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Halo Infinite Discussion

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I think that the ttk shouldn't be too low because it makes weapons unfun to fight against. The ttk should give you time to react, while also being low enough to present a threat to power weapons. anything below 0.6 and you're getting counterstriked out of nowhere.

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4 hours ago, The Tyco said:

I once thought sprint couldn't get any dumber, then MW2019 came out with "double-sprint". Like, you're sprinting but harder. I actually fucking face palmed.

Lmao I just remembered this. Such a dumbass mechanic. 

Also on the topic of immersion: I can't be the only one who is LESS immersed when mechanics like sprint and heavy bloom/recoil on so called super soldiers 500 years in the future. Especially with Chief, did he suddenly forget how to run and shoot at the same time after H3? I can sort of understand that the Spartan IVs are weak pieces of shit compared to IIs, but why'd they have to go ahead and ruin Chief? It makes zero sense. 

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Sprint has been solved since Halo Reach. Just make it so you are sprinting at all times. Remove walking. Everyone is happy. 

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I don't really have the time I used to, so I don't really plan on getting super heavy into 4v4, Comp Halo stuff anymore. All I want from Halo these days is a fun, sandbox shooter with some cool casual modes I can hop in and play with my mates, and the rumours of BTB 2.0 and the vehicles they hinted at (something that fits between Hog and the Scorpion) have me more excited for a new Halo game. As long as BTB 2.0 is over 20 vs 20 I'm happy. 

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The only way I'm buying this is if it comes with a full suite of dev tools that allow me to literally make my own CE-plus style game. Campaign, multiplayer, the whole thing. 340 (deducting another point for that paragraphs-of-absolute-nothing bulletin) couldn't be trusted to get such an endeavor right even if they tried, so fuck, I'll do it. I got such a game pretty much mapped out anyway.

Otherwise I'm not interested.

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new halo game shouldn't be Halo CE, should be a competent NEW halo game, everyone in here talks about CE but nobody plays it even on mcc and its inconvenient as fuck to lan or play in its best possible state anyway esp in covid

(i say that as i enjoy playing the game and have tried to get my rank up more in the CE playlist btw still an awesome game and the ppl in h1hub and the people still playing it are awesome)

halo infinite looks like the most competent halo game 343 has made in terms of appealing to classic fans but it will likely be a frankensteined balance games that offsets new movement like clamber and sprint with zero ways to use them aggressively like halo 5 had 

i expect very little and hope to be surprised but i'm not kidding myself
 

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4 hours ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

I don't really have the time I used to, so I don't really plan on getting super heavy into 4v4, Comp Halo stuff anymore. All I want from Halo these days is a fun, sandbox shooter with some cool casual modes I can hop in and play with my mates, and the rumours of BTB 2.0 and the vehicles they hinted at (something that fits between Hog and the Scorpion) have me more excited for a new Halo game. As long as BTB 2.0 is over 20 vs 20 I'm happy. 

Yeah, I'm leaning more towards this mind set lately, I'd much rather hear about what people are looking forward to in Infinite instead of the 5000th post about why sprint is bad and needs to be removed. We aren't getting old Halo back, whether you like it or not MCC was 343's way of catering to the oldschool fans and at this point you either need to come to terms with what Halo has become or move on to something else, it's mentally draining going over the same points ad nauseam and part of the reason why I don't come here as much as I used to or would like to.

With that said, BTB 2.0 sounds like it could be a ton of fun, I've always liked BTB in Halo and hearing that it is getting an overhaul along with the vehicle combat has me optimistic. Not to mention the fact that forge is likely going to be even better than it already is in Halo 5, and with the game being free 2 play and assuming it will have a custom games browser, that gives Infinite a lot more potential than people here are willing to admit.

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When a piece of Equipment was deployed in Halo 3, the player dropped, tossed, or rolled an object onto the map, removing it from his inventory.  

Infinite’s grappleshot is a bit different because the player does not drop something onto the map.  Instead, he fires a projectile, like a weapon.  

Now that the rules of H3 equipment no longer apply, what new kinds of equipment could be introduced in Infinite?  

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12 hours ago, hvs500 said:

The whole "combat doctrine" and having a low skill floor and high skill ceiling was different from 5 and 4s philosophy.

And yet the prolonged gunfight playstyle was consistent between the two (along with reach). 

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12 hours ago, hvs500 said:

I think that the ttk shouldn't be too low because it makes weapons unfun to fight against. The ttk should give you time to react, while also being low enough to present a threat to power weapons. anything below 0.6 and you're getting counterstriked out of nowhere.

There's never been a halo game like this, but it sounds soooooo much better than anything we've had in the past decade. 

It's time for halo to evolve and finally ditch long TTKs. Time to join the rest of today's top shooters. 

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2 hours ago, Killmachine said:

new halo game shouldn't be Halo CE, should be a competent NEW halo game, everyone in here talks about CE ....

 

That's because there's never been a halo game better than CE. 

A modern take on a CE style game with fast TTKs would likely sustain a higher population than modern halo.

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When I design Halo, the Equipment class of items has two roles to play:  

  1. acting as pick-ups in the 6v6 slayer/obj playlist (Squad Battle) 
  2. acting as spawn abilities for a few select players in 9v9 Invasion 

 

Equipment and Officers 

 

In Invasion 2.0, each team has three ranks (6 low, 2 medium, and 1 high).  For example, a team of Elites has 1 Field Marshall and 2 Ultras who spawn with better kit than the 6 Elite Minors.  

There are four playable species:  Spartan, Elite, Brute, and Promethean.  Each species has two officer ranks.  Each officer rank has a unique piece of Equipment associated with it. 

 

Spartan Fireteam Leader 

Spotting Scope (temporarily mark an enemy with a waypoint visible to teammates) 

 

Spartan Commander 

Missile Pod 

 

Elite Ultra 

Hologram 

 

Elite Field Marshall 

Bubble Shield 

 

Brute Captain 

Power Drain 

 

Brute Chieftain 

Flamethrower 

 

Promethean Omega 

Chariot (user deployable, single use, one man, forward moving, ground vehicle) 

 

Promethean Alpha 

?

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I'm likely in the minority, but BTB 2.0 sounds like shit to me. 

Vehicular gameplay in halo multiplayer was always boring to me. Wish it was more mayhem style - 20 v 20 on smaller maps with no vehicles. 

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35 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

There's never been a halo game like this, but it sounds soooooo much better than anything we've had in the past decade. 

It's time for halo to evolve and finally ditch long TTKs. Time to join the rest of today's top shooters. 

A low ttk on your utility weapon would make the power weapons undesirable, unless they tweak the power weapons to somehow be even more unfun to fight against than they already are. Low ttks work in a game like counter strike because it's not an arena or a pseudo arena shooter, and map movement is encouraged in the form of the objective, rather than pick ups. And even then, csgo still is a contender for the least fun I've ever had in a video game.

 

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5 minutes ago, hvs500 said:

A low ttk on your utility weapon would make the power weapons undesirable, unless they tweak the power weapons to somehow be even more unfun to fight against than they already are. Low ttks work in a game like counter strike because it's not an arena or a pseudo arena shooter, and map movement is encouraged in the form of the objective, rather than pick ups. And even then, csgo still is a contender for the least fun I've ever had in a video game.

In my experience testing modded settings in Halo 4, a weapon that kills in 4 shots in the 0.9-1.0 second range is ideal for 4v4 arena gameplay.  Not quite CE but faster than modern Halo.  This is assuming a relatively low aim assist though so players aren’t constantly hitting 4 shot kills.  

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40 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

I'm likely in the minority, but BTB 2.0 sounds like shit to me. 

Vehicular gameplay in halo multiplayer was always boring to me. Wish it was more mayhem style - 20 v 20 on smaller maps with no vehicles. 

BTB is dumb fun, kind of like call of duty. It's not competitive, because it's not meant to be competitive. 

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9 hours ago, Twis7ed said:

Sprint has been solved since Halo Reach. Just make it so you are sprinting at all times. Remove walking. Everyone is happy. 

actually this a good point that 343 is taking seriously with abilities. ( I  mean in vanilla reach) Reach was actually balanced in the sense that not everyone had sprint so the maps didn't ahve to be stretched to fuck to accommodate the sprinting nerds. No they had other abilities to choose from aside from sprint.

 

So I actually like 343's approach with the equipment this time around in that only ONE can be onplay at any given time. So you'll never run into two kids with grapple shot or w.e. I wish this was done for sprint, make sprint a pickup on the map that we fight over and it will ONLY be in play when one person uses it. Once they die the respawn timer resets

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5 minutes ago, znot said:

make sprint a pickup on the map that we fight over

Ew.  

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17 minutes ago, hvs500 said:

A low ttk on your utility weapon would make the power weapons undesirable ... 

Disagree. Power item control in CE, the halo game with the lowest TTKs, is extremely important.

I do favor fast TTKs in the range of a half second or so vs insta-kill guns like in Cod/CS/Valorant (all games which are much more successful & more populated than any Halo game released in the 2010's), but insta-kill level TTKs in halo would be a massive improvement over modern halo's design. 

 

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1 minute ago, Aphex Twin said:

Disagree. Power item control in CE, the halo game with the lowest TTKs, is extremely important.

I do favor fast TTKs in the range of a half second or so vs insta-kill guns like in Cod/CS/Valorant (all games which are much more successful & more populated than any Halo game released in the 2010's), but insta-kill level TTKs in halo would be a massive improvement over modern halo's design. 

 

CE has the ideal ttk, I admit that. My problem is with anything below the 0.6 range.

Why do you think that such low ttks would work?

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2 minutes ago, hvs500 said:

Why do you think that such low ttks would work?

Advanced movement. Running away from death is too effective in shooters with long TTKs. Really, the only scenario in which prolonging gunfights is when you have limited respawns (Apex).

It's interesting - modern Halo has chased all the hot trends, but could never compete against the very games it was feature-jacking.

TTK is the biggest difference between Halo and other popular shooters. I think players want to feel powerful in a shooter, and not being able to take out an opponent before they sprint/thrust/whatever away back to their teammates makes players feel weak. I'd argue this is why Halo has been relatively irrelevant over the past decade.

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38 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

Advanced movement. Running away from death is too effective in shooters with long TTKs. Really, the only scenario in which prolonging gunfights is when you have limited respawns (Apex).

 

I do agree that bad positioning should be punished, but I'd argue that similar results can be achieved by having CE's ttk

38 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

 

It's interesting - modern Halo has chased all the hot trends, but could never compete against the very games it was feature-jacking.

 

You know what's really interesting? The health-shield duality in halo. Halo's probably the only shooter that does that, besides half life death match. That can never be achieved when you die in a single hit.

 

38 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

TTK is the biggest difference between Halo and other popular shooters. I think players want to feel powerful in a shooter, and not being able to take out an opponent before they sprint/thrust/whatever away back to their teammates makes players feel weak. I'd argue this is why Halo has been relatively irrelevant over the past decade.

Having a low ttk =/= being powerful.

exhibit a- call of duty

exhibit b-  battlefield 

it's the difference between the average and the perfect ttk that matters.

 

Having a high ttk violates the very core principle of an arena shooter- seeking items across the map

The sandbox should never be sacrificed for a low ttk. Part of the reason why CE is such a strategic game is the weapons. Every one of them is distinct, with clear trade offs. Now imagine CE with only the pistols. Yes, it would take a lot of skill, but it would be dull as shit.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, hvs500 said:

You know what's really interesting? The health-shield duality in halo.

I feel like the only thing that Halo’s Shield+Health vitality system does at this point is nullify headshot bonuses prior to the final shot.  What advantages does Halo’s Shield+Health vitality system offer over a similar system with one large health-pool?

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13 minutes ago, Boyo said:

I feel like the only thing that Halo’s Shield+Health vitality system does at this point is nullify headshot bonuses prior to the final shot.  What advantages does Halo’s Health-Shield vitality system offer over a similar system with one large health-pool?

 Let's say somebody gets the overshield. Do you pepper it with your trusty pistol, or do you seek a plasma rifle, getting better odds against the enemy, but possibly endangering yourself? And now you're playing with a purpose, making conscious decisions. Damage types make you choose your tools wisely. That's one of the reasons why I'm optimistic about infinite.

 I do think that a headshot multiplier can be very well integrated into the shield mechanic.

 

 

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