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HCS Pro League Summer 2017 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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I think it's absolutely crazy to state that Ogre 2 has made zero effort to grow the Halo scene. Of all the takes I've seen, this is simultaneously one of the hottest and worst I've ever come across.

accidental neg
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I feel like I posted on this topic many many times, but ill give it another go since it is relevant and 2gre is someone who seeing his name bashed in any way is silly.

 

I have one question for everyone here, and I need an honest answer. Is streaming not promoting a game? I ask this because 2gre is basically a full time streamer for halo/destiny(yes he has a right to play other games I think we all agree on that), I've had people come at myself/teammates before for not promoting halo etc etc. Meanwhile TJ and Brad stream 5+ hours a day(on average I would say).

 

The thing I'll say about 2gre is this. He came from a different generation of players. Now a days streaming, youtube etc etc are all these hyped up promotional tools. When in reality it's something I'm not even comfortable using since I grew up in the 09 era of halo basically. Halo has always been about one thing, trying to be the best. Idk I guess I can get where people are coming from with 2gre or anyone needing to promote halo better. I'd just assume people would understand 2gre a bit more since he is the basically the reason orgs are in halo. Which without some of these orgs I'm not sure how well we would be doing overall. He stayed apart of halo even after he stopped playing when he was still fully capable, and still streams a game I'm sure he has no desire to play. Think someone mentioned it earlier, but to me it's not like streaming halo, hosting the halo channel, coaching EG etc etc are all exactly him sitting around doing nothing.

 

I do want to say this and I'm sure I have multiple times. Being a professionally player is more difficult now than it has ever been(at least from when I have been a professional back in 2009). Any pro who is still around from back then will tell you the amount of time and effort you have to put into this game compared to games prior is actually pretty ridiculous. I'm not sure if it is because of h5 mechanics or because that is basically how esports is in general now, but making content or w/e would have been much easier back than compared to now (in terms of time). Now I could obviously go and just upload a game from scrims, but I have been told many times by people on this thread not many actually want to see that nor will it help it grow. For me it's always tough seeing these kind of comments because i watch my teammates as well as other pros put in countless hours and it's not like it helps much. One of the main reasons we went to OG was to help boost halos viewership( judging by numbers I believe we accomplished that, they most likely would have been lower if we went to one of the other orgs offering us). 

 

Anyways thanks for reading my monthly long post. Just how I feel about some things with how long I have been apart of this community. Feel free to neg it, + rep it or tell your parents a Pro player was active with the community(gasp). I like to think I see both sides of every argument. Hopefully people see where I come from. Have a good day  

Thanks for popping in with the wise words as always. I definitely agree that it is not on 2gre to build the scene and outside of youtube content (which i'm assuming @@Towey is doing still) and writing articles for the media, i dont know what else he can do. blaming him feels like blaming the community for not tweeting the stream or flooding events with players and spectators. the first step should be to build a compelling product then have us support that, not grow the scene to then create a compelling product. that's on 343 and esl and it is something that mlg does very well. i dont know anything about gears, but the player profiles get me invested in certain people to the point where im watching beyond where i intended to tune out. we need that.

 

as to your content, i would actually love to see a scrim where you narrate decision making and personal/team movement. maybe that would give away too much of your secrets but i would love to see it. and it sucks that you dot stream more, but i think we all know it's because @mikeface killah betrayed you on triple team that one time lol

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I can see your point on the "stale" feeling. Do you guys think that more players feel this way?

 

Also, what map/mode combos would you guys like to see be tested?

Extraction and oddball above all else. Extraction was the best gametype in h4 and was left out for no reason.
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It's the same song and dance every time, obviously the best time to do this stuff is when the game is new at release. We have a pattern, the game comes out and nothing has changed with content, but once the game starts it's downward trend in number then we see people talking about pros streaming more and making content. It won't make a big difference at this point.

No

 

The best time to do it is when a good game is released.

 

It's been 10 years for halo. There's literally nothing the community can do. It's all in 343's hands.

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All I want to see again is ONE LAN tournament where brackets for CE, H2, and H3 are ran and maybe even some 1v1s, 2v2s, and FFA events as opposed to just the normal 4v4 stuff.  We can't keep pretending to get hype for games that don't warrant it.

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I agree with the sentiment that comp halo needs some new gametypes. Three I've always though would fit both the map and gametype would be KOTH on empire, assault on truth and oddball on rig.

 

On pros growing the scene/their own brand, think the point made about them streaming other games was a good one. I used to love watching halo pros/cod pros stream destiny raids, I definitely followed some people I normally wouldn't have because of it

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King

 

Of

 

The

 

Hill

 

 

No, it is not edged out by the existence of Strongholds. Both stress different skillsets within players.

 

KotH encourages slightly more combat than the larger SH maps, since those tend to turn into situations of players trying to rotate to the empty side of the map to gain obj ground...while in KotH, your objective points come from being in a single area of the map. Movement is cycled on a minute-by-minute basis based on where the hill moves.

 

It's also superior to Oddball, since you never have to make yourself incapable of fighting in order to score.

I wanna see KoTH ground pounds so bad.

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I really wish our community promoted the older games as well. Not just the community but various people in from 343 or M$. It was nice to have a pro team play in the Halo 3 tournament. It was cool to watch both the Howies Gaming Shack and EsportsArena Halo 2 events. Of course, lots of CE stuff happens so having the support of a handful of Halo 5 pros and community members were really helpful. All it took for CE for Beach LAN 5 was a few tweets and hosts and you guys gave CE more than it has had in a decade plus.

 

I just see various complaints (not saying they're invalid) with the game and scene but at the same time we don't really do much to support each other beyond the current game. It's less that I think the old games are some key to success for getting us to a top esport, and more along the lines of if you really enjoy the old games like you claim back in the day, how hard is it to toss them a little support?

 

I still hope for an EVO like event for Halo.

 

I'm hoping that all OG Xbox game being backwards compatible (and on the Xbox store iirc) on a system with system link and LAN capabilities will help. new players probable won't want to pick up an older system for 1 game but if they can do it on the new system then that could bring more interest as long as there is an open scene ready to foster newcomers. hopefully daytona will start a trend and dreamhack can have some community stations for older halos. especially at fall final when the x1x is launching they can show off the hardware while lanning older games

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Has Oddball been playtested? I feel like H5's movement and ability to move around the map and cover ground would make the odd ball holder a pretty severe handicap. 

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We need to be more outraged about the Victory X situation.

 

It's kinda hard to combat it when the rule book is ever-changing.

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As with most people, I agree Oddball and Assault gametypes are the obvious requests. Assault was tested prior to the new HCS radar, so it would be interesting to see how it would play with new setting. Also, Oddball could potentially have different base movement settings for the ball carrier in Halo 5. You could make the base movement slower, but still allow sprint. That way with the new HCS radar, there would by a risk reward of popping up on radar as the ball carrier. No idea now that would play until it was tested.

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It's kinda hard to combat it when the rule book is ever-changing.

 

'The Living Document' sounds like a really bad Indiana Jones movie about bureaucracy 

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King

 

Of

 

The

 

Hill

 

 

No, it is not edged out by the existence of Strongholds. Both stress different skillsets within players.

 

KotH encourages slightly more combat than the larger SH maps, since those tend to turn into situations of players trying to rotate to the empty side of the map to gain obj ground...while in KotH, your objective points come from being in a single area of the map. Movement is cycled on a minute-by-minute basis based on where the hill moves.

 

It's also superior to Oddball, since you never have to make yourself incapable of fighting in order to score.

 

This exceeeeppppt for saying that its superior to oddball...  The fact that you dont have to make yourself incapable of fighting doesn't inherently make it better.

I used to love seeing really good objective players with the oddball knowing when to drop it and fight, play it, just stay alive etc.  its fun too. 

 

In fact... i think its superior to KotH because the winning team is the one that controls the game 3v4 better more than the other team controls the game 3v4  :simms:

 

(i like them both and dont want to argue one over the other.  We should have both of them)

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Has Oddball been playtested? I feel like H5's movement and ability to move around the map and cover ground would make the odd ball holder a pretty severe handicap. 

 

I am 99% sure they will never use Oddball or any other "custom" gametype in the HCS until there is an official gametype created with full announcer support.

 

Apparently the main gametype creator is gone now, which is why they added the ability to create them in Forge as a user workaround.

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You always state this as a negative thing for Oddball but it's exactly the reason why I DO like oddball.

 

How can your team maintain control while sacrificing a gun on the battlefield?

It creates an entirely new way to play and that's why it's my favorite Halo gametype.

 

I prefer KOTH but I agree with you on this. If you hold up Oddball, KOTH, and Strongholds and compare the skills emphasized by each I feel like KOTH shares similarities with both while Oddball and SH only really share the time-management aspect. If the goal of different gametypes is to test the widest variety of different skills, then Oddball and SH does that better than SH and KOTH.

 

And this is coming from someone whose favorite gametypes in H3/Reach/H2A were all KOTH.

 

Edit: also I'd like to think Assault would work very well if we think outside the box a little with changes to the gametype. Allowing throwing (not throw-in scores, that's obviously lame) to give players a way to move the ball in quickly, or simply giving the ball carrier full access to all the movement options would go a long way. Changes to goal size and arm-time don't help when the biggest problems are spawns and not being able to move the bomb in quickly enough.

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