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BF 4 beating Ghosts?! that's unusual

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That's just an opinion/preference. I have no problem with FPS's on consoles. 

 

I think the biggest complaint that has now been fixed was the number of people one each team. It will be the same as the PC so it's all G now.

 

 

Treyarch = good cause they make a game that is good for the competitive community. The changing the setting thing is just a gimmick.

I only play FPSs on Consoles, but if you play CoD or Halo then go and play Battlefield it just feels clunky. 

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I only play FPSs on Consoles, but if you play CoD or Halo then go and play Battlefield it just feels clunky.

 

I unno, like i said it's preference. To be honest i thought you were just rippin on FPS's on consoles like most PC gamers do. But yeah like i said, it feels fine for me going from Halo to BF.

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I unno, like i said it's preference. To be honest i thought you were just rippin on FPS's on consoles like most PC gamers do. But yeah like i said, it feels fine for me going from Halo to BF.

I dont even have anything close to a gaming PC haha 

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I dont even have anything close to a gaming PC haha

I have a gaming laptop and it sucks. One of the reasons why i prefer console gaming.

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BF4 brought back commander mode and you can do it from a tablet which is awesome.  I know I'm gonna be on the iPad playing as commander while my wife watches TV.

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BF4 brought back commander mode and you can do it from a tablet which is awesome.  I know I'm gonna be on the iPad playing as commander while my wife watches TV.

Can you use your smart phone or does it have to be a tablet?

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Treyarch = good cause they make a game that is good for the competitive community. The changing the setting thing is just a gimmick.

 

The gimmick is not only working, it's real. Vonderhaar actually went out of his way to help competitive gaming.  

 

What does girls playing it have to do with anything? These "girls"(not all girls) who play CoD play it cause it's easy and it's the "cool" thing. They aren't "gamers" like us. Yes they have fun cause they can actually get a kill without needing to actually learn to aim like in Halo, Quake or Counter Strike. So it's popular.. cool Justin Bieber is popular, doesn't meant he's good. That popularity thing is an invalid argument.

 

So they're not allowed to play games because they're not like us and don't play for the same reasons we play? So does the same apply to other sports? If you aren't trying to actively get into the NBA, then you can't play a pickup game of Bball for fun?

 

I'm judging it as if i know better? How so? I know that gamers are now suckers. Lol look at the new Metro game. You have to pre-order the game or pay extra to play their mode or as they call it "the way it's suppose to be played". Shit like this is not good for us. Go ahead, you have no problem with spending extra money when you don't need to, fine. Doesn't change the fact that you just said you don't mind taking it in the ass by big corps. Having a job has nothing to do with it, i'm not complaining cause i can't afford, i'm complaining cause they're ripping us off. Games are getting worse and worse, easier and easier. CoD is one of those reasons. Video games were already huge before CoD so i have nothing to thank CoD for. LoL is even bigger than CoD and that game is free. I don't like LoL, but atleast they aren't mkaing the same game every year and charging you $60 for it.

 

You thinking that gamers are suckers doesn't make it factual. That's your opinion and you're more than welcome to it, but spouting it as fact is just nonsense. I agree about Metro, that's a bad idea and bad for gaming. However, we are talking about COD and as of yet, they don't do that, so that's besides the point and a different argument entirely. I don't have an issue with spending the money. I don't feel that I am being taken advantage of or else I would do something about it. Your opinion of how I am being treated as a gamer is your opinion, but once again not factual. I think games are just evolving in a different way than you realize. The amount of time spent on development has shrunk and it mostly due to publishers wanting to get a product out there. For the amount of time spent on development + time I spend playing their game, I feel they do a pretty decent job. Especially compared to how Halo has been handled these past few years. Yeah of course LoL is bigger, but I thought we were talking about BF4 vs COD Ghosts, and FPS's in particular.

 

CoD has hurt games. I don't see how making the same game every year is helping me as a gamer out. CoD is an easy game to pick up and play. CoDs skill is watching choke points and getting off the first shot. The shooting aspect, the skill gap is very small since shooting them in the torso or head make little difference. You don't believe me? Look at games today and how much easier they are now than back in the day. Games today hold your hand instead of letting you figure it out yourself.

 

Competitive gaming certainly isn't hurting from the COD series, it replaced Halo with quite a large prize pool. Sure it's easy to pick up and play. Choke points, possible routes, and reacting in the best way mean everything. First shot does not always spell victory. The shooting aspect make a large difference as shooting in the head or chest is the difference in winning a gun battle. Of course games are more approachable. That's part of why they've become so successful. Sure the games are more approachable, but there are still small tricks and hints that players figure out.  

 

I did acknowledge it. I said yeah CoD stays the same and i would've liked it if Halo didn't change so much each game. That doesn't change the fact that they are selling the same CoD every year and charging you $60 for it. The game doesn't need to come out every year. If you need to spend $60 every year to get a new experience from the same game play there's a problem.

 

It's updated graphics, weapons, maps, and sometimes new features. I don't mind paying them for that. I would have paid the same for Halo's had they remained the same. Hell, I wish it had taken that road. You see that as a problem. I don't think that there is a problem, and evidently neither does the large majority of apparently all mindless morons.

 

I am no wrong about games needing to develop... not at all. You also don't need to charge $60 every year for the same game. I honestly don't even see how you're arguing with me cause it's true. Street Fighter was a prime example and your argument was "it doesn't effect me cause i have money and i need the illusion of a new game to give me that fresh feeling". How ever you won't admit it's an illusion even though it is, since you've agreed that they are the same game every year.

 

Your telling me your opinion as if it is fact. I didn't say that "I need the illusion"...It's your opinion that it's an illusion. I make no illusion to the fact that I know what I'm getting. It's basically the same game with new features, items, maps, etc. I make no illusions about that. It doesn't bother me.  

 

Whatever i can't argue with someone who is will to accept being milked. I %100 don't agree with anything you've had to say since i've seen from the past and now that you don't need to release the same game ever year. Every 2nd year, fine, but every year is ridiculous. That goes for any game that's released every year. Sports games, Assassins Creed. Let that anticipation build up. How CoD fans get excited every year is a little ridiculous.

 

That's your opinion, and as I have said numerous times now, you're welcome to it, but it's still just an opinion. At the moment the facts are COD is successful, so if you think they are ruining gaming, it's null to the point that they're selling games only because people choose to buy it. Whether or not you agree with me is also null, the game is successful because people buy it. No one forces your hand to buy the game and although you may think that the series is ruining gaming as you see it, you are more than welcome to continue playing the games that you listed as games you enjoy. Thinking that gaming is ruined, that gamers are idiots, or that I don't know what I'm talking about and you're right about it all is really meaningless. You cannot control or shape what gaming is and will become and just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean you're wrong, that I'm right or anything else. People have a choice and the large majority of people support COD. Just because you have your opinion doesn't make you better or me worse. It just is what it is. I'm honestly happy and content with gaming where it is. Sure I'd like to see some improvements, but I'm optimistic of the future and gaming in general.

Answers in bold. I feel my way, and you feel yours. I have no qualms with your opinions, but realize that they are your opinions, forcing them on me as facts get each of us nowhere. I agree with your opinion that gaming could offer us games that last longer. I'm also realistic of what gaming is today and accept it. I don't have a problem with it or else I wouldn't pay the $60 every year.

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Answers in bold. I feel my way, and you feel yours. I have no qualms with your opinions, but realize that they are your opinions, forcing them on me as facts get each of us nowhere. I agree with your opinion that gaming could offer us games that last longer. I'm also realistic of what gaming is today and accept it. I don't have a problem with it or else I wouldn't pay the $60 every year.

Exactly my point which is why i shouldn't keep having this argument with you. You're willing to accept that companies will keep milking you for your money so how can i argue with that?

 

How ever i will respond to some of your stuff if not all.

 

So they're not allowed to play games because they're not like us and don't play for the same reasons we play? So does the same apply to other sports? If you aren't trying to actively get into the NBA, then you can't play a pickup game of Bball for fun?

I never said they aren't allowed to play. Never did i say that. Just saying, CoD is an easy game and that a lot of other developers see that girls who don't normally game are picking up CoD and playing it cause of it's lack of difficulty they feel "powerful". So you see a lot of games just throwing rewards at you for doing fuck all. Even in Halo that's happening. You get a medal for getting shot and someone else killing them lol. 

 

 

 

You thinking that gamers are suckers doesn't make it factual. That's your opinion and you're more than welcome to it, but spouting it as fact is just nonsense. I agree about Metro, that's a bad idea and bad for gaming. However, we are talking about COD and as of yet, they don't do that, so that's besides the point and a different argument entirely. I don't have an issue with spending the money. I don't feel that I am being taken advantage of or else I would do something about it. Your opinion of how I am being treated as a gamer is your opinion, but once again not factual. I think games are just evolving in a different way than you realize. The amount of time spent on development has shrunk and it mostly due to publishers wanting to get a product out there. For the amount of time spent on development + time I spend playing their game, I feel they do a pretty decent job. Especially compared to how Halo has been handled these past few years. Yeah of course LoL is bigger, but I thought we were talking about BF4 vs COD Ghosts, and FPS's in particular.

 

 

If you're willing to keep throwing money at them every year just cause it's "new"... i mean what would you call that? CoD does something similar, instead they keep making half ass campaigns that no one cares about and keep releasing the same game, charging you for $60 and calling it "the NEW CoD". You see that as okay, i don't so how am i suppose to argue that? "I have no problem buying the same product every year". I mean you can't argue that since you're agreeing with me, but some how disagreeing with me. 

You keep talking about how it's just my opinion, but you can use an opinion in argument. Just because it's an opinion and not fact doesn't mean it's invalid. You don't need to keep throwing money at them to get what you want. If the consumer stopped giving them money every year maybe you'd see some improvements cause CoD is not a perfect game. I don't see how selling the same product every year as "evolving" as you like to put it. I'm not some idiot who isn't aware of what's going on. I'm clearly aware of what's going on which is why i'm having this argument. 

 

No we are not talking about just FPS's, were talking about all video games. Video games in general are being dumbed down for people like those girls i speak of who aren't gamers, but find out that they are doing well in CoD cause have how easy it is to pick up and play. There's a reason i brought up those "girls". I wasn't trying to be sexist or prejudiced. Developers even talk about how games are being dumbed down, there's a whole video about it on Youtube. Actually right now there's a thing going on TV ona  show called "Reviews on the Run" and they're talking about how games are so much easier now. 

 

Anyways you have no problem throwing your money away for an illusion so i can't argue that. 

 

 

 

It's updated graphics, weapons, maps, and sometimes new features. I don't mind paying them for that. I would have paid the same for Halo's had they remained the same. Hell, I wish it had taken that road. You see that as a problem. I don't think that there is a problem, and evidently neither does the large majority of apparently all mindless morons. 

 

 

Have the graphics significantly improved since MW2? Last time i checked they all don't look that much different. $60 isn't worth that. New weapons and maps you say? $15 DLC could help you out there. Of course that's my opinion, but i don't think anyone would call me a fool for not wanting to buy every CoD every year.  Again, just cause of the game is popular it doesn't mean it's good. Justin Bieber is very popular, what's your point? 

I would pay for the same Halo as Halo 3, but tweaked and updated and didn't come out every year. Would i but it if it was the exact same thing? Only reason why i would is if everyone else does. I'd have to buy if i want to compete, only reason. 

 

Your telling me your opinion as if it is fact. I didn't say that "I need the illusion"...It's your opinion that it's an illusion. I make no illusion to the fact that I know what I'm getting. It's basically the same game with new features, items, maps, etc. I make no illusions about that. It doesn't bother me.

 

You said so yourself. It "feels" fresh. Key word here, "FEELS". Meaning that it's not anything new, but just cause there's new maps and has a different title to it, the game gives off this illusion of it being different and new when really it's the same game with a different title. 

 

That's your opinion, and as I have said numerous times now, you're welcome to it, but it's still just an opinion. At the moment the facts are COD is successful, so if you think they are ruining gaming, it's null to the point that they're selling games only because people choose to buy it. Whether or not you agree with me is also null, the game is successful because people buy it. No one forces your hand to buy the game and although you may think that the series is ruining gaming as you see it, you are more than welcome to continue playing the games that you listed as games you enjoy. Thinking that gaming is ruined, that gamers are idiots, or that I don't know what I'm talking about and you're right about it all is really meaningless. You cannot control or shape what gaming is and will become and just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean you're wrong, that I'm right or anything else. People have a choice and the large majority of people support COD. Just because you have your opinion doesn't make you better or me worse. It just is what it is. I'm honestly happy and content with gaming where it is. Sure I'd like to see some improvements, but I'm optimistic of the future and gaming in general.

 

Again, just cause something is popular doesn't mean shit. Truth. People are sheep, people will do what's popular. That's just how life works. You can keep using the "it's your opinion argument"(which is one of the weakest forms of countering a point), but just because it's my opinion it doesn't change the fact that you are willing to throw $60 at a company for the same product every year(as you've already admitted). 

 

Say if there was a product(let's say a black TV) that you bought for $100. Then a year later the exact same thing came out, but was a different colour(let's say this colour is orange) and they just put the word "new" in front of it and you still went and bought it for $100 and you were aware that it's the exact same product, but different colour, you think that's okay? 

To me that's what a sucker is, but then again that's just my opinion. 

 

Anyways, like i said, i shouldn't continue to have this argument. I'm arguing with someone who said "it's okay to keep throwing money at big companies for the same product every year, fuck it, i got the money". 

 

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Exactly my point which is why i shouldn't keep having this argument with you. You're willing to accept that companies will keep milking you for your money so how can i argue with that?

 

How ever i will respond to some of your stuff if not all.

 

I never said they aren't allowed to play. Never did i say that. Just saying, CoD is an easy game and that a lot of other developers see that girls who don't normally game are picking up CoD and playing it cause of it's lack of difficulty they feel "powerful". So you see a lot of games just throwing rewards at you for doing fuck all. Even in Halo that's happening. You get a medal for getting shot and someone else killing them lol. 

 

 

If you're willing to keep throwing money at them every year just cause it's "new"... i mean what would you call that? CoD does something similar, instead they keep making half ass campaigns that no one cares about and keep releasing the same game, charging you for $60 and calling it "the NEW CoD". You see that as okay, i don't so how am i suppose to argue that? "I have no problem buying the same product every year". I mean you can't argue that since you're agreeing with me, but some how disagreeing with me. 

You keep talking about how it's just my opinion, but you can use an opinion in argument. Just because it's an opinion and not fact doesn't mean it's invalid. You don't need to keep throwing money at them to get what you want. If the consumer stopped giving them money every year maybe you'd see some improvements cause CoD is not a perfect game. I don't see how selling the same product every year as "evolving" as you like to put it. I'm not some idiot who isn't aware of what's going on. I'm clearly aware of what's going on which is why i'm having this argument. 

 

No we are not talking about just FPS's, were talking about all video games. Video games in general are being dumbed down for people like those girls i speak of who aren't gamers, but find out that they are doing well in CoD cause have how easy it is to pick up and play. There's a reason i brought up those "girls". I wasn't trying to be sexist or prejudiced. Developers even talk about how games are being dumbed down, there's a whole video about it on Youtube. Actually right now there's a thing going on TV ona  show called "Reviews on the Run" and they're talking about how games are so much easier now. 

 

Anyways you have no problem throwing your money away for an illusion so i can't argue that. 

 

 

Have the graphics significantly improved since MW2? Last time i checked they all don't look that much different. $60 isn't worth that. New weapons and maps you say? $15 DLC could help you out there. Of course that's my opinion, but i don't think anyone would call me a fool for not wanting to buy every CoD every year.  Again, just cause of the game is popular it doesn't mean it's good. Justin Bieber is very popular, what's your point? 

I would pay for the same Halo as Halo 3, but tweaked and updated and didn't come out every year. Would i but it if it was the exact same thing? Only reason why i would is if everyone else does. I'd have to buy if i want to compete, only reason. 

 

 

You said so yourself. It "feels" fresh. Key word here, "FEELS". Meaning that it's not anything new, but just cause there's new maps and has a different title to it, the game gives off this illusion of it being different and new when really it's the same game with a different title. 

 

 

Again, just cause something is popular doesn't mean shit. Truth. People are sheep, people will do what's popular. That's just how life works. You can keep using the "it's your opinion argument"(which is one of the weakest forms of countering a point), but just because it's my opinion it doesn't change the fact that you are willing to throw $60 at a company for the same product every year(as you've already admitted). 

 

Say if there was a product(let's say a black TV) that you bought for $100. Then a year later the exact same thing came out, but was a different colour(let's say this colour is orange) and they just put the word "new" in front of it and you still went and bought it for $100 and you were aware that it's the exact same product, but different colour, you think that's okay? 

To me that's what a sucker is, but then again that's just my opinion. 

 

Anyways, like i said, i shouldn't continue to have this argument. I'm arguing with someone who said "it's okay to keep throwing money at big companies for the same product every year, fuck it, i got the money". 

 

If you see them as milking me, okay. I don't or else I wouldn't pay for it.

 

So, some successful games are easy. Don't buy them and support something else. Berating them, or my choice to buy them, or paint them as a company ruining gaming will do nothing to save, shape, or otherwise change the future of gaming.

 

Same =/= basically same. This is where I feel we are in disagreement. I get basically the same game. It's familiar, it feels the same but different, I know how to handle it and not have to relearn a new game, yet it has that new shiny feeling with new stuff. That's why I pay and don't feel ripped off.

 

If video games in general are supposedly the issue, then I guess do something that you feel you can do to make an impact. Trying to convince me that I'm part of the problem is not a good place to start. Frankly, I really don't care enough to exert the amount of needed energy to attempt to change the direction of the game industry. Not only do I not see a problem, I don't see the effort required worth the reward of trying to change the industry.

 

It's not an illusion to me. I know what I'm getting.

 

Games have evolved texture and pixelwise across the series, hardly noticeable until you play ones that are far apart. The FOV has also increased. You would pay the same thing for a yearly Halo in order to compete but argue with me because I pay for the same game like you would for Halo but I'm being taken advantage of by the corporations, throwing my money away, etc. Sounds like a one way street man. That or you're a sheep that marches to the beat of a different drum all the while mocking me for what we both apparently are.

 

Feeling is how I interpret the world....Obviously I have that familiarity with the game so I don't feel like a fish out of water with each new COD. Once again, it's not an illusion, I know what I am paying for.

 

Popularity has everything to do when money's involved. Money will be where popularity is. Games are made by businesses and businesses run on money. The more money, the more success, the more resources you have, better capabilities, etc. "It's your opinion" means it really is just an opinion. It's not a form of counter argument. Make a factual statement without your opinion attached that would be an argument. Simply adding your opinion onto a fact doesn't make the opinion part of the fact. For instance; me buying the game each year is a fact.  Telling me that "I'm throwing my money away buying the game every year" is your opinion tacked onto a fact. Sure people may be sheep in most cases, but who are you to claim to be the shepherd? People may follow the path of least resistance and go with the flow when it comes to gaming, but ultimately they still have a choice. Most people are not mindless morons. Contrary to what you may think of me, I still have a choice on whether or not I buy the game. As it gets closer to launch and we find more out about the game, if I don't like what I see, I can and will still walk away. I walked away from Halo before the popularity of it plummeted. Popularity doesn't guide my decision.

 

Once again in reference to your TV argument, it comes down to what you view as far as the changes. While you still see the same game that released last year, I see a new game with new zombies mode(reference to BO2), League Play, new guns, new maps, spectator mode, new prestiges, challenges, experiences, etc. It's how you view things and how I view things that ultimately determine your purchasing standards and mine.

 

Once again, for quite the repetitive time; you view me as wasting my money, throwing it away, taking it by the corporations, etc. I don't. Whether or not you think that I am delusional, gullible, mindless, guided by the crowd, etc in the end is completely your opinion contrary to how you may view it as fact.

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If you see them as milking me, okay. I don't or else I wouldn't pay for it.

 

So, some successful games are easy. Don't buy them and support something else. Berating them, or my choice to buy them, or paint them as a company ruining gaming will do nothing to save, shape, or otherwise change the future of gaming.

 

Same =/= basically same. This is where I feel we are in disagreement. I get basically the same game. It's familiar, it feels the same but different, I know how to handle it and not have to relearn a new game, yet it has that new shiny feeling with new stuff. That's why I pay and don't feel ripped off.

 

If video games in general are supposedly the issue, then I guess do something that you feel you can do to make an impact. Trying to convince me that I'm part of the problem is not a good place to start. Frankly, I really don't care enough to exert the amount of needed energy to attempt to change the direction of the game industry. Not only do I not see a problem, I don't see the effort required worth the reward of trying to change the industry.

 

It's not an illusion to me. I know what I'm getting.

 

Games have evolved texture and pixelwise across the series, hardly noticeable until you play ones that are far apart. The FOV has also increased. You would pay the same thing for a yearly Halo in order to compete but argue with me because I pay for the same game like you would for Halo but I'm being taken advantage of by the corporations, throwing my money away, etc. Sounds like a one way street man. That or you're a sheep that marches to the beat of a different drum all the while mocking me for what we both apparently are.

 

Feeling is how I interpret the world....Obviously I have that familiarity with the game so I don't feel like a fish out of water with each new COD. Once again, it's not an illusion, I know what I am paying for.

 

Popularity has everything to do when money's involved. Money will be where popularity is. Games are made by businesses and businesses run on money. The more money, the more success, the more resources you have, better capabilities, etc. "It's your opinion" means it really is just an opinion. It's not a form of counter argument. Make a factual statement without your opinion attached that would be an argument. Simply adding your opinion onto a fact doesn't make the opinion part of the fact. For instance; me buying the game each year is a fact.  Telling me that "I'm throwing my money away buying the game every year" is your opinion tacked onto a fact. Sure people may be sheep in most cases, but who are you to claim to be the shepherd? People may follow the path of least resistance and go with the flow when it comes to gaming, but ultimately they still have a choice. Most people are not mindless morons. Contrary to what you may think of me, I still have a choice on whether or not I buy the game. As it gets closer to launch and we find more out about the game, if I don't like what I see, I can and will still walk away. I walked away from Halo before the popularity of it plummeted. Popularity doesn't guide my decision.

 

Once again in reference to your TV argument, it comes down to what you view as far as the changes. While you still see the same game that released last year, I see a new game with new zombies mode(reference to BO2), League Play, new guns, new maps, spectator mode, new prestiges, challenges, experiences, etc. It's how you view things and how I view things that ultimately determine your purchasing standards and mine.

 

Once again, for quite the repetitive time; you view me as wasting my money, throwing it away, taking it by the corporations, etc. I don't. Whether or not you think that I am delusional, gullible, mindless, guided by the crowd, etc in the end is completely your opinion contrary to how you may view it as fact.

Saw the last part of the of the post. You concluded it to be "just an opinion". I'm done. I'll read it later, but it's pointless to keep having this argument don't you think? I saw one thing, you say something else. You're agreeing with me, but then end it with how they are just opinions.

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Saw the last part of the of the post. You concluded it to be "just an opinion". I'm done. I'll read it later, but it's pointless to keep having this argument don't you think? I saw one thing, you say something else. You're agreeing with me, but then end it with how they are just opinions.

Eh, whatever. I get the impression you keep telling me my opinions are wrong and your opinions are the right way, I tell you that they're your opinions are just opinions, and you feel that I don't know what I'm talking about and just calling your "facts" opinions as my way out. Either way, wahtevs man. I'm cool as a cucumber and no worries.

 

My bottom line was and is this. I like COD, I'll keep playing COD as long as I like it. COD is successful and BF will have a hard time killing something like COD.

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Eh, whatever. I get the impression you keep telling me my opinions are wrong and your opinions are the right way, I tell you that they're your opinions are just opinions, and you feel that I don't know what I'm talking about and just calling your "facts" opinions as my way out. Either way, wahtevs man. I'm cool as a cucumber and no worries.

 

My bottom line was and is this. I like COD, I'll keep playing COD as long as I like it. COD is successful and BF will have a hard time killing something like COD.

No i'm not saying you are wrong. I'm aware they are both opinions. But just because you're okay with giving them $60 everytime doesn't mean they aren't milking everyone for their money. Activision is known to do this. They milk the shit out their games.

 

I'm not saying BF4 will be the killer of CoD. Do i think BF4 looks better than CoD: Ghosts? Absolutely. But will they be the killer? No Infinity Ward and Activision will be the killers of CoD.

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Can you use your smart phone or does it have to be a tablet?

 

You can use a smartphone too.

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No i'm not saying you are wrong. I'm aware they are both opinions. But just because you're okay with giving them $60 everytime doesn't mean they aren't milking everyone for their money. Activision is known to do this. They milk the shit out their games.

 

I'm not saying BF4 will be the killer of CoD. Do i think BF4 looks better than CoD: Ghosts? Absolutely. But will they be the killer? No Infinity Ward and Activision will be the killers of CoD.

That's where we disagree. I feel my $60 is worth it, and you don't, but that's cool.

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I have a feeling Ghosts is going to be played/bought more than BF4. 

Look at the BO2 servers right now, the pop. is crazy!

-Alias

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Battlefield 4 has had a stronger marketing campaign and more people know about it right now, though I still think CoD: Ghosts will outsell BF4 by time Christmas hits. GTA V outselling outselling everything is no surprise. It's a game that appeals to all gamers.

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