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Halo Championship Series 2018 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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The numbers you're saying are just incorrect

You are forgetting how big H3 was, there were 1.5 millions online players the first weekend. H3 was the “fortnite” of 07-08

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You are forgetting how big H3 was, there were 1.5 millions online players the first weekend. H3 was the “fortnite” of 07-08

 

I wanna agree but no. You can't compare fortnites numbers to any halo cos it's nowhere near close. 

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I wanna agree but no. You can't compare fortnites numbers to any halo cos it's nowhere near close.

For the time period and cultural relevance yea I can say they are pretty similar. Halo was EVERYWHERE back then and it was at a time where gaming was nowhere near as big. Relatively speaking yea they're very similar. Obviously Fortnite is bigger I general but this is a much different time.
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For the time period and cultural relevance yea I can say they are pretty similar. Halo was EVERYWHERE back then and it was at a time where gaming was nowhere near as big. Relatively speaking yea they're very similar. Obviously Fortnite is bigger I general but this is a much different time.

 

I was there man I remember. I still think comparing them side by side like that is just reaching a bit. 

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I was there man I remember. I still think comparing them side by side like that is just reaching a bit. 

Side by side, no. You have to consider them relative to their eras

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I wanna agree but no. You can't compare fortnites numbers to any halo cos it's nowhere near close.

Well yeah Fortnite is in the Twitch era, everything blows up today. Back when H3 released I couldn’t even watch the MLG stream live because I had 256 kb connection.

Back then Halo was a cultural phenomenon remember Big Bang Theory “its Halo night”.

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Side by side, no. You have to consider them relative to their eras

Yea it's like comparing money from different eras. Gotta adjust for inflation. 

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I know that saying anything bad about H3 is sacrilege in this forum, but can you explain yourself?

 

Since when has this been true.... people bash on specific issues with Halo 3 all the time.  Equipment, random spread, hit detection, narrow FoV, dynamic weapon spawns, slow kill times, lazy strafe, playlist management.  But its population was NEVER something to complain about.

 

You are forgetting how big H3 was, there were 1.5 millions online players the first weekend. H3 was the “fortnite” of 07-08

 

That doesn't make an individual playlist population number that was reached maybe a handful of times "count".  And the game didn't launch with an MLG playlist so that 1.5 million launch weekend number is irrelevant when talking about MLG population.  I remember that playlist regularly having about 3,000 players in it. Maybe it hit 10k right when it was first added for like a day. 

 

And i know that this is the competitive halo forum, but when talking about a games health we really need to take a look at the game as a whole not just a single playlist, especially not one that has never been popular (not because its bad, but because Bungie intentionally made it sound scary).  Yeah, the MLG playlist probably would have been abysmal for a while after reach came out just like everything else. Everybody jumped ship for a while to try reach and i remember jumping back to Halo 3 after a couple weeks of dealing with Reach's bullshit and still being able to find games in any playlist within a couple minutes. It's population had rebounded which is UNHEARD OF for console games once a direct sequel launches.  The only console game that might be able to compete with Halo 3's population longevity might be Black Ops 2.

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Since when has this been true.... people bash on specific issues with Halo 3 all the time. Equipment, random spread, hit detection, narrow FoV, dynamic weapon spawns, slow kill times, lazy strafe, playlist management. But its population was NEVER something to complain about.

 

 

That doesn't make an individual playlist population number that was reached maybe a handful of times "count". And the game didn't launch with an MLG playlist so that 1.5 million launch weekend number is irrelevant when talking about MLG population. I remember that playlist regularly having about 3,000 players in it. Maybe it hit 10k right when it was first added for like a day.

 

And i know that this is the competitive halo forum, but when talking about a games health we really need to take a look at the game as a whole not just a single playlist, especially not one that has never been popular (not because its bad, but because Bungie intentionally made it sound scary). Yeah, the MLG playlist probably would have been abysmal for a while after reach came out just like everything else. Everybody jumped ship for a while to try reach and i remember jumping back to Halo 3 after a couple weeks of dealing with Reach's bullshit and still being able to find games in any playlist within a couple minutes. It's population had rebounded which is UNHEARD OF for console games once a direct sequel launches. The only console game that might be able to compete with Halo 3's population longevity might be Black Ops 2.

I’m pretty sure that by the end of 2010 MLG was not selling 256 team passes

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Well yeah Fortnite is in the Twitch era, everything blows up today. Back when H3 released I couldn’t even watch the MLG stream live because I had 256 kb connection.

Back then Halo was a cultural phenomenon remember Big Bang Theory “its Halo night”.

 

I used to watch MLG live in 240p LOL.

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I’m pretty sure that by the end of 2010 MLG was not selling 256 team passes

They were selling enough......  Just because a population has gone down from its peak, does not mean its bad.  It was still really fucking good all the way through and after Reach came out.  Thats the only point anybody is trying to make here.

 

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Halo 3 was still getting close to 300k on the in-game player count until Reach came out. Its longevity throughout multiple COD titles was really impressive and it always stayed in the top 3 most played Xbox games. MLG playlist usually had around 3k in that year.

 

There is no comparison between the population health of Year 3 H5 and H3, none at all. There was actually a time where 3 years of a Halo game wasn't a problem. The original comment that "no one was playing H3 by the end of 2010" is only correct if you consider after Reach's release, in which case it would be obvious that the game would have significantly less players after the release of the new Halo game and there was no need to even make that comment.

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Halo 3 was still getting close to 300k on the in-game player count until Reach came out. Its longevity throughout multiple COD titles was really impressive and it always stayed in the top 3 most played Xbox games. MLG playlist usually had around 3k in that year.

 

There is no comparison between the population health of Year 3 H5 and H3, none at all. There was actually a time where 3 years of a Halo game wasn't a problem. The original comment that "no one was playing H3 by the end of 2010" is only correct if you consider after Reach's release, in which case it would be obvious that the game would have significantly less players after the release of the new Halo game and there was no need to even make that comment.

What I’m saying is that not even H3 could have sustained a Healthy scene for a 4th year, MLG Raleigh had 48 teams the same we have at H5 LANs now.
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They were selling enough......  Just because a population has gone down from its peak, does not mean its bad.  It was still really fucking good all the way through and after Reach came out.  Thats the only point anybody is trying to make here.

 

Where did Moses get that data from? MLG Raleigh for example had 272 teams, so more events are probably incorrect too.

 

 

What I’m saying is that not even H3 could have sustained a Healthy scene for a 4th year, MLG Raleigh had 48 teams the same we have at H5 LANs now.

Check above.

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What I’m saying is that not even H3 could have sustained a Healthy scene for a 4th year, MLG Raleigh had 48 teams the same we have at H5 LANs now.

A 130 team drop doesn't happen naturally across a 2 month period. Reach was a month away from release and they had just announced a format change in which DC became a limited team event that needed to be qualified for. There may have been another format change which helped cause this decline too.

 

You can't make any predictions about a hypothetical 4th year of Halo 3 without Reach based on information that was a month before Reach's release.

 

Edit: and apparently that Raleigh number is wrong actually which demonstrates what we are trying to say. My post explains DCs attendance though.

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If I remember correctly, MLG Raleigh 2010 was like 1-2 weeks before Reach's release date, so a lot of players and teams (myself included) pretty much thought it was pointless to spend the money on flights, team passes, hotels, etc. to only play the game for another week or so before the new iteration came out.

 

The next event in DC was the first event for Halo: Reach, and was a combine for amateurs only, that gave players a HUGE incentive to want to go and make a name for themselves.  Notable players finishing in the top 8 teams included Lethul (1), Blaze (1), Calm Mentality (2), Swift Kill (2), Cratos (4), and Ninja (5).

 

Numbers don't give the whole story and there are always extra variables that need to be considered.  H3 would have continued to succeed as a game overall based on sheer XBL population numbers, and simply discussing one playlist or the competitive community's interest in the game doesn't paint an accurate picture of how popular H3 still was three years after its release.

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Saying Fortnite is the H3 of this era is fair, but it also is severely underrating the impact of Fortnite. If you're trying to compare across the decade that separates them, you need to look beyond numbers alone. In truth, H3 didn't have anywhere close to the same cultural permittivity as Fortnite even for it's time. Not because there were fewer people playing it but because the pool of people who CAN play it are so much different. As big as the 360 was at the time, it's still just one platform, and it still cost 60 bucks plus however much XBL was back then to play it. Fortnite is on every single console and platform available, for free. It is a top 10 trending topic on twitter pretty much daily and it gets weekly exposure on almost every major news site.

 

Beyond the public perception, Fortnite is changing the game dev world more than any game in recent history. Besides just pushing the Battle Royale genre, it has changed the way a lot of games are choosing to push content. Over the next few years I would expect to see an exponential number of games switch to a low barrier of entry and a games-as-a-service model. Say what you will about H3 but it held to the model of the time, of high upfront costs with periodic paid updates over time, and that model didn't really change on console for 5 years after. On the more technical side of things, Fortnite's development at Epic has benefitted game development as a whole. Their experience pushing the same code to multiple platforms has resulted in tools that they are pushing out to Unreal Engine to make multi platform development easier for many devs. This potentially includes Halo, as the slipspace engine is allegedly built on Unreal Engine.

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Saying Fortnite is the H3 of this era is fair, but it also is severely underrating the impact of Fortnite. If you're trying to compare across the decade that separates them, you need to look beyond numbers alone. In truth, H3 didn't have anywhere close to the same cultural permittivity as Fortnite even for it's time. Not because there were fewer people playing it but because the pool of people who CAN play it are so much different. As big as the 360 was at the time, it's still just one platform, and it still cost 60 bucks plus however much XBL was back then to play it. Fortnite is on every single console and platform available, for free. It is a top 10 trending topic on twitter pretty much daily and it gets weekly exposure on almost every major news site.

 

Beyond the public perception, Fortnite is changing the game dev world more than any game in recent history. Besides just pushing the Battle Royale genre, it has changed the way a lot of games are choosing to push content. Over the next few years I would expect to see an exponential number of games switch to a low barrier of entry and a games-as-a-service model. Say what you will about H3 but it held to the model of the time, of high upfront costs with periodic paid updates over time, and that model didn't really change on console for 5 years after. On the more technical side of things, Fortnite's development at Epic has benefitted game development as a whole. Their experience pushing the same code to multiple platforms has resulted in tools that they are pushing out to Unreal Engine to make multi platform development easier for many devs. This potentially includes Halo, as the slipspace engine is allegedly built on Unreal Engine.

 

Uhh, what?  With just licensing considerations, there is no way that is true and i want a source for that lol.  If they were going to base it off Unreal, they would just license Unreal and use that engine and we would have a gameplay demo and beta date already.

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Uhh, what?  With just licensing considerations, there is no way that is true and i want a source for that lol.  If they were going to base it off Unreal, they would just license Unreal and use that engine and we would have a gameplay demo and beta date already.

 

There were a couple rumors floating around right after E3. I said allegedly there is no source other than what I've heard. Not using the engine outright would have a lot to do with the exact needs of Infinite and licensing wouldn't be an issue if 343 basically started with Unreal APIs and rewrote them all themselves. No engine is truly built "from the ground up" nowadays. They are far too complicated and expansive for a studio like 343, which has about 400 employees, only a fraction of which are software engineers.

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Is there no longer a custom game browser planned for MCC?

 

It is planned but it is not in the scope of the first public update to MCC. In my opinion it makes more sense to push off the release of the update until they have everything they want to add completed and wait till closer to Christmas to launch a public rerelease campaign. Maybe then they could attach it to some Halo Infinite news as well.

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