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Sam

Why No Sprint needs to be universal for Halo 5

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Sprint should have never been introduced into Halo to being with.  

Agreed, but something tells me that if Bungie hadn't put Sprint in Reach, 343 would still have put Sprint in Halo 4 to try and appeal to the CoD crowd. 

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    Projectile is only bad if the net-code is bad like H3, with Halo's mechanics recoil and bloom dont make much sense with longer kill-times on standard weapons/R+G combat style but projectile works best with games like UT and Halo to a lesser extent where you live longer and movement is more varied and quicker. The default movement speed/strafe speed would need to at least be at H2 levels maybe faster for primary projectile weapons like UT's shock rifle or Halo CE's magnum to work properly but when they do work the dynamics and skill they add to a Sandbox shooter is a thing of beauty. Think about Halo Reach's GL for example, it added a whole new weapon type to the game and was not as simple as lining up head-shots. You could hit your enemy from virtually any position with the right timing and angle, knowing the environment was as important as accuracy with this projectile weapon.

 

There would still be Hit-scan weapons like the AR and BR, but in a Sandbox environment projectile weapons are ideal in my opinion that would bring meaningful innovation for the Halo series that makes sense. It would be fun as fuck to blow Elites/Prometheans up in Campaign from behind cover/predict their movements and add a whole new way to approach battles in campaign. Do I want to take a straight up Guns blazing approach and whittle the enemy down, or do i want to use my prediction skills and badass projectile weapons to skillfully pick enemies off in 1-2 shots? I am a huge proponent of the power of projectile weapons as you can probably tell  ^_^

 

Custom game searches would be awesome as well, I believe in Halo MP so much and I want to love it again but 343 has to show the MP that same love Bungie did in their craftsmanship.

My other problem with projectile though is that when you are shooting at someone who is strafing it becomes a game of guess where they will strafe next.  It wasn't as bad in halo ce obviously with the really quick kill times, and perhaps it adds more in skill gap than it takes away in randomness, but IDK.

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Exactly, having one playlist with Sprint but the rest of the game without is a bad idea, it separates that community and special maps would have to be made just for that playlist.

 

Remember in Halo 3 where you would play Valhalla 4v4 etc

 

You don't actually need sprint for BTB.  As mentioned earlier, if necessary, you could just have the base speed increased a bit for the BTB playlist.  No need to include the sprint mechanic at all.

 

Lastly, Halo can (and I think should) include a sprint-like mechanic . . . but not sprint.  It is a true statement that the FPS community expects something like sprint.  It is also a true statement that generic sprint in Halo results in poorer map design because the speed at which you move during combat is not the speed for which the map was built.  But there is a way to do both, and in a way that is uniquely Halo.

 

I've posted this before at Waypoint to a mixed reception, but the serious players have already implemented gametypes with it:  universal thruster.  Maybe increase the time for recharge and a few other minor adjustments (like going to the 3rd person view is unnecessary and dumb, IMO), but other than that, it should work fine.  Since you can't thrust all over the place, it won't affect map design.  It may actually enhance map design by providing some clever (and non-obvious) tac jump opportunities for the map designers to think about.

 

With that, you fulfill the expectation of the generic FPS community that there be some sort of enhanced speed mechanism, but you don't do it in a way that is game-breaking.  Actually, you do it in a way that adds depth to the play . . . which is a good thing.  And you also remove a customization option, which reduces the number of possible player customization options (also a good thing).

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You don't actually need sprint for BTB.  As mentioned earlier, if necessary, you could just have the base speed increased a bit for the BTB playlist.  No need to include the sprint mechanic at all.

 

Lastly, Halo can (and I think should) include a sprint-like mechanic . . . but not sprint.  It is a true statement that the FPS community expects something like sprint.  It is also a true statement that generic sprint in Halo results in poorer map design because the speed at which you move during combat is not the speed for which the map was built.  But there is a way to do both, and in a way that is uniquely Halo.

 

I've posted this before at Waypoint to a mixed reception, but the serious players have already implemented gametypes with it:  universal thruster.  Maybe increase the time for recharge and a few other minor adjustments (like going to the 3rd person view is unnecessary and dumb, IMO), but other than that, it should work fine.  Since you can't thrust all over the place, it won't affect map design.  It may actually enhance map design by providing some clever (and non-obvious) tac jump opportunities for the map designers to think about.

 

With that, you fulfill the expectation of the generic FPS community that there be some sort of enhanced speed mechanism, but you don't do it in a way that is game-breaking.  Actually, you do it in a way that adds depth to the play . . . which is a good thing.  And you also remove a customization option, which reduces the number of possible player customization options (also a good thing). 

Not sure if you misread my post but as said in the OP, I am advocating for NS to be universal and think it would be a bad idea if Sprint is included in a singular playlist. 

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Not sure if you misread my post but as said in the OP, I am advocating for NS to be universal and think it would be a bad idea if Sprint is included in a singular playlist. 

 

Sorry . . . mine was poorly worded.  I was simply "piling on" to your comment that sprint is not actually necessary for BTB, and then generally saying that the argument that n00bs want sprint (and I am a n00b - H4 is my first Halo and first FPS since Doom) is also easily countered.  That's all.

 

I didn't mean the quote to imply that I was arguing with you . . . instead, I wholeheartedly agree.

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Exactly, having one playlist with Sprint but the rest of the game without is a bad idea, it separates that community and special maps would have to be made just for that playlist.

 

Remember in Halo 3 where you would play Valhalla 4v4 etc

omg H3 Valhalla you are sorely missed. The epic hill fights dominated not by a cowering metal mech with shields but by the skill of those would by foot controlled weapons placed on the map and used them to near perfect effect... Flag caps by those who systematically dissected the control of a map by methodical advancements.  :( I miss you so much. 

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1. the entire reason why 343i made sprint necessary and not optional (ala armor ability) is because it was overused and they didn't want players to not use the other armor abilities, if they were to make it an armor ability again it would go against what they did with halo 4 already which is kind of stupid.

 

2. as sammy pointed out it would seperate the halo community even further which as we've seen with reach/4 is no good.

 

3. casuals either don't like or don't care for sprint, waypoint even had a poll that asked whether or not sprint (+flinch) should stay and iirc about 70% of the community said it should not, of course the poll was a little skewed but its doubtful the majority of the community really cared either way.

 

don't get me wrong sprint works, but no sprint works better and I think 343i should do the right thing and just get rid of it already, sprint isn't all that bad its just not needed.

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Sorry . . . mine was poorly worded.  I was simply "piling on" to your comment that sprint is not actually necessary for BTB, and then generally saying that the argument that n00bs want sprint (and I am a n00b - H4 is my first Halo and first FPS since Doom) is also easily countered.  That's all.

 

I didn't mean the quote to imply that I was arguing with you . . . instead, I wholeheartedly agree.

Ah, okay. :)

 

 

omg H3 Valhalla you are sorely missed. The epic hill fights dominated not by a cowering metal mech with shields but by the skill of those would by foot controlled weapons placed on the map and used them to near perfect effect... Flag caps by those who systematically dissected the control of a map by methodical advancements.   :( I miss you so much. 

 

I wasn't the biggest fan of Valhalla 4v4 but it was still playable by all means. Dat Missile Pod. <3

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Agreed, but something tells me that if Bungie hadn't put Sprint in Reach, 343 would still have put Sprint in Halo 4 to try and appeal to the CoD crowd. 

 

I don't think so.  You can tell 343 just took over what Bungie was doing and followed in their footsteps like mindless robots.

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The idea that 343 is going to not have sprint in the next gen Halo is honestly laughable and its beyond wishful thinking guys. There is no way that is going to happen. Sprint has been in the last two games, its been in Halo since 2010. To think they'd go backwards on something the majority expect from a next gen FPS is just stupid (no offence).

 

I'm with the competitive community on a lot of things, I think future Halo's need in-game ranks, social/ranked playlists, balanced weaponry, spectator mode, classic settings I'm basically saying I'd like to see the competitive community catered to a lot more!! but no sprint just isn't going to happen in my opinion guys.

 

I'll concede however that 343 could do more to nerf sprint, for me it annoys me when someone is able to sprint around the corner away from a fight I'm trying to instigate. Now I think if your sprinting and then you start receiving incoming fire your sprint should be automatically cancelled out. This way we can still have sprint but remove the annoyance of people sprinting away from fights.

 

I understand people sprinting away from fights isn't the only concern most have and that map flow is another one but this in my opinion could at least be a start...I mean if the masses that like sprint in Campaign, Big Team and other more casual playlists can't run away from fights anymore and you the competitive player can finally finish the fights you start without that damned Reach kid!! sprinting away from them all the time then that must be a start to a balancing of this issue?

 

Also, if the next Halo had ranks, spectator mode, dev support, continuous tournaments, amazing maps, basically everything you have ever wanted could you guys put up with sprint? or would Halo still be Dad because it has dwindled its problems down to one? sprint.

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I don't think so.  You can tell 343 just took over what Bungie was doing and followed in their footsteps like mindless robots.

I thought that at one point, too, but 343 still added a whole bunch of new things that made Halo worse that were oddly similar to what CoD has. 

 

Obviously, there's no way to ever tell if I'm right or wrong, but I believe they would have done that IMO.

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And please, a higher base movement speed of about 120% as the standard.

 

Yes.  The best thing about the update was the 110% speed . . . and the only thing that would have made it better was 120%.

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Yes.  The best thing about the update was the 110% speed . . . and the only thing that would have made it better was 120%.

120% with Sprint? No Thanks. If Sprint is removed, I would gladly welcome 120% with open arms but 120+sprint is going to cause a lot of frustration with people getting away.

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Sprint is great. OP needs to adapt.

I feel sorry for the newcomers who read your posts with a serious face.

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Exactly, having one playlist with Sprint but the rest of the game without is a bad idea, it separates that community and special maps would have to be made just for that playlist.

 

Remember in Halo 3 where you would play Valhalla 4v4 etc

 

It's people's poor logic: "The map is huge, we need to sprint across the map."

 

Someone tried to tell me Ragnarok would play slow with no sprint. At that point, I lost hope.

 

Why No Sprint won't be universal for Halo 5: 343.

 

And Microsoft. I believe they were responsible with their idea that they should compete with CoD by emulating the most features they could.

 

A stupid, stupid company. They assume no one can buy both games can get two unique gaming experiences (Casual - Competitive, I guess)

 

The only two things that might convince me to get an XB1 is godly customization and a godly forge/map editor.

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120% with Sprint? No Thanks. If Sprint is removed, I would gladly welcome 120% with open arms but 120+sprint is going to cause a lot of frustration with people getting away.

 

I will agree with that.  I just like the faster base speeds.

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I will agree with that.  I just like the faster base speeds.

Agreed, but without Sprint. :)

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My other problem with projectile though is that when you are shooting at someone who is strafing it becomes a game of guess where they will strafe next.  It wasn't as bad in halo ce obviously with the really quick kill times, and perhaps it adds more in skill gap than it takes away in randomness, but IDK.

 

 

Thats called prediction bro, using a projectile weapon is less reliable and more situation-based than a utility hit-scan rifle but as we saw with the Reach GL some develop the skills to master the projectile weapons and they become a deadly weapon in the hands of a smart player. The projectile weapon could also be like UT's shock rifle with a weaker hit-scan mode of fire(tap R) with no zoom in capability and then a secondary projectile energy core(hold R) that would explode in massive AOE damage when you combo them  :lol:  Or they could explode on release like HR GL only the projectile would have more range and travel in a straight line.

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