Jump to content
CyReN

Halo Infinite Discussion

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Boyo said:

And rather than just make that the definitive 4v4 experience, you want to add a social 4v4 variant because...?

Not everything needs to be sweaty or try-hard. Sometimes I just wanna kick back with a friend and play without being emotional about a win/loss.

Not to mention Halo has always had ranked and social game modes, can we really not remove more classic Halo features that we've always had.

What's the benefit to only having one 4v4 playlist? Would it be more like a ranked 4v4 or a social? 

If ranked, what happens when people complain they don't want to play without radar? Or they want to use X weapon that doesn't see it on competitive maps even though it's in the game?

If social, what happens to the players who want to take the game seriously without having radar and gimmicky weapons that makes a competitive Halo game not fun?

I fail to see how having a ranked and a social version for the most popular Halo gametype is a bad thing.

  • Like (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

How do people still not understand more options and playlists helped halo survive and that social and competitive playlists should be separate because they will assuredly have different experiences

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
14 minutes ago, Killmachine said:

How do people still not understand more options and playlists helped halo survive and that social and competitive playlists should be separate because they will assuredly have different experiences

Would 4v4 comp and 4v4 social share the same maps?  

Share this post


Link to post
11 minutes ago, Boyo said:

Would 4v4 comp and 4v4 social share the same maps?  

What's the difference between a casual and competitive map?

Share this post


Link to post
47 minutes ago, JordanB said:

What's the benefit to only having one 4v4 playlist?

It would funnel everyone into one playlist.  More players means wider skill range means fairer matches.  

48 minutes ago, JordanB said:

Would it be more like a ranked 4v4 or a social? 

My choice would be a competitive 4v4 playlist and a social 6v6 playlist.  Casuals like vehicles and a 6v6 playlist could support a limited vehicle set.  

49 minutes ago, JordanB said:

If ranked, what happens when people complain they don't want to play without radar? Or they want to use X weapon that doesn't see it on competitive maps even though it's in the game?

Then they play one of the other playlists.  

50 minutes ago, JordanB said:

I fail to see how having a ranked and a social version for the most popular Halo gametype is a bad thing.

Because it splits the population unnecessarily.  

Share this post


Link to post
Just now, Mr Grim said:

What's the difference between a casual and competitive map?

What’s the difference between a good painting a bad one?  

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, Boyo said:

It would funnel everyone into one playlist.  More players means wider skill range means fairer matches.  

My choice would be a competitive 4v4 playlist and a social 6v6 playlist.  Casuals like vehicles and a 6v6 playlist could support a limited vehicle set.  

Then they play one of the other playlists.  

Because it splits the population unnecessarily.  

It's not "fairer" matches if half the people in the playlist are playing sweaty and half the people are playing laid back and casually.

So in ranked 4v4 are there are any party restrictions? i.e. Players at two different ranks (let's say a bronze and a gold) cannot play together since they are too far apart in MMR? If yes then you are not getting more players into the playlist, you're just removing players from playing Halo entirely.

Ranked and social don't split up the population unnecessarily because they offer different things. One is sweaty, and trying to win to feel the reward of ranking up. The other is playing laid back, just having a good time no matter what happens, maybe trying some goofy stuff that you wouldn't normally do in a ranked game.

You're forcing a new Halo player to jump right into 4v4 competitive. No social to play around, learn the maps, learn weapon spawns, and just in-general learning the game. This player is going to struggle early and be placed into a very low rank. This either A) is extremely unfun trying to rank up out of a division where the player might not really belong, but was forced there since there is no social 4v4 game mode; or B) will cause the player to stop playing ranked entirely.

I've played Halo since 2006; I also play Rocket League and Smite - in all of these games if there was no difference between ranked and casual I can say I would have an extremely hard time getting into any of these games. Or, I might get into the games just fine, but I wouldn't be able to have any of my friends join me to start playing the game because our skill levels are so different that playing competitive with that person wouldn't be fun. So I either have to start playing Halo at the same time as my friends so we can learn the game together, make new friends, play by myself, or play a new game.

Also, only having one playlist extremely favors having alt accounts. Have one account where you play the game by yourself/with your better friends, and having a second account where you play with your new/lesser skilled friends. Hopefully I don't have to go into why having alts is not a good thing.

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Fire (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

4v4 ranked - no advanced movement, no autos, no radar, utility rifle starts, maps designed around no sprint/clamber. 

5v5 social - default settings, join in progress, rolling lobbies, auto balancing, gametype/map filters (match composer)

8v8 social - same as above^^

I could get behind this. That said, I have no faith in 343 rolling out a playlist with no advanced movement. 

  • Like (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post

If you want to fuck around, play customs.  If you want to try, play matchmaking.  Do I really have to defend not giving you a playlist to just fuck around in?  @JordanB

  • Downvote (-1) 3

Share this post


Link to post
7 minutes ago, Boyo said:

If you want to fuck around, play customs.  If you want to try, play matchmaking.  Do I really have to defend not giving you a playlist to just fuck around in?  @JordanB

There's a middle between try-harding and fucking around. Did you miss my point about playing with friends? However, can you find me 7 friends to play customs with, otherwise yes give me a playlist.

Boyo, if you're suggesting the people who want to play social 4v4 go play a custom game, how is that any different than having a dedicated playlist? The ranked 4v4 playlist would still has the same number of people. So if the playerbase is still split (between ranked and customs as opposed to ranked and social), what other benefit is there to only having one 4v4 playlist.

Share this post


Link to post
30 minutes ago, S0UL FLAME said:

If I may, I'd like to put forth my thoughts on playlists.

Match Composer

Similar to the one in MCC, but with a few changes; map selection replaces game selection, and the gamemodes are separated from one another instead of bunched. You must have at least three maps and at least two gamemodes toggled in order to play. Player counts are 2v2, 4v4, 8v8 and 16v16 (or whatever number BTB 2.0 is gonna be.) No MMR, but instead; after a match ends, you have an option of staying in the lobby and getting "hotter" matches - meaning you'll get closer games. You can opt out of this option by pressing a button to keep games completely random in terms of players' skill.

Ranked Playlists

There are only three of these, but each of them have their own experiences and skills to master; they are Doubles, Arena, and Squad Battle. Doubles is a refined version of the one in Composer, with a cleaner sandbox and map pool. There is only Slayer, no radar. Arena is 4v4, and consists only of objective modes; Flag, Oddball, Assault, King, and Strongholds. No radar, trimmed sandbox, competitive map pool. Squad Battle is 6v6, and has Attack/Defend modes; 1 Flag, 1 Bomb, Territories, and Core Defense (said gamemode is better designed than the one in Warzone). Vehicles, Radar.

Custom Games

Create your own lobby, or join another. Mods are acceptable here, and is a perfect place to test Forge maps. If your mod, map, or both get popular, 343 will bring your lobby to the front page. If you get really popular, your stuff will be temporarily put on the Composer for a week, with double XP.

That's my spiel. What are your thoughts?

I like all this a lot, and have the same general sentiment regarding minimizing ranked playlists. However: I do believe ranked deserves a six-player Lone Wolves. I like ranked 6v6 Squad Battle, however if I had to pick one or the other, it’d be the former. 

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, RatherSilentMr said:

Was looking at some of the photos up close. Some things I missed the first time. 

yQj8gYn.jpg

1AendT0.jpg

qPRjVph.jpg

 

 

First picture is a surveyor's tripod. Top left of the last picture is a ruler. The right side are mountains that were drawn with the straight-edge of the ruler. They just forgot to pick up the ruler before they took the screenshot.

Share this post


Link to post

The simple addition of grime on a tower is a silent admission from 343 that their previous forerunner artstyles made no sense. And uh, if they saw this post, they would probably go delete all those decals out of pride.

At this rate of 343 reintroducing things the game launched with 20 years ago, we'll be back to Halo 3 in, hmm maybe ~ 200 years? Then we can finally start improving Halo from there! I'm so excited for this games future!

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Heavy Breathing (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, S0UL FLAME said:

If I may, I'd like to put forth my thoughts on playlists.

Match Composer

Similar to the one in MCC, but with a few changes; map selection replaces game selection, and the gamemodes are separated from one another instead of bunched. You must have at least three maps and at least two gamemodes toggled in order to play. Player counts are 2v2, 4v4, 8v8 and 16v16 (or whatever number BTB 2.0 is gonna be.) No MMR, but instead; after a match ends, you have an option of staying in the lobby and getting "hotter" matches - meaning you'll get closer games. You can opt out of this option by pressing a button to keep games completely random in terms of players' skill.

Ranked Playlists

There are only three of these, but each of them have their own experiences and skills to master; they are Doubles, Arena, and Squad Battle. Doubles is a refined version of the one in Composer, with a cleaner sandbox and map pool. There is only Slayer, no radar. Arena is 4v4, and consists only of objective modes; Flag, Oddball, Assault, King, and Strongholds. No radar, trimmed sandbox, competitive map pool. Squad Battle is 6v6, and has Attack/Defend modes; 1 Flag, 1 Bomb, Territories, and Core Defense (said gamemode is better designed than the one in Warzone). Vehicles, Radar.

Custom Games

Create your own lobby, or join another. Mods are acceptable here, and is a perfect place to test Forge maps. If your mod, map, or both get popular, 343 will bring your lobby to the front page. If you get really popular, your stuff will be temporarily put on the Composer for a week, with double XP.

That's my spiel. What are your thoughts?

This is pretty much what I wanted with MCC. I still enjoy their match composer but I really want to pick my maps because, man, sometimes (all the time lmao) I don't want to play Derelict/Wizard and would rather just be on Damnation/Chill Out

As for your ranked playlists I think you may have to concede letting a ranked slayer playlist in for those guys because there are so many of them but I'd personally be down for that selection

I think another useful thing they should do is give everyone some % of the total map pool in map bans. So out of 12 total maps in a playlist you could choose to turn off up to 2 of them as an example before you started to search. That would send a message loud and clear from the community about certain maps that aren't meeting fun expectations but not be as in your face or overall time consuming as a veto process before every single game. It would marginally increase match times if everyone had a different opinion but my suspicion is that more often than not people would be banning the same few maps if they banned anything at all and it would really help point 343 in the correct direction. I think some caveats like only basing the search off of the party leader's own map bans when in a party would need to be included to avoid some clever use by friends to get only one or two maps in a playlist ever. Much like server restrictions and input restrictions this would be something to use at your own risk as far as search lengths went

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

I wanna play Halo with a m/kb and MCC is absolutely not the place to do that if I don't want my shit pushed in. Hopefully the PC blog in April goes into a bit of detail with some of the lessons they've learned from MCC and they tone down the absolutely fucking insane amount of aim assist Halo had. 

Share this post


Link to post
41 minutes ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

I wanna play Halo with a m/kb and MCC is absolutely not the place to do that if I don't want my shit pushed in. Hopefully the PC blog in April goes into a bit of detail with some of the lessons they've learned from MCC and they tone down the absolutely fucking insane amount of aim assist Halo had. 

Honestly I'm not sure they're going to be switching it up from how they do console Halo. Its probably more likely they just advise you to use input restrictions and focus on just making sure the mkb gameplay actually works as smoothly as other games do

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Snipe Three said:

Honestly I'm not sure they're going to be switching it up from how they do console Halo. Its probably more likely they just advise you to use input restrictions and focus on just making sure the mkb gameplay actually works as smoothly as other games do

One thing I did notice from the gameplay demo was that the aim assist was a lot less sticky and tracky then it is in 2/3/4/Reach/5. It looked like you'd actually need to be a pit more proactive with the right thumbstick to hit anything, which is great.

 

 

  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • WutFace (+0) 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

One thing I did notice from the gameplay demo was that the aim assist was a lot less sticky and tracky then it is in 2/3/4/Reach/5. It looked like you'd actually need to be a pit more proactive with the right thumbstick to hit anything, which is great.

That’s always how it is pre-release before they panic and overcook the meat.  

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
18 hours ago, Aphex Twin said:

That's the great thing about CE - even though the minimum TTK is a half second, the average TTK was much higher. I prefer this type of Halo experience - you can kill an opponent before he even has time to react if your aim is good enough, but your opponent's strafe is very effective since you need to lead your shots.

i completely agree with your view here, but that wasn't the earlier quote.

Share this post


Link to post
18 hours ago, Aphex Twin said:

I would be thrilled if advanced movement was limited to social/customs.

lol, you missed where I was going with that.

 

Why have any of that if you take it out for ranked?

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, MrGreenWithAGun said:

lol, you missed where I was going with that.

 

Why have any of that if you take it out for ranked?

I mean Halo isn't really focused on ranked gameplay. I think a lot of the fun of Halo really came from campaign and fun/social modes. Zombies, tower of power, swat etc in H2 onto fat kid and the like in H3. I think providing tools to the community to be creative as much as possible is a really important thing 343 could be doing for the community. I think some mechanics could be really fun in a solo or co-op campaign experience and really fucking bad in a ranked multiplayer game. It would be so much easier to provide new, cool and fun things if they weren't so dead set on balancing and shoehorning everything into matchmaking and then ranked matchmaking beyond that. We would probably all be better off if they stuck to what works when it comes to curating a competitive experience and didn't let that stop them from being creative and providing tools for things outside of that. Given appropriate tools eventually something would come out of the community that would be acceptable to offer in social matchmade games or even ranked gameplay but they try and figure it all out on their own before the game is released and we're all worse off because of it

I think holding up the ranked playlist as the definitive way of playing Halo has never really worked and never will with how diverse and fractured the community really is. Bungie was really good at leaning into that fact and while some other popular games might make people think that isn't the right way of doing things I actually think the reality of the Halo community won't allow a successful attempt at anything else. If they picked the competitive gameplay that I prefer surely I would be happy as would the community that I play within but all of the swat, btb, campaign, zombie, slayer, whatever kids would likely not be interested and just quit playing more often than they would transition into the new way to play.

343 would do a lot better if they just empowered the various communities to create whatever game is right for them on the canvas that they provided and monitored and supported that when appropriate. They shouldn't be the guys setting up our tournament settings or showing everyone how zombies should work. They should be supporting the players who participate in those things and providing the platform for them to play on. If you check out what bungie did most of the time they pretty much had their default playlists because the game has to release with something up and then went around riding the wave of whatever the community was enjoying post H2 release. They could play that role better than bungie ever did if they just embraced doing so

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Fire (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use & Privacy Policy.