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LeandroTrooper

Did Bungie Damage Halo?

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Sprint was the start of the slippery slope that ruined Halo. It was way too big of a change to the core game.

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Yeah. :/ Pretty sad how that works, eh?

 

Yep, I have been through it with a few series already Halo is just one of many. I think everyone who has played games for a decent amount of time, "hates" a game series they once really liked and frequented.

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Yep, I have been through it with a few series already Halo is just one of many. I think everyone who has played games for a decent amount of time, "hates" a game series they once really liked and frequented.

Damn, that sucks. I only play Halo and it just hurts that a franchise that I used to WANT to play has turned into one that I'll play occasionally out of boredom and because Halo is all I really know.

 

Must be even worse for you if it's happened to a few franchises you've played.

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I don't think it was a fluke, Microsoft just tried to commercialize the franchise each title which is why we see each game go downhill. I think they pressurized Bungie into making some decisions with their game to make it appeal to a much wider audience.

 

At least that's how I see it.

 

Nading down weapons was a fluke. The Magnum was made more powerful at the very last second and not given much testing. There were a bunch of other unintended things, I heard some discussion about that a while ago.. it was in some interview.. Obviously I'm not going to attribute everything to "luck," but the CE metagame definitely expanded beyond what was initially planned.

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I honestly think things started going downhill during Reach.

I hated the game, so for me, they did damage the game.

But with 343, they are slowly rebuilding what Bungie once had & Bungie is making their own new game that will reprove themselves.

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Did Bungie damage Halo? Yes.

Can it be fixed? Certainly.

Will it be fixed? I sure hope so.

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I don't think it was a fluke, Microsoft just tried to commercialize the franchise each title which is why we see each game go downhill. I think they pressurized Bungie into making some decisions with their game to make it appeal to a much wider audience.

 

At least that's how I see it.

It wasn't MS that told them to nerfed the Magnum, put in dual wielding, a random spread BR, a lock on rocket launcher, vehicle boarding, sloppier strafing, equipment, sprint, armor abilities, and bloom. Bungie did that all on their own.

 

Granted Bungie did also add some very innovated things to Halo and console gaming, but unfortunately the laid the foundation for the casual changes that fucked with the core gameplay that made CE amazing.

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It wasn't MS that told them to nerfed the Magnum, put in dual wielding, a random spread BR, a lock on rocket launcher, vehicle boarding, sloppier strafing, equipment, sprint, armor abilities, and bloom. Bungie did that all on their own.

Are you actually bashing vehicle boarding?

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It wasn't MS that told them to nerfed the Magnum, put in dual wielding, a random spread BR, a lock on rocket launcher, vehicle boarding, sloppier strafing, equipment, sprint, armor abilities, and bloom. Bungie did that all on their own.

 

Granted Bungie did also add some very innovated things to Halo and console gaming, but unfortunately the laid the foundation for the casual changes that fucked with the core gameplay that made CE amazing.

Source? 

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Are you actually bashing vehicle boarding?

 

Yip, there used to be a rewarding skill to timing a grenade in front of a charging warthog.

 

Source? 

 

Lol, come on Sam

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Yip, there used to be a rewarding skill to timing a grenade in front of a charging warthog.

 

 

Lol, come on Sam

I'm just saying, you don't fully know that M$ weren't sitting in there with Bungie in a conf. room pressurizing Bungie into making Halo appeal to more people. Is it a coincidence that each Halo has been worse than the previous one? We all know M$ pressured Bungie with deadlines and getting the Halo game out soon, and as they had more control over the franchise we saw more frequent Halo titles, M$ wanted to milk every penny out of Halo.

 

Furthermore, Bungie moved away from M$ and wanted to create a new franchise (Destiny) away from M$ from breathing down their necks.

 

Just food for thought, I'm not saying everything above is 100% true, but to me, it seems very likely from various things I've read.

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It wasn't MS that told them to nerfed the Magnum, put in dual wielding, a random spread BR, a lock on rocket launcher, vehicle boarding, sloppier strafing, equipment, sprint, armor abilities, and bloom. Bungie did that all on their own.

 

Granted Bungie did also add some very innovated things to Halo and console gaming, but unfortunately the laid the foundation for the casual changes that fucked with the core gameplay that made CE amazing.

 

You have to note every Halo team was different, I heard somewhere that after Halo 2 lots of the key personnel like Jason Jones and others peaced out or started to focus on other projects. Then they brought in alot of ex-Shadowrun guys who obviously put some of that game in Reach moving away from Halo's Arena roots with class abilities, sprint, and slow movement/heavy physics and restricted movement.

 

It just seems like every one of these Halo teams tried to "fix" things that weren't really wrong with the MP instead of focusing on game functionality and improving off the great base mechanics of Halo 1+Halo 2. To this day, Halo 2 is mechanically superior to H4 because the core game has been screwed with so much to compensate for the new abilities and elements introduced with each game its no longer recognizable from where it started. They never should of screwed with such a great core game, and try to pack it with nonsense that annoys players more than anything.

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I'm just saying, you don't fully know that M$ weren't sitting in there with Bungie in a conf. room pressurizing Bungie into making Halo appeal to more people. Is it a coincidence that each Halo has been worse than the previous one? We all know M$ pressured Bungie with deadlines and getting the Halo game out soon, and as they had more control over the franchise we saw more frequent Halo titles, M$ wanted to milk every penny out of Halo.

 

Furthermore, Bungie moved away from M$ and wanted to create a new franchise (Destiny) away from M$ from breathing down their necks.

 

Just food for thought, I'm not saying everything above is 100% true, but to me, it seems very likely from various things I've read.

Ok that I agree with. Definitely MS was watching over their shoulder saying make it 'easier'. But it was still Bungie that ultimately changed it. Prolly the same reason 343 put sprint and loadouts in Halo 4.

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Ok that I agree with. Definitely MS was watching over their shoulder saying make it 'easier'. But it was still Bungie that ultimately changed it. Prolly the same reason 343 put sprint and loadouts in Halo 4.

Yeah, I get that M$ didn't literally go up to Bungie and say, "You need to make the utility rifle in H2 a longer kill time than CE" etc but I think they had quite a lot of pull over what went into the game and I bet they scrapped a lot of test builds or ideas that Bungie threw their way. 

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Something went quite wrong with Reach and Bungie refused to change things, 343 then took over and gave the game a much needed TU, but then something very strange happened 343 made all of Bungie's mistakes but worse.

 

It's hard to know with Halo CE the multiplayer element was done in 2 weeks and was great but it wasn't possible to play online.

Halo 2 & 3 however had XBL and while issues and complaints did exist it wasn't like the huge amount of issues with Reach & H4.

Trying new features is fine but when done badly in conjunction with removing the ranking system and making terrible maps using forge.

I can't understand how 343 didn't realise they needed to turn back to a classic Halo style especially with all the feedback on forums.

Let's hope they know what Halo 5 needs to be.

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I dont know... but sometimes I see some posts pointing the finger at Bungie saying that it damaged Halo before 343, and somehow it lead 343 to where it is now.

 

Comments such as:

"People are still looking forward to Destiny. I was, but I remembered who ruined one of the best franchises out there, and it looks like 343 was left with the blame, and everyone forgot what Bungie did to 'Halo'"

 

"To be honest I put most of my blame on Bungie. Which isn't probably fair, but they did hype up Reach so so so much...for such low expectations."

 

"If Reach never existed and 343 took the Halo franchise from Bungie after Halo 3, they would most likely have based H4 off H3, adding a few tweaks I bet. I don't think it would have occurred to them to add AA's, Sprint etc to a new game in a popular franchise, instead, 343 looked at the most recent Halo title and copied the majority of it to keep a "familiar" feel."

 

What are your thoughts, guys?

If Halo Reach had been between Halo 3 and Halo 2 I think Halo 4 would have been between Halo 3 and Reach v7. Then Halo 5 would be Halo 2 level in my opinion.

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Reach was terrible but bungie didn't make it terrible on purpose.  They just hired a lot of new people and the old timers moved on to destiny, so we were left with a pile of shit.  I still think that halo 4 (with the update and no random ordnance) has a better core gameplay than reach due to slightly better maps and much better/fluid movement.  Team throwdown really does "feel" like halo except the maps are a bit worse and it has those personal ordnance which I'm pretty meh about.

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