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Halo Infinite Discussion

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49 minutes ago, Crimson said:

Yeah, you're gonna have to be specific on the CoD details here man cause they run 5+ second respawns in competitive there...

Cods max respawn time is 3 seconds in comp, unless that was changed 

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3 hours ago, Reamis25 said:

I mean it’s hardly fair that you should be allowed to kill me off spawn

I'd argue that it is fair for you to get spawn killed if your team allowed it to happen in the first place.

If you cant handle spawn killing though, I'd be fine with an approach which doesnt allow spawn killing to exist as long as we can spawn with a gun that has a perfect TTK of 0.6 seconds again.

Maybe that means enemy LOS plays a larger role in determining where you spawn, or maybe players get a 5 second Immunity after they spawn - doesnt matter as much as spawning with a gun that takes less than 4-5 shots to kill.

Narrows is a garbage map, possibly the worst that has ever been used in Halo tournaments. It was trash in H3, and would still be trash with H2 settings, CE settings, H5 settings, whatever.

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29 minutes ago, Aphex Twin said:

I'd argue that it is fair for you to get spawn killed if your team allowed it to happen in the first place.

If you cant handle spawn killing though, I'd be fine with an approach which doesnt allow spawn killing to exist as long as we can spawn with a gun that has a perfect TTK of 0.6 seconds again.

Maybe that means enemy LOS plays a larger role in determining where you spawn, or maybe players get a 5 second Immunity after they spawn - doesnt matter as much as spawning with a gun that takes less than 4-5 shots to kill.

Narrows is a garbage map, possibly the worst that has ever been used in Halo tournaments. It was trash in H3, and would still be trash with H2 settings, CE settings, H5 settings, whatever.

I think something like a 1 second of invincibility would be more appropriate but it goes away instantaneously the moment you start shooting. 

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Has a Gears of War style spawn system ever been considered for Halo?

Designated spawn zones.

Wave based spawning.

Limited spawn immunity. Ends on a timer or when you start shooting (don't think Gears has that last one, but still is a good idea).

It's a simple, effective system. Could be interesting to attempt. Only caveat is maps need to be specifically designed to account for it.

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8 hours ago, Cursed Lemon said:

*gets killed off spawn a lot*

"We need to nerf the utility weapon!!!"

Me: or we could fix the spawns

*Gets killed across map by H2 BR*

"We need to add RNG bullet spread!"

Or we could just keep projectile leading

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An arbitrary duration of invincibility off spawn is random and dumb as shit.  If safe spawning is really such a problem then add dedicated spawn rooms protected by one-way shield doors.  At least then there is an explanation for why the player cannot take damage.  

I half jokingly posted this but I really do believe that everything said here also applies to Halo.  Once you hear those three beeps, you are not safe.  

 

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20 hours ago, Reamis25 said:

I think something like a 1 second of invincibility would be more appropriate but it goes away instantaneously the moment you start shooting. 

I'd be perfectly okay with this. It's not long enough to where you can do anything cheesy with it or take undeserved ground like in Gears, but it's long enough to let you figure out where you are so you can fight back.  I'd give a visual cue on the player model to show the effect, like higher contrast or something.

14 hours ago, The Tyco said:

Has a Gears of War style spawn system ever been considered for Halo?

Designated spawn zones.

Wave based spawning.

Limited spawn immunity. Ends on a timer or when you start shooting (don't think Gears has that last one, but still is a good idea).

It's a simple, effective system. Could be interesting to attempt. Only caveat is maps need to be specifically designed to account for it.

Wave spawning is fucking dumb. If you die, you deserve the whole respawn time. If I kill you, I deserve that time to play the objective and take ground. No one should get a bailout just because they died at a convenient time.

The only games that could maybe get a pass on this are class-based attack/defend games like old school Wolfenstein for the OG Xbox. There was a Normandy Beach map that was super popular in that game where the Allies needed to storm the beach and plant dynamite by one of two walls, and then defend it from enemy engineers trying to defuse it until it exploded. Only the engineer class had dynamite, but all he had was a shotgun. He needed soldier/sniper/medic support. Spawning alone in games like that, where you're intrinsically dependent on your teammates, would be the only exception I can think of.
 

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Wave spawning is totally fine in games like Rising Storm 2. Realistic, big team fps games where collective team movement is the most prominent skill.

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1 hour ago, Mr Grim said:

games where collective team movement is the most prominent skill.

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In Invasion, one player on each team spawns with a ranged, sniper weapon.  How can we make sure each team’s designated sniper is not thumbless?  

For two weeks, players would hone their skills in a temporary Snipers playlist.  A player’s final rank becomes a heavily weighted value in the formula that determines who is spawned as the sniper in each Invasion match.  

The Elite sniper is followed by an AI Grunt.  Commands like go there, come here, behave aggressively, and behave defensively can be given.  The grunt sidekick acts as an early warning system and minor defense/support for a player focused on what’s down his scope.  

Each species’ sniper has a unique AI sidekick that follows them around:  

Spartan - Marine 

Elite - Grunt 

Brute - Engineer 

Promethean - Crawler

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15 hours ago, Hard Way said:

Wave spawning is fucking dumb. If you die, you deserve the whole respawn time. If I kill you, I deserve that time to play the objective and take ground. No one should get a bailout just because they died at a convenient time.

Wave spawning primary purpose is for coordinating team pushes, and typically has longer respawns. Dying is still a punishment, and I'd argue you factually have more time to push and play the objective. 

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1 hour ago, The Tyco said:

Wave spawning primary purpose is for coordinating team pushes, and typically has longer respawns. Dying is still a punishment, and I'd argue you factually have more time to push and play the objective. 

Of course you have more time to push and play the objective; you're getting bailed out of half of your respawn time on most of your deaths. The only way to make this happen less often is to make the full wave timer unbearably long when you catch all of it. It's just not worth including in non-classed based games.

I don't want the game to just hand you coordinated pushes. I think there's something to be said for having the discipline to wait for your team and actively give them a safe spawn.

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52 minutes ago, Hard Way said:

Of course you have more time to push and play the objective; you're getting bailed out of half of your respawn time on most of your deaths. The only way to make this happen less often is to make the full wave timer unbearably long when you catch all of it. It's just not worth including in non-classed based games.

I don't want the game to just hand you coordinated pushes. I think there's something to be said for having the discipline to wait for your team and actively give them a safe spawn.

Let's assume a wave spawn is 14 seconds and the timer starts the second a player dies.

This means a coordinated team that puts an enemy player down can push with far more aggression for longer, and fast multikills become far more impactful, especially in objective where every second counts.

For the respawning team, you get a passive coordinated team push. If you're one player down, and the wave timer started, your rewarded with a "faster" potential respawn if you play your life. Full team spawns also act as a deterrent for enemies overextending their push unto you, knowing that they're usually going to be facing down a full squad if they time it wrong.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with anything that improves team play, active or not, especially when high level players will typically coordinate anyway. Wave based spawning simply puts the burden of punishment on the entire team, not just an individual. A player that respawned "instantly" on the ass end of the spawn time, still needed a teammate to suffer the full time to do so, and still lost a position.

I'm just giving food for thought here, really. But wouldn't mind at least trying a gamemode or two outside of Gears to see if it plays well or not. It just presents a different feel for how a game plays.

 

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14 hours ago, Boyo said:

159108.gif?b64lines=

Bro straight up, never respond to me with a gif of the literal worst sport ever conceived again.

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Commanding Sidekicks with the D Pad 

In Invasion, each team has one player who spawns as the Commander.  Each commander has an AI sidekick that he issues orders to via the D pad.  

Down commands the sidekick to either go to the location you are aiming at or return and follow you.  Most sidekicks can only stand on the ground but the Promethean Crawler can also post up on walls.  While an Engineer is following his Chieftain, the player gains a recharging 2x Overshield.  

Left toggles the sidekick’s behavior between passive and aggressive.  A passive Marine will watch and callout enemies, only engaging once engaged or approached.  An aggressive Marine will shoot enemies on sight.  

Right has different functions depending on the species.  An Elite Field Marshall can command his Grunt sidekick to deploy suicide stickies while charging forward. 

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I really hope that Infinite's Reach influence ends at armor customization and art style. Halo isn't in a position where it can take Reach 2: Electric Boogaloo without the tiny remaining population disintegrating entirely and it going into a (likely permanent) period of dormancy. 

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17 minutes ago, _Synapse said:

I really hope that Infinite's Reach influence ends at armor customization and art style. Halo isn't in a position where it can take Reach 2: Electric Boogaloo without the tiny remaining population disintegrating entirely and it going into a (likely permanent) period of dormancy. 

I’m sure that’s all it’ll take. Here’s my dream version of halo infinite.

1. Armor customization of reach(confirmed already).

2. A social ranking like reach(you know with individual medals and grades$)

3. Division ranking as I don’t like 1-50 

4. No sprint, no abilities(but thruster would be ok)

5. Projectile shooting but hit reg close to games like battlefront, apex legends any other game that uses projectile shooting that has great hit reg.

6. Weapon balance similar to current h5 with tweaks. The starting utility is the strongest weapon of all by TTK standards. A perfect TTK of 0.9 or 1 second. 
7. A fast based movement speed similar to that of doom 4. 
8. No bloom, no spread on all precision weapons. 
9. Load outs and abilities for custom games ONLY unless a playlist that may have need of them.

10. Brutes and elites as playable. 

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On 6/18/2020 at 12:51 PM, Mr Grim said:

Wave spawning is totally fine in games like Rising Storm 2. Realistic, big team fps games where collective team movement is the most prominent skill.

Never played RS2 but played a couple hundreds hours of Red Orchestra 2 and RS1 and thoroughly enjoyed it.

Since Squad and Sandstorm released I haven't touched it though...

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12 hours ago, Boyo said:

Commanding Sidekicks with the D Pad 

In Invasion, each team has one player who spawns as the Commander.  Each commander has an AI sidekick that he issues orders to via the D pad.  

Down commands the sidekick to either go to the location you are aiming at or return and follow you.  Most sidekicks can only stand on the ground but the Promethean Crawler can also post up on walls.  While an Engineer is following his Chieftain, the player gains a recharging 2x Overshield.  

Left toggles the sidekick’s behavior between passive and aggressive.  A passive Marine will watch and callout enemies, only engaging once engaged or approached.  An aggressive Marine will shoot enemies on sight.  

Right has different functions depending on the species.  An Elite Field Marshall can command his Grunt sidekick to deploy suicide stickies while charging forward. 

Sounds like Halo 5's campaign or the newly released Disintegration. Pass

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I really, really hope that Infinite has a skillful utility weapon with a 0.9-1.2 second TTK. 

From 343i, we've received-

H4's Post-TU BR: 1.1 second TTK

H2A BR: 1.2 second TTK

H5 Magnum: 1.2 second TTK

So far, those are decent TTKs. Problem is that the only one from the 3 that even takes a slight amount of skill is the H5 magnum, and that game's trash aiming ruins it. 

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8 minutes ago, _Synapse said:

H4's Post-TU BR: 1.1 second TTK

That doesn’t sound right.  

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9 hours ago, Boyo said:

That doesn’t sound right.  

OG Halo 4's BR after the TU is a 1.3 Perfect Kill. In the MCC version, its original fire-rate was kept when it was a five burst kill, which in turn sped up its PKT by .2 seconds. A change not a lot of people noticed, but advocates that values in the games were editable long before they said they had the capability.

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