Jump to content
CyReN

Halo Infinite Discussion

Recommended Posts

14 minutes ago, Mow said:

Would you not be interested in trying to 'fix' Slayer if you could, maybe even with the use of utility only settings?

Just feels like a lost cause. It's always gonna be the worst comp mode so we just play what we really enjoy. Always down to try new shit though. Was always just more of a "we finally got a lobby let's just play the best shit" kinda thing 

Share this post


Link to post

FFA in general shouldn’t have power weapons or powerups anyway. It should just be about pure gunskill averaged over tons of encounters. Maybe if other weapons took more skill to use it would be fine.

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, My Namez BEAST said:

My man could barely go pos against h4 bots in social but I'm supposed to think it's just an H5 thing. LMAO. 

Whatcha referring to?

Share this post


Link to post
25 minutes ago, Boyo said:

Utility only slayer with two flags and a hill.  Capping the flag gives you a rocket launcher and standing in the hill charges an Overshield.

I mean if it has 2 flags is it even Slayer at that point? But besides that I do think that Team Slayer and FFA Slayer can be fixed whilst still retaining the main objective of 'Kill the other team to win' I don't think it has to be purely utility weapons only though as that seemingly circumvents the real problems, poor sandbox and map design, which has implications reaching far deeper than simple Slayer. That being said I also don't think utility only settings are a bad place to start.

16 minutes ago, My Namez BEAST said:

Just feels like a lost cause. It's always gonna be the worst comp mode so we just play what we really enjoy. Always down to try new shit though. Was always just more of a "we finally got a lobby let's just play the best shit" kinda thing 

I don't belive Slayer has to be bad, and I'm interested in exploring ways to make it into an actual compelling gamemode, I don't imagine you guys would have stopped at utility weapons only if you had the option/freedom to actually change the things you dislike about the sandbox (or things beyond that for that matter), obviously Halo on console has never really had that kind of freedom to modify the games, and so the next best option would be to simply remove everything that is unfavorable to the gameplay, much like the Evolved Settings, and I imagine the Utility only settings too.

There's many people here (and in the community in general) that have interesting idea's, and I'd like to see people put their idea's to the test instead of them being either something you 'believe' or something you don't. For many of us this is simply a hobby at the end of the day and shouldn't be taken as seriously as we sometimes take it, especially considering none of us really have the means to back up what we say, fully, yet. I'm hoping soon enough we can transition from talking about the same subjects in circles to actually testing and evolving our opinions on Halo.

Share this post


Link to post
9 minutes ago, Mow said:

I don't belive Slayer has to be bad, and I'm interested in exploring ways to make it into an actual compelling gamemode.

I have an idea. How about for starters we make it 2v2. We give you complete control of your partner’s spawn. We spawn you with a utility that has the ability to kill quickly but on average takes around twice as long to kill with than the minimum time to kill. We have a simple sand box with niche weapons that aren’t just replicas of your starting weapon but put on easy mode. Next we place power ups on the map that are strong enough to incentivize player movement and engagement. Then we have those power ups spawn at fixed times in different locations with relatively short intervals between spawns. Call me crazy but I think it might just work. In fact I think it could be so competitive that a team of two could not only never lose a tournament but never drop a game. I guess we’ll probably never know though.

  • Like (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

What about a Obj/Slayer mix? 

Like 2 flag, but each flag cap rewards you 50 points, but to win the match you need 150 points. Kills reward +1 to score. 
Maybe Oddball/Hill where you get 3 points for every second on/with hill/ball and +1 for every kill with 500 points to win. 

  • Like (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Reach had Flag Slayer.  It was fun.

  • Like (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, LI Mr X IL said:

I have an idea. How about for starters we make it 2v2. We give you complete control of your partner’s spawn. We spawn you with a utility that has the ability to kill quickly but on average takes around twice as long to kill with than the minimum time to kill. We have a simple sand box with niche weapons that aren’t just replicas of your starting weapon but put on easy mode. Next we place power ups on the map that are strong enough to incentivize player movement and engagement. Then we have those power ups spawn at fixed times in different locations with relatively short intervals between spawns. Call me crazy but I think it might just work. In fact I think it could be so competitive that a team of two could not only never lose a tournament but never drop a game. I guess we’ll probably never know though.

Well that works for 2v2 sure, but that wasn't what anyone here was really talking about. 4v4 Slayer has always had problems, Ironically even more so in CE than in some of the other titles, this is mostly because of the spawn system but that brings me on to another important point, we shouldn't force gamemodes to be similar just for the sake of it, 2v2 has suffered since H2 because of the focus on a more friendly spawn system for higher player counts, ideally 2v2 and 4v4 Slayer should have completely different spawn systems so that both can reach their potential independently instead of forcing some kind of 'unity' in the settings and essentially watering down both experiences. I never brought into the idea that we need unified settings (not that that's what you're arguing for, I understand where your post is coming from, just using your post as a stepping stone to make another point), If people can handle team snipers, swat, infection, invasion, warzone, etc. I'm sure they can deal with  gamemodes being optimized for their respective playlist, imo 2v2, 4v4 and FFA should all play differently, e.g. weapon balance and damage is all the same but things like the spawn system, spawn points and weapon spawns/timers would all be optimized respectively.

  • Like (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post

I really like the way Apex Legends does its "Elite" matchmaking. No complicated ranking mathematics to run through, if you place top-5 in a match you go into Elite and if you don't continue to place top-5, you fall out. 

Of course that can't work straight up with 2-team Halo, but I wonder if there's a creative way to implement something similar. 

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Cursed Lemon said:

I really like the way Apex Legends does its "Elite" matchmaking. No complicated ranking mathematics to run through, if you place top-5 in a match you go into Elite and if you don't continue to place top-5, you fall out. 

Of course that can't work straight up with 2-team Halo, but I wonder if there's a creative way to implement something similar. 

If im understanding this correctly I'm pretty sure ranked ffa playlists have had this in the past where if you place in the top 4 out of 8 you rank up. However, I don't see this working well with team based objective game types in halo as it would most likely encourage people to stat whore.

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Cursed Lemon said:

I really like the way Apex Legends does its "Elite" matchmaking. No complicated ranking mathematics to run through, if you place top-5 in a match you go into Elite and if you don't continue to place top-5, you fall out. 

Of course that can't work straight up with 2-team Halo, but I wonder if there's a creative way to implement something similar. 

Would be awesome in a BTB Clan match setting! Or I suppose just a regular Warzone queue.

Share this post


Link to post

There’s literally nothing wrong with division ranking you know, it’s just 343 did it poorly in h5. 

Share this post


Link to post
14 hours ago, Hard Way said:

@TheIcePrincess, I don’t have an hour to dissect this post, but I do want to address one thing. You misinterpreted what I said. I was not implying you’re incompetent. I’ve played with you enough that you can rest easy that I wouldn’t say that. I don’t believe that. I said you were being disingenuous about describing something you don’t like, and competent players know how much you’re exaggerating. So slow your roll on that.

Maybe over my lunch break or something I’ll give that post more time, but right now I have no more to give (drill weekend).

I'll be waiting, then, given my issues weren't just on that potential implication. Not that I want to argue, but I'd rather not leave the meat of my topic untouched or ignored and have something ultimately pointless being the only thing addressed. Put a lot of time into it for a reason.

Share this post


Link to post
10 hours ago, Mow said:

Well that works for 2v2 sure, but that wasn't what anyone here was really talking about. 4v4 Slayer has always had problems, Ironically even more so in CE than in some of the other titles, this is mostly because of the spawn system but that brings me on to another important point, we shouldn't force gamemodes to be similar just for the sake of it, 2v2 has suffered since H2 because of the focus on a more friendly spawn system for higher player counts, ideally 2v2 and 4v4 Slayer should have completely different spawn systems so that both can reach their potential independently instead of forcing some kind of 'unity' in the settings and essentially watering down both experiences. I never brought into the idea that we need unified settings (not that that's what you're arguing for, I understand where your post is coming from, just using your post as a stepping stone to make another point), If people can handle team snipers, swat, infection, invasion, warzone, etc. I'm sure they can deal with  gamemodes being optimized for their respective playlist, imo 2v2, 4v4 and FFA should all play differently, e.g. weapon balance and damage is all the same but things like the spawn system, spawn points and weapon spawns/timers would all be optimized respectively.

Oh I agree. I get that most people are talking about slayer in a 4v4 context but there’s no rule that says Halo has to be played 4v4 or that it’s the most competitive way to play. It just leaves a sour taste in my mouth that people will paint slayer with a broad stroke as not being a competitively viable mode when we have a shining example of the depth and competitiveness that slayer can offer in the original frickin Halo. I would love nothing more than for infinite to have a 2v2 mode designed specifically for slayer and a 4v4 mode designed for objective. If it offers a 2v2 slayer experience that is on par with CE I can care less if slayer is completely removed from the 4v4 playlist. We don’t have to figure out how to make slayer work in 4v4. We KNOW it works in 2v2 given the right sandbox and settings.

@TheIcePrincess My bad. From now on I’ll quote you. My remarks aren’t meant to mock you so much as mock your argument. I actually think you and @My Namez BEAST are probably pretty decent players who would be fun to play against. You’re clearly competitive minded players who back up what you think on some well reasoned principles. I respect your emphasis of needing a 100% consistent utility for competitive play I just disagree on its primacy as the most important factor. I also think we place a different emphasis on some pretty important things. You seem to place a ton of emphasis on the importance of movement and aiming in individual gun battles. There’s nothing wrong with that but I think myself and maybe @Hard Way place more emphasis on the mental aspect of it and the variety of mind games that CE slayer offers. If I empathize with you and place my emphasis on movement and gunskill I can see how OS is cheap. However if I place my emphasis on the mental aspect then when I see “surprise! surprise! You run into OS...” I can’t help but think that it’s an excuse for a bad play call, ESPECIALLY in the context of CE doubles. In a game where you have one partner, only two opponents and at most three power items to track “running into” anything is just a flaw in your gameplay and needs to be worked on. Map movement prediction and thinking a step ahead of your opponent is what makes great CE players. Some players are really good at those things and even if they don’t have the best mechanical game in the world they can still dominate the game. That’s part of what made the Ogres such a dominate force in CE. It’s not that they aren’t mechanically gifted, because obviously they are, but they don’t have to be able to snipe or slay out like Royal2 to be the GOATS in that game. It was their play making decisions that made them an unstoppable force. That’s what draws me to CE as a competitive shooter. The shooting skill gap is still there (quite arguably still the largest in the series) which is obviously important for a competitive FPS but it also plays in such a way that if you can predict and outsmart your opponent you can wipe the floor with people who are otherwise much more mechanically gifted than you. Look, I get it. I played H5 competitively before I got into competitive CE. I do thoroughly enjoy the individual gunfights present in H5 with the magnum. In fact when most of my friends finally stopped playing H5 and I didn’t have people to play ranked with one of my guilty pleasures was just playing entire  warzone matches with nothing but a default magnum and shitting on people with weapons which were clearly both stronger than mine and easier to use. That being said, the fun eventually faded and at some point I went back to MCC and gave competitive CE a shot and a switch flipped. Sure there were plenty of shit games with randoms that I just got trounced on in and didn’t have fun but the games where all the players were on equal skill levels and trying to win I had way more fun than I had ever had playing any game of 4v4 objective in H5. Before that point I would have agreed that slayer as a competitive mode sucked and should just be removed but afterwards I couldn’t disagree any more. As time went on and I worked on my game and learned the nuances of it I really became to think that CE is the most balanced and competitive Halo and possibly one of if not the most competitive FPS available on console to this day. I’m not just some purist with nostalgia goggles on. You don’t have to like it. If it isn’t your cup of tea that’s fine. Just don’t act like it isn’t competitively viable when there’s plenty enough evidence to the contrary.

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
10 hours ago, Cursed Lemon said:

I really like the way Apex Legends does its "Elite" matchmaking. No complicated ranking mathematics to run through, if you place top-5 in a match you go into Elite and if you don't continue to place top-5, you fall out. 

Of course that can't work straight up with 2-team Halo, but I wonder if there's a creative way to implement something similar. 

That's easy. Make it time based instead. Win games within a certain time frame to move up.

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, LI Mr X IL said:

 My bad. From now on I’ll quote you. My remarks aren’t meant to mock you so much as mock your argument. 

That's cool. But actually argue the post over trying to devalue them with mockery. As much as we may disagree, or inherently clash with viewpoints, it's pretty cockish. More so because I'm not doing it to you. Dunno why you would to me when I don't actually show you ill will. Not that I want to patronize you, it's whatever in the end. I just want a good place to talk.

Doesn't really just go to you, either.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

When we say slayer is bad we are always specifically mentioning 4v4 and have said we never are talking about CE. I understand that 2v2 CE slayer is the way to play the game. But we have mentioned previously that nothing we ever post relates to CE unless we specifically specify it. And yea we understand what you like. And why you like it. We know what a game like CE adds to the meta. We also know what it takes away. The issue mainly arose because many people here kept shitting on what the game would play like with pistol only. When all we stated was that was the way we enjoy the game. Believe me we know all about the mental games and depth to both systems. We just prefer what we prefer. And are more than okay with you enjoying what you do. There's just no need to get so condescending and mocking to the way we enjoy the game. I know it's a "trust us we know bro" kinda deal but we do know about the depth each game has. And overall it's just mainly a preference. Which we have tried to say. 

And as far as the last sentence again, when we say things about slayer it's in the context of 4v4 from H2 on. We know it's a competitively viable mode especially in 2v2. We just weren't reffering to anything past comp 4s. 

 

  • Upvote (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post
18 minutes ago, TheIcePrincess said:

That's cool. But actually argue the post over trying to devalue them with mockery. As much as we may disagree, or inherently clash with viewpoints, it's pretty cockish. More so because I'm not doing it to you. Dunno why you would to me when I don't actually show you ill will. Not that I want to patronize you, it's whatever in the end. I just want a good place to talk.

Doesn't really just go to you, either.

Fair enough.

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, My Namez BEAST said:

We know what a game like CE adds to the meta. We also know what it takes away.

What does a game like CE add to, and take away from, the meta?

Share this post


Link to post

Sick af 2v2 slayer, decent jump mechanics

  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Downvote (-1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Boyo said:

What does a game like CE add to, and take away from, the meta?

CE doesn’t play well via objective, mostly because the spawning and overall map design doesn’t allow it too. If we’re looking at ice and beasts perspective, it takes away the level of consistency they desire from a shooter(h5 magnum hitscan, 100% accurate based on reticule placement) , jumps are delayed and aren’t fast or precise like h2> so the maps could play maybe different with that change. 

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, OG Nick said:

Sick af 2v2 slayer, decent jump mechanics

I hate the jumping in CE.

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Scoping is a simple way to enhance a player’s vision.

Are there any other types of “enhanced vision” modes you think could work in Halo?

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.