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Halo Infinite Discussion

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23 hours ago, a Chunk said:

Master Chief's armor should mask the sound of his footsteps.  They don't need to be completely silent, but I shouldn't sound like I have horseshoes on my feet.

Counter point to this argument: You can already purchase ear protection with built in sound amplification, Future Space armour would have a drastically improved version of this tech because enclosed helmet and you need to hear, so even if Spartan armour dampened the sound of its own footsteps, anyone else wearing the Spartan amour would have sound amplification that cancels that effect anyway.

26 minutes ago, My Namez BEAST said:

It's kinda weird to be against radar but for footsteps. It literally functions exactly like a radar. Play 1v1s and tell me how fun it is. Hell just watch 1v1s. You can barely move in most games because you're so loud. 

This isn't a BR where you have 90 other people all over the place. There's literally 4 people on maps with limited angles and LoS. If you're getting flanked you deserve the death. Lmao imagine dying to a flanker and getting mad he didn't make noise. Instead of being mad at your lack of awareness. 

Loud footsteps reward the camping player more every time. That's not even debatable. You wanna find someone? Actually find them lmao. 

 

Imagine being killed by someone camping in a corner and being mad that he heard you, instead of being mad at your lack of awareness because you didn't check the corner. Footsteps are a non-issue. The only reason anyone is debating them here is because 343 have ignored our feedback for so long that we are literally scraping the bottom of the barrel for things we can remove so that we can feel like 343 cares about us again. 

 

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Players should walk around in clown shoes.

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49 minutes ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

Counter point to this argument: You can already purchase ear protection with built in sound amplification, Future Space armour would have a drastically improved version of this tech because enclosed helmet and you need to hear, so even if Spartan armour dampened the sound of its own footsteps, anyone else wearing the Spartan amour would have sound amplification that cancels that effect anyway.

Imagine being killed by someone camping in a corner and being mad that he heard you, instead of being mad at your lack of awareness because you didn't check the corner. Footsteps are a non-issue. The only reason anyone is debating them here is because 343 have ignored our feedback for so long that we are literally scraping the bottom of the barrel for things we can remove so that we can feel like 343 cares about us again. 

 

That's not how this works man

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25 minutes ago, My Namez BEAST said:

That's not how this works man

It's exactly how this works. It's quite possibly the most pointless and inane debate since Boyo last had a suggestion. Footsteps are a non-issue. 

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1 hour ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

Imagine being killed by someone camping in a corner and being mad that he heard you, instead of being mad at your lack of awareness because you didn't check the corner. Footsteps are a non-issue. The only reason anyone is debating them here is because 343 have ignored our feedback for so long that we are literally scraping the bottom of the barrel for things we can remove so that we can feel like 343 cares about us again. 

 

This argument doesn't make any sense though. You can use the same exact logic but in relation to grenade hit-markers.

Quote

Imagine being killed by someone who discovered your location by throwing a random grenade into a room and being mad that he found you, instead of being mad at your lack of positioning because you didn't anticipate a grenade coming into the room.

This is the type of argument you just presented, and I'm pretty sure this forum unanimously agree that grenade hit-markers are absurd. You don't have to be camping in a corner for footsteps to be heard, it's the amount of information you get for doing absolutely nothing is why people have a problem with it. Me personally, I have amazing headphones so I scout out people constantly in almost every game that I play. I'm also fully aware of how ridiculous it can be though as well at times, because people will just spawn and I'll instantly know where they are.

Edit: That being said, this particular debate is not of my immediate interest lol, as the armor abilities and things of that nature are still on my... Radar.. (damn it...)

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2 hours ago, Killmachine said:

good one lemon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you win post of the night.

Don't step to me ever again

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40 minutes ago, Cursed Lemon said:

Don't step to me ever again

shut up lemon bitch

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Being for loud footsteps and against radar is hypocritical. They both are a form of radar. Ironically, it would make radar more fair because it wouldn't give headset users a clear advantage. 

If you try to argue realism over gameplay health, your argument should go in the trash where it rightfully belongs.

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42 minutes ago, The Tyco said:

Being for loud footsteps and against radar is hypocritical. They both are a form of radar. Ironically, it would make radar more fair because it wouldn't give headset users a clear advantage. 

If you try to argue realism over gameplay health, your argument should go in the trash where it rightfully belongs.

I sort of get where you guys are coming from. What baffles me, is that I've been here for a couple of years and I've never seen anyone complain about footsteps, so I'm fucking baffled why this is a problem now when the franchise has bigger issues which affect the game way more than some footsteps.

 

And doesn't crouch walking make footsteps silent anyway? If you want to flank and try and make that move which is going to result in a huge advantage, there should be some kind of trade off in doing so. You don't really want people in Infinite sprinting everywhere silently and sprinting up from behind and spartan charging you without any indication, and before you say make BMS silent and sprint make noise, than we are back at square one because we know maps are bloated in such a way that sprint is necessary to traverse, so you'll still hear everyone sprinting by. 

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1 hour ago, ChieftaiNZ said:

I sort of get where you guys are coming from. What baffles me, is that I've been here for a couple of years and I've never seen anyone complain about footsteps, so I'm fucking baffled why this is a problem now when the franchise has bigger issues which affect the game way more than some footsteps.

 

And doesn't crouch walking make footsteps silent anyway? If you want to flank and try and make that move which is going to result in a huge advantage, there should be some kind of trade off in doing so. You don't really want people in Infinite sprinting everywhere silently and sprinting up from behind and spartan charging you without any indication, and before you say make BMS silent and sprint make noise, than we are back at square one because we know maps are bloated in such a way that sprint is necessary to traverse, so you'll still hear everyone sprinting by. 

You're reading into it too much. Footstep noise was mostly a non factor in classic Halo games, considering most general gameplay noise drowned the sound out 95% of the time. It was only really problematic in 1v1 or really quiet stand offs. The argument so far is just maintaining the status quo.

I'm personally discussing it from a classically designed Halo standpoint, so I'm not really taking mobility mechanics into account. I just want to be able to move freely without radar or soundwhores strangling it. Wouldn't being forced to crouch to silence footsteps in classic Halo be exactly like sacrificing mobility mechanics to walk normally in modern Halo? You're sacrificing proper map movement, which is a negative to me.

In the context of mobility Halo, however, yeah, sound and/or radar is necessary in order to keep players from mindlessly charging each other. But it still technically strangles movement when those mechanics are required to effectively traverse the map.

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Good fucking lord, I can't believe I leave for like 2 years and its just the same nonsense as the H5:G thread.

Scrubs. :weback:

At least the site looks better. 

 

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1 hour ago, Devaneaux said:

Good fucking lord, I can't believe I leave for like 2 years and its just the same nonsense as the H5:G thread.

Scrubs. :weback:

At least the site looks better. 

 

 

Welcome back to Team Beyond, home of salt.

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3 hours ago, Devaneaux said:

Good fucking lord, I can't believe I leave for like 2 years and its just the same nonsense as the H5:G thread.

Scrubs. :weback:

At least the site looks better. 

 

And they got rid of that QuietMan idiot. 

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28 minutes ago, NeverGoFullCanc said:

And they got rid of that QuietMan idiot. 

Yeah... They did didn't they?

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2 hours ago, Mr Grim said:

Yeah... They did didn't they?

He's been awfully.. quiet, man.

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47 minutes ago, Basu said:

He's been awfully.. quiet, man.

Something tells me he's still here is spirit. Much like Cooper.

 

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On 2/17/2019 at 5:06 AM, -DeucEy- said:

Wrong.

Wrong.

And even more wrong.

There were quite literally no positives about any of those maps. The problems with those maps were accentuated in Doubles. i.e. Just sitting in a room waiting to get shot and throwing a regen down. Sitting in a room behind a shield waiting to mauler-melee someone. Etc. Etc.

P.S. Wrong quote.

I mean, what you described is an issue with the map pick ups not the maps themselves.

Except the Snowbound shields.

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46 minutes ago, Kell Of Scots said:

I mean, what you described is an issue with the map pick ups not the maps themselves.

Except the Snowbound shields.

Please elaborate as to what pickups you would put on Snowbound, Epitaph, or Cold Storage that would make them viable competitive maps in the context of Halo 3? The problems exist without said pickups, the maps aren’t structured in a way that promote movement in anyway shape or form, so I’m not exactly sure what you’re getting at. 

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2 hours ago, -DeucEy- said:

Please elaborate as to what pickups you would put on Snowbound, Epitaph, or Cold Storage that would make them viable competitive maps in the context of Halo 3? The problems exist without said pickups, the maps aren’t structured in a way that promote movement in anyway shape or form, so I’m not exactly sure what you’re getting at. 

I'm not saying the maps are competitively viable, nor am I saying the opposite.

I'm just pointing out that your given reasoning, besides Snowbound shields, had nothing to do with the level design itself.

You could put Reg... Invincibility Field on any map in any Halo game and it would lead to demonstrably dumb, unbalanced or otherwise broken encounters.

My point is, when criticising the Level Design, it would be best to use reasoning that actually pertains to the Level Design in question and not the easily interchangable map picks and their poor location on the map in question.

 

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37 minutes ago, Kell Of Scots said:

I'm not saying the maps are competitively viable, nor am I saying the opposite.

I'm just pointing out that your given reasoning, besides Snowbound shields, had nothing to do with the level design itself.

You could put Reg... Invincibility Field on any map in any Halo game and it would lead to demonstrably dumb, unbalanced or otherwise broken encounters.

My point is, when criticising the Level Design, it would be best to use reasoning that actually pertains to the Level Design in question and not the easily interchangable map picks and their poor location on the map in question.

 

I feel like you understood my post completely (everyone else seemed to), but decided to go out of your way to be pedantic to be honest. Regen and Bubble Shield were on The Pit and Heretic respectively, however, did you see anyone in the thread critiquing those? No, because they had nothing to do with my point. Nevertheless, fair enough.

For Epitaph and Snowbound in particular. Shield based doors are demonstrably bad ideas for a game like Halo. The same exact strategy is used for shield doors on both maps, where you're able to camp behind them with no penalty, nor any incentive to move because you're guaranteed at the very least a melee attack. This is compounded by the weapons on the map, such as regen/bubble shield/mauler/shotgun/etc, which make it even more broken. However, regardless of weapons/items shield based doors make for bad gameplay mechanics.

Shield doors aside Snowbound for example also suffers from two bad map design decisions. No man's land on top of the map and single entry hallways on the bottom. There's no incentive to move unless you're going for a pickup; I've played thousands of TS and Doubles games at Level 50 and they all play exactly the same with no variety whatsoever.

Cold Storage, again, this is a map that worked in CE due to fast kill times. In Halo 3, it's a rush to get Camo room control (regardless of Camo because I don't want you to think this is another pickup argument). You have overview of the entire map from this room and the adjacent hallway because you have a doorway that you can hide behind at anytime against a ramp (above OS) that can be grenaded very easily and you can get team shotted very easily against rockets. Conversely, you can get collapsed on very easily if you're pushing rocket side because of the visibility from Camo room. 

There's NOTHING competitive or viable about these maps, that's why most good players skipped those maps.

Yes, I can sit here and go into detail all day about why the maps are bad, however, I feel like they were generally understood at this point and didn't think I needed to clarify this for you. Again, there are plenty of other default maps that had power-ups and stupid weapons on them, however, they were never brought up because the problems of the map were not accentuated by them. 

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11 minutes ago, -DeucEy- said:

I feel like you understood my post completely (everyone else seemed to), but decided to go out of your way to be pedantic to be honest. Regen and Bubble Shield were on The Pit and Heretic respectively, however, did you see anyone in the thread critiquing those? No, because they had nothing to do with my point. Nevertheless, fair enough.

For Epitaph and Snowbound in particular. Shield based doors are demonstrably bad ideas for a game like Halo. The same exact strategy is used for shield doors on both maps, where you're able to camp behind them with no penalty, nor any incentive to move because you're guaranteed at the very least a melee attack. This is compounded by the weapons on the map, such as regen/bubble shield/mauler/shotgun/etc, which make it even more broken. However, regardless of weapons/items shield based doors make for bad gameplay mechanics.

Shield doors aside Snowbound for example also suffers from two bad map design decisions. No man's land on top of the map and single entry hallways on the bottom. There's no incentive to move unless you're going for a pickup; I've played thousands of TS and Doubles games at Level 50 and they all play exactly the same with no variety whatsoever.

Cold Storage, again, this is a map that worked in CE due to fast kill times. In Halo 3, it's a rush to get Camo room control (regardless of Camo because I don't want you to think this is another pickup argument). You have overview of the entire map from this room and the adjacent hallway because you have a doorway that you can hide behind at anytime against a ramp (above OS) that can be grenaded very easily and you can get team shotted very easily against rockets. Conversely, you can get collapsed on very easily if you're pushing rocket side because of the visibility from Camo room. 

There's NOTHING competitive or viable about these maps, that's why most good players skipped those maps.

Yes, I can sit here and go into detail all day about why the maps are bad, however, I feel like they were generally understood at this point and didn't think I needed to clarify this for you. Again, there are plenty of other default maps that had power-ups and stupid weapons on them, however, they were never brought up because the problems of the map were not accentuated by them. 

 

I don't disagree with any of that, I just think its important to be thorough with criticisms.

Any idiot can read it and go "blah blah blah, this is why you are wrong, blah blah blah" even when you are correct but you made the point poorly.

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Cold storage on h1(chill out) plays different for many reasons. 1. Fast TTK. 2. The map is significantly wider on CE. And 3. The jump mechanics of h1 also a decent game changer. Heck’s h1s movement system in general is weird but that’s because of the crappy animations of it more or less. H3 doubles ahh the biggest camp fest ever. Even so I think one way to make doubles faster paced is the removal of radar. Now we go back to see sound whore topic. Sound whoring simply lets you know an opponent is around you, you now need to do 2 things. Pin point where around you they’re at, and you need to know if this is your teammate or not(although in some games like fortnite your enemy sounds are higher) sound whore and radar are completely different, one slows down the game where the other doesn’t . Now in terms of camping they need to be completely still or otherwise you’d hear them move and now their position is blown and an easy Grenade is all you’ll need at that point. And one thing to note is sound whoring is mostly a negative issue in 1v1s whom most don’t do. Sorry to you people who do those but no one gives a fuck about you. Halo is about team play not 1v1s. 

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On 3/7/2019 at 1:05 PM, Ling Ling said:

-Snip-

Lowkey, sorry for the late response, but I accidentally deleted my own quote while shifting pages and quoting and responding to other things. Hahaa, shout out to paragraphs done over days being gone. I'm not even gonna bother rewriting (Not that it's not worth it, I'm just exhausted and even my own convictions aren't worth getting over that), but I didn't wanna ghost you.

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You know, I wouldn't mind the absence of loud footsteps if only because it'd mean that I wouldn't have to put on headphones in order to play as efficiently as possible. I'd much rather just listen to music or a podcast. 

But I guess you'd still have to if you wanted to communicate with team mates.

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