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Joseph

OT of Forge | What Are You Working On?

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lmao something like that. the in-map framerate appears to be negligible. I haven't played any games on it though, so things like grenades and such might negatively affect the frames.

 

I agree the bases are definitely lacking; I used so many blocks on the middle that I just sort of scrapped together the bases (hence the lack of an actual map release).

 

Likely going to reforge the whole thing. I was so into the idea of this middle and this cliff structure that the bases suffered as a result

 

ain't nothing wrong with that. i like to pick a theme, main aesthetic or opening rush and focus the map around that. then i'll rebuild it a million times to iterate on the paths and sightlines, throwing out what i don't like until things start to click. it's easier for me to work with a fresh canvas and make everything smooth than it is to fix a sloppy canvas. 

 

your center is really cool, so i'd keep the overall aesthetic and design and make the rest of the map flow around it more predictably.

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fleshed out the small tower idea a bit. needs enough room to stand on but also a back ramp for spawns and hidden traversal. just need to get the platform to look right. debating whether i should put a teleporter back there or not. it's inherently exposed despite any cover i throw at it because of where it lies relative to the field of view on the other sides of the map. worst case scenario, i'll have to offset the angle of the bases a bit so that the small tower receives soft LoS blockers from the natural curve of the paths.  

 

i'm not looking forward to forging on 25°

 

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Whats movement snap?

 

it's basically quick coordinate editing. set it to half and it nudges a piece 0.5 in the direction you move it. 1x nudges it 1.0, and so on. 

 

i'm sure somebody is out there nudging shit left and right, but i never do. maybe if you need to move a piece over a long distance it'll come in handy, but it's more precise to just go into the edit coordinates menu and do it manually. 

 

for some reason this menu has been annoyingly placed beneath drop to ground...

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looks like i wont be finishing a map after all. back to the drawing board after i found another fundamental problem with the flow. kinda overworking myself because nobody seems to point it out and i'll find it when i'm 70% of the way built. 

 

sigh 

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looks like i wont be finishing a map after all. back to the drawing board after i found another fundamental problem with the flow. kinda overworking myself because nobody seems to point it out and i'll find it when i'm 70% of the way built.

 

sigh

Care to share what problem you encountered specifically?

 

I am a big fan of the map, so am interested if I can help you out in some sort of way.

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Care to share what problem you encountered specifically?

 

I am a big fan of the map, so am interested if I can help you out in some sort of way.

well here's a scratch sketch i've been using to flesh out routes before i built. 

 

g9akji0.png

 

main things that are bugging me are the areas in green. path wise, they're very necessary, but in terms of map flow they feel extraneous and redundant somehow. they don't feel segmented enough, but the nature of the map's geometry (and my remaining blocks) limit how i can accomplish that. i don't want to make a hallway map; i'm trying not to create any closed spaces because the tall walls are uncomfortable and overwhelming if the sky isn't visible. the paths need to be more multi-purpose and dynamic and i'm having no luck through iteration.

 

the green part towards the top of the bases really gets on my nerves. i like what the base itself is supposed to do, but that open area ruins it completely. again, i can't wall it off or it compromises the entire design of the base. so i have to wonder if the base is even the base to begin with. i know the map needs an initial spawn with a ramp or series of ramps to foreshadow the engagement in the middle, but the current design isn't accomplishing it the way i want to.

 

the lower green portion is a whole other problem. if it's too big, it may as well not even be there because it's relatively the furthest point on the map. i've built the map from scratch at least 5 times now and that part hasn't been fleshed out even once. 

 

for what was supposed to be a simple donut map, this is ridiculously annoying to design. the map's geometry and aesthetic is as much a part of the design as the paths themselves, so i'm not going to compromise on its structure. the layout just isn't coiled and molded properly yet and it's frustrating not being able to pinpoint why. my method of forging is very atypical so i'm not sure if i am even communicating my vision properly. 

 

i think i just need to start the bases from scratch again and focus more on the initial rush. the moment i start having doubts about that is always when the map falls apart. 

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What's a site that i can blueprint maps before i make them. Something really easy to learn, I've tried sketch up and i don't wanna learn it. Just something really basic

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well here's a scratch sketch i've been using to flesh out routes before i built.

 

g9akji0.png

 

main things that are bugging me are the areas in green. path wise, they're very necessary, but in terms of map flow they feel extraneous and redundant somehow. they don't feel segmented enough, but the nature of the map's geometry (and my remaining blocks) limit how i can accomplish that. i don't want to make a hallway map; i'm trying not to create any closed spaces because the tall walls are uncomfortable and overwhelming if the sky isn't visible. the paths need to be more multi-purpose and dynamic and i'm having no luck through iteration.

 

the green part towards the top of the bases really gets on my nerves. i like what the base itself is supposed to do, but that open area ruins it completely. again, i can't wall it off or it compromises the entire design of the base. so i have to wonder if the base is even the base to begin with. i know the map needs an initial spawn with a ramp or series of ramps to foreshadow the engagement in the middle, but the current design isn't accomplishing it the way i want to.

 

the lower green portion is a whole other problem. if it's too big, it may as well not even be there because it's relatively the furthest point on the map. i've built the map from scratch at least 5 times now and that part hasn't been fleshed out even once.

 

for what was supposed to be a simple donut map, this is ridiculously annoying to design. the map's geometry and aesthetic is as much a part of the design as the paths themselves, so i'm not going to compromise on its structure. the layout just isn't coiled and molded properly yet and it's frustrating not being able to pinpoint why. my method of forging is very atypical so i'm not sure if i am even communicating my vision properly.

 

i think i just need to start the bases from scratch again and focus more on the initial rush. the moment i start having doubts about that is always when the map falls apart.

I think I have a good understanding of what you are trying to accomplish. I also know the struggle of having aesthetics that look good while maintaining a good flow.

 

I'll try to draw something out.

 

Also do you have any specific gametype that you want to play well on this map? And have you ever finished a version of the map and playtested it? Being able to see how players move around the map could help you figuring out how you want to change the paths players can take

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I think I have a good understanding of what you are trying to accomplish. I also know the struggle of having aesthetics that look good while maintaining a good flow.

 

I'll try to draw something out.

 

Also do you have any specific gametype that you want to play well on this map? And have you ever finished a version of the map and playtested it? Being able to see how players move around the map could help you figuring out how you want to change the paths players can take

lol i don't remember the last time i finished a map. i've actually been building this in variations since....hmm late 2013. i can't move on until this damn thing is done. 

 

i know how players will move around it which is kinda the dilemma i'm facing. the most attractive option is straight through the middle from the bases, while the other routes simply aren't natural or interesting enough to support the same quality of engagements. 

 

i know it's contrary to what most designers do, but i'm balancing different parts of it around 4 gametypes. the general platforming of each location is built to support king of the hill, so each place there'd be a hill needs different ways to defend and attack it. top middle in particular is designed to be a point of contention in slayer, with other areas leading towards it to emphasis controlling it. the bases are designed primarily for flag, forcing players to move in a specific way that exposes them to drag out the flag run time even in the shortest distances (i think i'm at 16 seconds straight through top middle now). flag is responsible for the location of ramps, jumps and the overall height of the map. lastly, it's open and angled to support ricochet. i think the most important gametype on a symmetric map is flag because it's responsible for forming the bases. hill and slayer are asymmetric, so i can get away with dynamic spawning, but flag demands away spawns and a specific route to work. i'm not sure whether it'll play well on the map or not, but i know it's important for the bases to be "flag bases". ricochet is easy - haven worked with that gametype and that map had terrible spawns, so i'm not too worried about it.  

 

the map's aesthetic value is ingrained in its structure and geometry as opposed to simple decoration. this is important primarily for player orientation and it also [is supposed to] help me build the rest of the map by keeping it within the same theme. a path that doesn't feel like it'll exist thematically probably shouldn't. for example, the overhead shows 3 towers pointing to the center platform as if they're feeding it some kind of energy, but each of those structures were designed first as angled line of sight blockers and then molded to fit the theme. the walls were also angled to function as line of sight blockers without closing off the ceilings. 

 

the flow is in there somewhere. it's just lost in a few redundant paths and superfluous piece usage that i need to cut down so the rest of the map can form. it's really just the green areas that bug me because i think the middle functions well. perhaps i can re-purpose an old design as a base and see where it leads. it'll require some serious rock usage, but if i can pull it off i think it might solve the issues i'm having. i feel like that whole green side of the bases should be one window to make it more predictable.this in turn will empower the small tower portion of the map and give me more leeway with base spawning. 

 

i'll boot up a dummy canvas in a few hours and see what i can throw together. 

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What's a site that i can blueprint maps before i make them. Something really easy to learn, I've tried sketch up and i don't wanna learn it. Just something really basic

Just use graph paper or something with a grid.

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What's a site that i can blueprint maps before i make them. Something really easy to learn, I've tried sketch up and i don't wanna learn it. Just something really basic

Honestly? Forge.

 

I am using blender to create a mesh map and I have been thinking of going back to forge 4 to draft it.

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Honestly? Forge.

 

I am using blender to create a mesh map and I have been thinking of going back to forge 4 to draft it.

I don't really like the H2A Forge, i didn't like the H4 forge at first either though. This forge seems harder to get used to, I'm not really feeling this contrast with the cartoon stone look with the black metal. I'll get used to it eventually though, just gotta find my right combination of pieces that i like then i can start drawing out ideas in my head.

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Honestly? Forge.

 

I am using blender to create a mesh map and I have been thinking of going back to forge 4 to draft it.

How is blender compared to 3ds max because I have been looking for something to use that is not a student version.

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How is blender compared to 3ds max because I have been looking for something to use that is not a student version.

3ds Max is the better program, but if all you're modeling is map designs, I would say go with blender. Its not as powerful, but the interface is more intuitive and easy to grasp. 3DS Max is more streamlined for complicated things like motion graphics.

 

Honestly, I would say Sketchup is the best option unless you're going for some mad circular stuff. Once you get all the correct components, its like building a map out of blocks irl.

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3ds Max is the better program, but if all you're modeling is map designs, I would say go with blender. Its not as powerful, but the interface is more intuitive and easy to grasp. 3DS Max is more streamlined for complicated things like motion graphics.

 

Honestly, I would say Sketchup is the best option unless you're going for some mad circular stuff. Once you get all the correct components, its like building a map out of blocks irl.

Blender can do character animation. How much does 3ds max cost now days?

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Can't wrap my head around 3D computer modelling just yet, especially in sketchup, so i draw all of my shit in 2D. I used adobe flash to make blueprints at one point, but now i do everything in Paint Tool SAI, which is faster for sketching. 

 

Of course, if it were being used for a professional presentation of some sort, the blueprints would need to be neater. 3D programs are better suited for that kind of work because not everyone can recognize your vision from a 2D sketch. I knew a forger who'd even go a step further, throwing his 3D layouts into the unity engine so you could walk around them on the PC. the most i've devoted to the design phase are quick concept pieces to get a feel for the mood of the map and a specific portion of it, which would help me visualize the rest. 

 

Sometime in the future i'd like to get a hold of modelling clay. there's something organic about physically molding with your hands and i feel like it'll be considerably easier to flesh out paths this way. Maybe someday i'll get off my lazy ass and pick some up. 

 

One thing's for certain, Forge is not very "sketch" friendly. It's too slow and clunky to throw together ideas in a timely manner. but at the same time, you never really know where you can go with a map until you see it in engine. Sometimes things that look cool in my head don't translate very well in-game; and i like to think i have a knack for pushing what can be created in-engine as far as geometry goes. 

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3ds Max is the better program, but if all you're modeling is map designs, I would say go with blender. Its not as powerful, but the interface is more intuitive and easy to grasp. 3DS Max is more streamlined for complicated things like motion graphics.

 

Honestly, I would say Sketchup is the best option unless you're going for some mad circular stuff. Once you get all the correct components, its like building a map out of blocks irl.

I am actually just making busts of some made up aliens for a project I am involved with. If its easier than 3ds max then I will have no issue then. 3ds max is pretty easy. 

 

@mr.green It is pretty damn expensive to much for me. You can do animation in 3ds max as well, and it is pretty fun.

 

@@Goat Modeling clay sounds like it would be pretty fun to play with. Everything I do in forge is based around what I know I can do with objects. Otherwise you run into a lot of scaling and object issues. 

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Anyone have an idea of when we'll be able to get our screenshots from the game on the internet like past games?

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it's happening...it's actually happening

 

fuck, something's happening and it looks forgegasmic. 

 

 

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my friend's idea to blow out the bridges and making them jumps opened up another path which led to that building (kinda modeled after Gold on Orion). So i think the flow is a million times better now especially if there's a 2 minute camo respawn in there. that alone will push gameplay towards that area, and since it's the furthest point from the bases it takes stress off of the open side. 

 

just one problem... i need to do some serious block usage wizardry. i just hope i don't hit the object limit afterwards because i'm going to be spamming rocks. if only there were 3x4 and 2x4 talls

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