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Classic Halo Esports and HCS Grassroots 2019 Discussion Thread

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16 hours ago, LoftiestTea33 said:

Wut

 

The guy who got stickied threw the second sticky.

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this place is dead so lets dive into some ninja news

https://fortniteintel.com/ninja-hits-back-at-influencers-who-only-complain-fortnite/17513/

 

ninja went off on streamers complaining about fortnite and how it ruins the game. i dont care honestly, but what got me is that he said its what happened to halo reach.

 

wtf? there were no streamers for halo reach, besides ninja lol and at the time it was all justin.tv and streaming had nowhere near the influence it had today. even IF streaming had a perceptiple impact on reach, that game was so far from what anyone wanted that mlg relegated it to an online only tournament in favor of a very new LoL game/event. if anyone is to blame for poor reception to a game's release/patch reception, its the devs. fans and streamers have no obligation to sit back and just accept a shitty product. i hate the argument of "you shouldnt complain, you'll hurt the game" because it shift responsibility away from the dev to make a product their paying customers want and onto influential people to shut up b/c some people like the game. its even more aggravating b/c ninja quit halo 5 over it being a poor game and an even more poorly run competitive scene.

 

/rant

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7 minutes ago, Craneteam said:

this place is dead so lets dive into some ninja news

https://fortniteintel.com/ninja-hits-back-at-influencers-who-only-complain-fortnite/17513/

 

ninja went off on streamers complaining about fortnite and how it ruins the game. i dont care honestly, but what got me is that he said its what happened to halo reach.

 

wtf? there were no streamers for halo reach, besides ninja lol and at the time it was all justin.tv and streaming had nowhere near the influence it had today. even IF streaming had a perceptiple impact on reach, that game was so far from what anyone wanted that mlg relegated it to an online only tournament in favor of a very new LoL game/event. if anyone is to blame for poor reception to a game's release/patch reception, its the devs. fans and streamers have no obligation to sit back and just accept a shitty product. i hate the argument of "you shouldnt complain, you'll hurt the game" because it shift responsibility away from the dev to make a product their paying customers want and onto influential people to shut up b/c some people like the game. its even more aggravating b/c ninja quit halo 5 over it being a poor game and an even more poorly run competitive scene.

 

/rant

Not streamers specifically, but since about when Reach released (give or take a year) is when gamers REALLY started getting pissy over games in general.  "X sucks, they ruined the series."  "It's not X anymore!  What are they doing?!"  "OMG this is the worst ever!".  

That's not to say that you can't be critical or make your opinion known, but people just whine about the game and say they're being constructive instead of ACTUALLY helping.  Some of the complaints have default solutions because it's a dichotomy, such as sprint where either it exists in the game or it doesn't.  When I see people whining about X, Y, or Z or shitting on stuff without doing anything else then yea they need to shut up unless they have a solution. 

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1 hour ago, Craneteam said:

this place is dead so lets dive into some ninja news

https://fortniteintel.com/ninja-hits-back-at-influencers-who-only-complain-fortnite/17513/

 

ninja went off on streamers complaining about fortnite and how it ruins the game. i dont care honestly, but what got me is that he said its what happened to halo reach.

 

wtf? there were no streamers for halo reach, besides ninja lol and at the time it was all justin.tv and streaming had nowhere near the influence it had today. even IF streaming had a perceptiple impact on reach, that game was so far from what anyone wanted that mlg relegated it to an online only tournament in favor of a very new LoL game/event. if anyone is to blame for poor reception to a game's release/patch reception, its the devs. fans and streamers have no obligation to sit back and just accept a shitty product. i hate the argument of "you shouldnt complain, you'll hurt the game" because it shift responsibility away from the dev to make a product their paying customers want and onto influential people to shut up b/c some people like the game. its even more aggravating b/c ninja quit halo 5 over it being a poor game and an even more poorly run competitive scene.

 

/rant

I kind of agree with his stance in the sense where if you have a voice, it is kind of your responsibility to use it properly. These pro-players and influencers who garner a lot of views and impressions should be part of the solution and not just pointing out the problem. I think if you're a "heavy player" you need to come from a place of compromise and be more level-headed and less heavy-handed with your opinions, or you might cause more problems than you fix. If that makes sense.

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59 minutes ago, Vintvge said:

I kind of agree with his stance in the sense where if you have a voice, it is kind of your responsibility to use it properly. These pro-players and influencers who garner a lot of views and impressions should be part of the solution and not just pointing out the problem. I think if you're a "heavy player" you need to come from a place of compromise and be more level-headed and less heavy-handed with your opinions, or you might cause more problems than you fix. If that makes sense.

I don't buy it. If you make a game that people love they'll play it. Sure a streamer might stop a few people from trying but if so many people agree that updates are bad that the bad news is drowning out everything positive about the game and making an impact then they fucked up horrifically with or without constructive criticism. Now for the streamers own good the feedback decision making tree is bit different. You don't want to scare people away from your livelihood but you also have to consider that some of those people entertain via wild and baseless opinions and an imaginary character built up off of that and not necessarily specific titles or games. They're not all in it cooperatively with the game devs nor do they all share their actual personality and opinions live on stream.

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2 hours ago, Trespa5s said:

Not streamers specifically, but since about when Reach released (give or take a year) is when gamers REALLY started getting pissy over games in general.  "X sucks, they ruined the series."  "It's not X anymore!  What are they doing?!"  "OMG this is the worst ever!".  

That's not to say that you can't be critical or make your opinion known, but people just whine about the game and say they're being constructive instead of ACTUALLY helping.  Some of the complaints have default solutions because it's a dichotomy, such as sprint where either it exists in the game or it doesn't.  When I see people whining about X, Y, or Z or shitting on stuff without doing anything else then yea they need to shut up unless they have a solution. 

i dont understand that argument. why is it up to fans to propose fixes for a game? that is not the job of consumers. its their job to voice their likes/dislikes. same with streamers. protecting a games company who made a bad game or a bad patch for a game is not what they are for and their opinion of something being bad is not negated by not having a solution to fix it

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I don't keep up with Fortnite, but one thing that might be worth considering is the tendency to look at an update, and pick out the one bad thing that you hate, and completely ignore all the other cool shit that just got added. Like, I don't know what all was changed in the most recent update, other than them removing the Pump Shotgun, because that's all anybody talked about on twitter. Negative things tend to carry more weight in the public sphere than positive ones, and I think Ninja's argument is that content creators share an obligation to the health of the game, since all of their livelihoods depend on it. As such, yes, voice your concerns about things you don't like in an effort to change it, but also be sure to highlight the positives so that you don't harm the population of the game that supports you and your peers.

I agree that it's the devs responsibility to put out a good product and keep the game alive. My point is that content creators are somewhat bound to each other. If one highly influential person starts bringing the game down, that can affect the others too. I think that's Ninja's main point.

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2 hours ago, Craneteam said:

i dont understand that argument. why is it up to fans to propose fixes for a game? that is not the job of consumers. its their job to voice their likes/dislikes. same with streamers. protecting a games company who made a bad game or a bad patch for a game is not what they are for and their opinion of something being bad is not negated by not having a solution to fix it

I just don't see it productive to say "EW this map sucks!"  Like OK that's fine, but WHY does it suck?  Is there too much verticality?  Bad flow?  Poor spawns?  WHY does the map suck?  
 

Same goes for "Bleh this isn't even Halo."  That's great, but is of absolutely NO use if they can't articulate WHY.  Is it game speed?  TTK?  Weapon design?  Complaining may get you the ear of the dev, but they aren't mind readers.  EXPLAIN why something is wrong because then they're more likely to 1) actually fix it and 2) fix it in the way that the community wants instead of an alternative that just introduces an entirely new problem.  

I was brought up with the whole "don't come to me with a problem, come to me with a solution" mentality but both sides end up feeling better as a result.  The devs are able to know where they went wrong and hopefully take that thinking into future designs, and the players are happy that the game is being fixed how they want it to be. 

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3 minutes ago, mediabrute said:

hi guys 

 

hope all is well

 

is halo esports back yet

hi mediabrute.

it's ok i guess

no

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Have you guys been keeping up with the Optic news? Apparently there's a bidding war over the Optic brand, and Hecz is one of the three major parties trying to buy. I'm wondering if Hecz regains control of the organization, will he try and get TOX to rejoin Optic? Or will he try to get Optic back into Halo at all?

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1 hour ago, Hully said:

Have you guys been keeping up with the Optic news? Apparently there's a bidding war over the Optic brand, and Hecz is one of the three major parties trying to buy. I'm wondering if Hecz regains control of the organization, will he try and get TOX to rejoin Optic? Or will he try to get Optic back into Halo at all?

I REALLY hope Hecz is able to regain control.  I totally understand why he sold initially, but you have to think even he knows that was a mistake at this point.  It really wouldn't surprise me to see him bring a team back to Halo with the H3 spike and Infinite coming next year.  I think his main concern is the CoD team though, which is cool.  

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2 hours ago, Hully said:

Have you guys been keeping up with the Optic news? Apparently there's a bidding war over the Optic brand, and Hecz is one of the three major parties trying to buy. I'm wondering if Hecz regains control of the organization, will he try and get TOX to rejoin Optic? Or will he try to get Optic back into Halo at all?

word is that even though hecz is coming in with a better offer than immortals, currently texas esoprts is unwilling to sell to hecz and wants to sell to immortals. if immortals takes control, they will re-brand the LoL team, sell the OWL team (since they own one of the LA teams), sell the csgp team (since they own a better csgo team, most likely get rid of the gears team, and buy a cwl spot which will force a re-branding. this will essentially dissolve optic as we know it. current theory (read: hope)  is that immortals will buy everything and then sell all but the LoL team back to hecz since immortals wanted that LoL spot from the beginning and is most likely all they truly care about.

 

as to tox, with all this shit and how they were treated in the past, i see no reason for them to drop current sponsorships and go back to an org of any kind. they are all some of the highest earners in all of esports (lethul, snakebite, and royal 2 listed at 118, 122, and 126 top earners ever with only karma and crimsix earning more as console players https://www.esportsearnings.com/players/highest-overall-x100) there is no reason for them to go back to an org unless 343 try to franchise infinite (which they better fucking not)

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Apparently the meeting is happening today. 

I hope Optic comes back to Halo. I also really like what TOX did after being released from Optic. I'll always have a soft spot for old school console shooter teams, so whether it's with the old roster, or Hecz signs some new players, I'd love to see that brand back in the HCS when Infinite gets here.

 

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1 hour ago, Hully said:

Apparently the meeting is happening today. 

I hope Optic comes back to Halo. I also really like what TOX did after being released from Optic. I'll always have a soft spot for old school console shooter teams, so whether it's with the old roster, or Hecz signs some new players, I'd love to see that brand back in the HCS when Infinite gets here.

 

343 would have to show some major improvement for running the hcs or just give the whole thing to mlg for any major orgs to come back. plus infinite will have to actually be good enough to bring in enough interest as a game

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4 minutes ago, Craneteam said:

343 would have to show some major improvement for running the hcs or just give the whole thing to mlg for any major orgs to come back. plus infinite will have to actually be good enough to bring in enough interest as a game

With MLG taking the reigns for the big events, having an H3 team wouldn't be out of the question.  You know there's going to be SOME sort of viewer  count for H3, and if shit hits the fan with Infinite that would be the perfect time to dump if that's what they're afraid of.  

But yea I could see that whole "selling everything but LoL" back to Hecz thing tbh.  From what we've seen of him over the past decade+, he'll do whatever he can to make sure OpTic lives on. 

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The reason they left Optic in the first place was because the management was shitty and Hecz wasn’t making the decisions anymore. If he’s the one running the show again I don’t see why they wouldn’t go back if it was offered.

That’s obviously a gigantic IF but I’d personally love to the see return of Optic.

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On 5/11/2019 at 9:21 PM, Silos said:

It's not HCS, but if you want to watch some Halo LAN streams this weekend.

CE LAN in Ontario Canada: https://www.twitch.tv/hurley_lives

CE/H2 LAN in Northern California: https://www.twitch.tv/norcalhalo

 

How do Canadians even play? Don't their heads flap around while they call out? Seems like it would be hard to see with all that head flopping and the smoke billowing from their oil powered TVs....



PS Im jk silos, dont punch me next time we chill LUL

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15 hours ago, Humpflung said:

How do Canadians even play? Don't their heads flap around while they call out? Seems like it would be hard to see with all that head flopping and the smoke billowing from their oil powered TVs....



PS Im jk silos, dont punch me next time we chill LUL

We've moved on from oil powered TVs, instead we have our pet moose run on a hamster wheel to generate power.

Can't wait to hang out again, my joycon Smash game has gone up a couple levels since we last played.

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New video is live! Just a quick one talking about why FFA is important to the competitive Halo scene. Enjoy!

 

 

 

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