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Halo Infinite Discussion

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16 minutes ago, Mr Grim said:

Again, the commando seems like it's going to be a problem weapon imo. Fast firing means it's extremely forgiving, 3x zoom makes it like a dmr, and if it's a 5 or 6 shot kill with that high a rof it's gonna be a spammy disaster. 

Seems like a perfect starting weapon that could attract more cod players. Now we only need maps with tons of boxes and sprint corridors.

Wait a second...

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58 minutes ago, Mr Grim said:

Again, the commando seems like it's going to be a problem weapon imo. Fast firing means it's extremely forgiving, 3x zoom makes it like a dmr, and if it's a 5 or 6 shot kill with that high a rof it's gonna be a spammy disaster. 

Obviously I have no idea how sped up/slowed down the clip I am looking at it. 5 shots was around 1 second. Maybe slightly faster. If the strafe isn't ass, honestly, might be a non-issue. Obviously things like bullet mag, aim assist, the aiming system itself, the strafe, and how willing 343 is to change damage outputs on weapons if they become an issue have major influences on this. 

 

I just want a fun game man. The commando being fully auto honestly would just save more stress on my controller triggers. Nothing beats the feeling of three trigger pulls and killing an enemy but if the commando is the gun and feels satisfying, eh. 

 

EDIT: The other caveat is if I know what I'm doing trying to analyze a youtube video

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1 minute ago, OG Nick said:

Obviously I have no idea how sped up/slowed down the clip I am looking at it. 5 shots was around 1 second. Maybe slightly faster. If the strafe isn't ass, honestly, might be a non-issue. Obviously things like bullet mag, aim assist, the aiming system itself, the strafe, and how willing 343 is to change damage outputs on weapons if they become an issue have major influences on this. 

 

I just want a fun game man. The commando being fully auto honestly would just save more stress on my controller triggers. Nothing beats the feeling of three trigger pulls and killing an enemy but if the commando is the gun and feels satisfying, eh. 

This is where i'm at. Its just more comfortable to shoot without having to pull the trigger constantly.  I don't see how bending a non-aiming, non-strafing finger adds anything to the experience or skill level either.  If you want to shoot slower, say longer range or if someone strafes and you need to pause for a split second to get back on target, you still need to make that decision and execute individual trigger pulls.  If the weapon has a proper ttk without huge magnetism and giant player hitboxes it could be fine.

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3 minutes ago, Apoll0 said:

This is where i'm at. Its just more comfortable to shoot without having to pull the trigger constantly.  I don't see how bending a non-aiming, non-strafing finger adds anything to the experience or skill level either.  If you want to shoot slower, say longer range or if someone strafes and you need to pause for a split second to get back on target, you still need to make that decision and execute individual trigger pulls.  If the weapon has a proper ttk without huge magnetism and giant player hitboxes it could be fine.

You've always been able to buffer shots in Halo, so there is no argument to be made about a semi-auto weapon being inherently easier to use because there's no sort of timing aspect.

I'd rather the Commando be the starting weapon if it kills fast, remains accurate, and doesn't have a ton of autoaim. Not that I have a ton of faith in 343 reducing autoaim.

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Just now, Sitri said:

You've always been able to buffer shots in Halo, so there is no argument to be made about a semi-auto weapon being inherently easier to use because there's no sort of timing aspect.

I'd rather the Commando be the starting weapon if it kills fast, remains accurate, and doesn't have a ton of autoaim. Not that I have a ton of faith in 343 reducing autoaim.

Bolded is my biggest concern

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3 hours ago, OG Nick said:

Lot of faith in 343's ability to program here. I don't want to sound overly critical, cause programming can be extremely difficult for what you would assume is easy, but 343 has a poor track record overall though not always indicative of poor programming. 

I think saying that 343's games have been sub-par from a code perspective is a stretch and would be hard to defend - especially in juxtaposition with the Bungie Halo games that were literally known and praised for unintentional quirky physics bugs, animation cancelling, button glitches/combos, etc. 343 is comprised of extremely talented software developers and programmers - which is entirely separate from game design / direction / quality / etc. 

and for transparency, I'm posting this as a professional games programmer. 

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2 minutes ago, heytred said:

I think saying that 343's games have been sub-par from a code perspective is a stretch and would be hard to defend - especially in juxtaposition with the Bungie Halo games that were full of quirky physics bugs, animation cancelling, button glitches/combos, etc. 

and for transparency, I'm posting this as a professional games programmer. 

I believe you honestly. Just seems like one of those things that should be "relatively" simple that 343 has done poorly in the past. I'm being very biased against 343 here and I know it. But after the aiming issues in Halo 5, which they had working fine in the beta build from what I remember,  I'll be pretty pessimistic about stuff like being able to change hitmarkers easily.

 

Overall they do have most things down pat programming wise. 

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1 hour ago, Reamis25 said:

Ok I see in some cod story’s the hit markers are off, but that’s simply an off an on. There isn’t a weapon in cod campaign that’s got hit markers and another that doesn’t 

@MultiLockOn based on what you’ve seen does infinite have a solid sandbox 

It looks about par for the course, maybe more spammy weapons this time around. But that's just creatively speaking. All that matters is that the aim assist isn't through the roof... Which won't be the case. 

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6 minutes ago, OG Nick said:

I believe you honestly. Just seems like one of those things that should be "relatively" simple that 343 has done poorly in the past. I'm being very biased against 343 here and I know it. But after the aiming issues in Halo 5, which they had working fine in the beta build from what I remember,  I'll be pretty pessimistic about stuff like being able to change hitmarkers easily.

 

Overall they do have most things down pat programming wise. 

Yeah, I feel you for sure. I think 343's mismanagement of Halo has mostly been in treating it as a vehicle for Xbox/Microsoft success (sometimes to the game's detriment... look at Halo 5 campaign) & the thing that has helped calm my own bias is it seems they finally realize that Halo is so big/beloved that its success needs to be measured on its own next to things like Xbox instead of being treated as a feature, experience, or portion of Xbox... if that makes sense? 

Seems like they finally have the greenlight from daddy Microsoft to treat Halo with the reverence and resources it and the fans deserve. I'm optimistic for now but had near zero faith in Infinite prior to E3. 

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1 minute ago, heytred said:

Yeah, I feel you for sure. I think 343's mismanagement of Halo has mostly been in treating it as a vehicle for Xbox/Microsoft success (sometimes to the game's detriment... look at Halo 5 campaign) & the thing that has helped calm my own bias is it seems they finally realize that Halo is so big/beloved that its success needs to be measured on its own next to things like Xbox instead of being treated as a feature, experience, or portion of Xbox... if that makes sense? 

Seems like they finally have the greenlight from daddy Microsoft to treat Halo with the reverence and resources it and the fans deserve. 

For sure. Them getting this long to develop the game alone tells you a lot. 

H2 was so rushed they didn't let them finish the story for example. Halo 5 was obviously rushed out the door as well. 

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1 minute ago, heytred said:

Yeah, I feel you for sure. I think 343's mismanagement of Halo has mostly been in treating it as a vehicle for Xbox/Microsoft success (sometimes to the game's detriment... look at Halo 5 campaign) & the thing that has helped calm my own bias is it seems they finally realize that Halo is so big/beloved that its success needs to be measured on its own next to things like Xbox instead of being treated as a feature, experience, or portion of Xbox... if that makes sense? 

Seems like they finally have the greenlight from daddy Microsoft to treat Halo with the reverence and resources it and the fans deserve. 

On the bolded, just based off what I've seen so far of infinite the game feels like it has a soul to it. Halo 5 always felt half baked to me. 

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4 minutes ago, xSociety said:

For sure. Them getting this long to develop the game alone tells you a lot. 

H2 was so rushed they didn't let them finish the story for example. Halo 5 was obviously rushed out the door as well. 

Yeah, it's pretty clear from looking at the H5 campaign, marketing, and staggered feature release that lots of cuts were made to ensure the game was out the door during a specific window on the fiscal calendar. 

 

  

3 minutes ago, OG Nick said:

On the bolded, just based off what I've seen so far of infinite the game feels like it has a soul to it. Halo 5 always felt half baked to me. 

Yeah - this is kind of what I mean. Halo 5 could have been an amazing game if given all the resources it needed to succeed - a little extra time to bring together the full feature set and nail the campaign content and pacing. Knowing that 343 / Microsoft realize doing this again will _kill_ the franchise makes hopeful LOL

 

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Just now, OG Nick said:

On the bolded, just based off what I've seen so far of infinite the game feels like it has a soul to it. Halo 5 always felt half baked to me. 

The Infinite MP ViDoc was really nostalgic tbh. Halo 5 was Power Rangers fanfic. 

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One of my concerns is that this "new" engine isn't really all that new.  Obviously they didn't start it from total scratch, that would be a waste, but if you look at the shit we had to deal with in Halo 5 and how damn long it took to change very simple things, it seems that the 20 year old engine had not ever been given the serious overhaul that it needed OR they needed to switch to something that was externally maintained. Seeing the hitmakers still be on the grenades when they knew it was a problem in Halo 5 makes me wonder just how nimble this engine is.  If they seriously want this to be a GaaS for the next 10 years, it better be a hell of a lot more nimble than Halo 5s.

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6 minutes ago, Apoll0 said:

One of my concerns is that this "new" engine isn't really all that new.  Obviously they didn't start it from total scratch, that would be a waste, but if you look at the shit we had to deal with in Halo 5 and how damn long it took to change very simple things, it seems that the 20 year old engine had not ever been given the serious overhaul that it needed OR they needed to switch to something that was externally maintained. Seeing the hitmakers still be on the grenades when they knew it was a problem in Halo 5 makes me wonder just how nimble this engine is.  If they seriously want this to be a GaaS for the next 10 years, it better be a hell of a lot more nimble than Halo 5s.

It definitely isn't brand new and probably shouldn't be. More than likely it was mostly a restructure of project code, tools, and engine dependencies to speed up content generation pipelines. How the game data, content, etc is structured and loaded are probably the meat of the updates but this is 1000% speculation. 

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Even if the could disable nade hitmarkers they won't do it. This is one of those hills 343 wants to die on, just like Sprint.

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What I still do not understand, and I suspect likely will never understand, is what about this game has justified a six-plus year development cycle.

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15 minutes ago, Cursed Lemon said:

What I still do not understand, and I suspect likely will never understand, is what about this game has justified a six-plus year development cycle.

We'll have to see just how big the SP is.

Also, the fact that it's a "new" engine and being developed for the current gen Xbox/PC as well as the super old last gen Xbox. 

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2 hours ago, MultiLockOn said:

It looks about par for the course, maybe more spammy weapons this time around. But that's just creatively speaking. All that matters is that the aim assist isn't through the roof... Which won't be the case. 

How do you know this won't be the case? 

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They clearly had a game before infinite and scrapped it. Plus all that talk about a new engine is bullshit. It's still blam, just like creation 2 is still gamebryo, which is still netimmerse.

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57 minutes ago, Cursed Lemon said:

What I still do not understand, and I suspect likely will never understand, is what about this game has justified a six-plus year development cycle.

The HI releasing this year probably didn‘t have a development cycle this long… correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t MS scrap H5.5 early 2018 and development startet over? So it‘s more like 3 years.

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9 minutes ago, calberto said:

The HI releasing this year probably didn‘t have a development cycle this long… correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t MS scrap H5.5 early 2018 and development startet over? So it‘s more like 3 years.

That's the rumor but we don't actually know for sure. There was also a rumor that they started developing on EU4, then microsoft wanted their own in-house engine like frostbite and went that route. Those are just rumors, idk of any substantiation but if i were a betting man I would say 99% they got 18 months in and scrapped the game and started over.  50/50 they switched engines midway.

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1 hour ago, Cursed Lemon said:

What I still do not understand, and I suspect likely will never understand, is what about this game has justified a six-plus year development cycle.

Word goes they pretty much restarted the development around 2018.

They supposed to start on Unreal 4, then switched to this Slipspace thing, scrapping along the way what seems to have been Halo 5.5

Around the same time, they hired lot of new people that have been placed on leading positions in sandbox department, and that is a fact.

Then covid gave a spin to this mess.

I think that is big part of the reason why.

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2 minutes ago, Hemlax said:

Around the same time, they hired lot of new people that have been placed on leading positions in sandbox department, and that is a fact.

I think that is big part of the reason why.

That is true, we know that for a fact.  From what we saw in the MP reveal, the game is pretty far from what a Halo 5.5 would have been so I think those staffing changes amounted to some "Addition by subtraction" and then... addition.

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