremendous amount of work, and in some ways the effort and invention that we want to apply to that type of code and features, is probably better spent forward-facing. It's not to say it will never happen, but bluntly speaking we should be spending our resources for the future and not for the past. I wish it was in there."

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Like? Like he can't really comment on Halo 5.

 

No, he can't. But I want to hear what he and the team learnt from Halo 4. What they think was a success and what wasn't.

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I don't get it. Am I missing something?

Josh Holmes works for 343. The guy calls Halo gay and then Josh calls the guy out on Dante. Calling Devil May Cry gay, and in turn the guy.

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Josh Holmes works for 343. The guy calls Halo gay and then Josh calls the guy out on Dante. Calling Dantes inferno gay, and in turn the guy.

 

What does this even have to do with anything in this thread?

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