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Halo World Championship 2017 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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MLG is a pretty big reason a lot of us got into competitive Halo, how can you honestly say with a straight face that they don't know how to build a community. To top it off, then you try and say a guy that has been posting on our forums (and previously THC) is fake and has ran Halo events for nearly 15 years...I can't.

 

I don't think nostalgia is a big factor in people wanting MLG back but incompetence with HCS and ESL for the last few years.

 

lets be a little honest that nostalgia is a part of the want for mlg, but that is not a bad thing esp when we remember this

 

PosterMLG.jpg

 

mlg grew halo from the point where the players were setting up stations for small lans to the point of 200+ team lans. nostalgia isnt clouding our minds, it makes us remember that we deserve so much better. no one is saying mlg is perfect or we will instantly get 100 team lans, but, if given the chance, they will grow competitive halo even if h6 doesnt have lan support.

 

for the people arguing against it, what do we have to lose by giving the TO that grew the game a chance? esl has given us burbank and 10 people listen-ins. we have the same issues every land. at the minimum, mlg can run a clean event  and bring in a crowd for events. they also know the world outside of califfornia. plus, they communicate. there is literally nothing to lose, and there is no good argument against mlg running a season or 2

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MLG is a pretty big reason a lot of us got into competitive Halo, how can you honestly say with a straight face that they don't know how to build a community. To top it off, then you try and say a guy that has been posting on our forums (and previously THC) is fake and has ran Halo events for nearly 15 years...I can't.

 

I don't think nostalgia is a big factor in people wanting MLG back but incompetence with HCS and ESL for the last few years.

 

Well first of all, I had a pretty good response last time before you banned me for no apparent reason. Maybe this time, you'll let me discuss this with you like an adult? Firstly, I didn't say he was "Fake". That word was never written by me so I'm not sure where you got that from. Secondly, I've ran live TV events and tournaments with prize pools up to $1 000 000. My daytime job is actually a Squash coach, so I know what I'm talking about when I say grass roots and professional events. Lastly, do I deny that MLG was a reason a lot of people got into competitive Halo? Nope. You delete my post last time because you didn't want to hear the harsh reality. MLG had 2 H5 events (X-Games: The blue side had audio issues and Regional: Audio didn't work for a full day and had to priority deliver Astro headsets), they are not immune to the fuck ups that other TOs do. I can sit here and say they don't know how to build a community because they don't. The people create communities. They got lucky at a time when LAN was emerging, console gaming was picking up pace and everyone carried their TV and consoles around to each others houses. That is community. They merely cash in on these communities and cash in on the games and drop them without hesitation when it doesn't fit their business plan or narrative.

 

I'll ask this again, how can you honestly say with a straight face that they can save Halo or give you the numbers you want when the asinine attitude of 343 is a fault for 90% of these problems?

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I wasn't around during the mlg days, but when everyone says h3 is the best halo game, it's easy to see how the community would grow because the game is getting better. That saying, I'm sure mlg had something to do with the growth.

 

Edit* People wanting mlg because of how disappointing esl have been is very true

 

if youre able, please check in on @@Zeezbruh's stream. he plays a lot of mlg rebroadcasts. you'll be amazed how good a 2009 rebroadcast matches a 2016 one in terms of quality





			
		
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Well first of all, I had a pretty good response last time before you banned me for no apparent reason. Maybe this time, you'll let me discuss this with you like an adult? Firstly, I didn't say he was "Fake". That word was never written by me so I'm not sure where you got that from.

 

Please avoid insulting staff - which is why you were banned by 2 different staff members, it's a simple rule. We don't mind actually criticism but to go as far as cheap insults isn't going to do you much to your point. If you want to discuss this point further my PM box is always open.

 

Secondly, I've ran live TV events and tournaments with prize pools up to $1 000 000. My daytime job is actually a Squash coach, so I know what I'm talking about when I say grass roots and professional events. Lastly, do I deny that MLG was a reason a lot of people got into competitive Halo? Nope. You delete my post last time because you didn't want to hear the harsh reality. MLG had 2 H5 events (X-Games: The blue side had audio issues and Regional: Audio didn't work for a full day and had to priority deliver Astro headsets), they are not immune to the fuck ups that other TOs do. I can sit here and say they don't know how to build a community because they don't. The people create communities. They got lucky at a time when LAN was emerging, console gaming was picking up pace and everyone carried their TV and consoles around to each others houses. That is community. They merely cash in on these communities and cash in on the games and drop them without hesitation when it doesn't fit their business plan or narrative.

 

No one saying MLG is perfect, but most are willing to bet that they will run a better events instead of ESL or any other 3rd party operators. With the recent issues at UGC and and now the "Burbank Campus" with cosplay pictures opportunities I'd love to see why you think this is good.

 

I'll ask this again, how can you honestly say with a straight face that they can save Halo or give you the numbers you want when the asinine attitude of 343 is a fault for 90% of these problems?

 

When did I say anything about saving Halo or these huge numbers by just using MLG? Most just want events and locations that will suit the growth of the community. ESL and the HCS have a lot of self inflicted issues - which why a lot of the community get angry.

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if youre able, please check in on @@Zeezbruh's stream. he plays a lot of mlg rebroadcasts. you'll be amazed how good a 2009 rebroadcast matches a 2016 one in terms of quality



I watched his stream for a while but then I started watching the same events, so I stopped. They were definitely enjoyable enough to watch 10 years on. Also the mlg tv stuff for h2 was a really good recap system that would be cool if it returned

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rWAfEZK.png

 

:lxthul:

 

guys we are rebuilding. yes i'm only 20

 

-T2

 

 

i wish this forum could be purely about the players and teams where we didnt even have to think about production values or if the next major tournament will be held in a closet. i cant believe that this far in, we still have to fight for the most basic of things

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text

 

Unfortunately I have to go to work in an hour but I'll see what I can reply with. First of all, this isn't 2004. Halo is not limited to being prominent east coast anymore. Frosty, Commonly, Shooter, Formal (when he competed) and more that I can't remember are from West. As much as you like to again, reminisce about "the home of Halo back in 2004", the new home is West coast. I'm from England and I can even see that. If a company has a studio, why not utilize it. Should it be bigger? Yes but that's a discussion point for another time. If it mattered, you'd have 2 events on each side and one in Texas for an even distribution. Again, every tournament organizer that has been involved in Halo (MLG, ESL, PGL, UMG) they have ALL had problems. Not a single one has been able to come off without one. In two years. On top of this, 343 SUCK. I've never in my life met a more incompetent developer. The post that I wrote before I was banned said it all. They have one of the biggest talent pools to make the game AND competitive good yet Quinn thinks he is above this all and doesn't take notice of any feedback. I mean, when you fuck up Gears so badly you move studio and then to fuck Halo up, at what point do you say maybe it's not the community but me? That is why the community is angry. Would you rather work on producing high quality events that shine a piece of shit or do you want to fix the piece of shit in the first place?   

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Okay, so a little about me which you don't care for but it leads up to something. I may be seen as a shit poster on this forum but I can back everything up. My line of work happens to be professional event organization for Squash. I was actually a lead for the 2009 Manchester Squash World Championships, have been a lead for 4 major events each year and host a local tournament for 400 kids each half year, for the last decade. If you need credentials, please hit me up in my DM and I'll send some links over to you that can be found via the internet. So, with that said, I know EXACTLY what I'm talking about since I produce for streams and live TV with large prize pools. 

 

I honestly don't know how I can't come off as hostile but I'm not. I want critical discussion because I want Halo to succeed so I hope you can offer me something back. So, with that due, I have 2 questions not just for you, but for anyone on this forum who can offer me reasonable, critical thinking responses:

 

Do you think it's acceptable behavior for a rep from tournament organizer to come on a forum during a live event? This is nothing more than a thinly veiled swipe at Halo, a chance for him to get a hit of dopamine from the Hot Pockets class of 2007 and outright unprofessional. Last posts are 28th January, December and November. Suddenly has time during an event to rub his improved production in our faces as a "see, look what we can do over here".

 

What can MLG offer Halo that other TOs couldn't if they didn't shit the bed? You guessed it. Nothing. Production does not make the game. I'd rather watch 5 guys off their heads on addy in an UMG garage than this so called professionalism where the players are so far apart in the booths they have to get up to fist bump. Don't get me wrong, I love how esports is turning out but a steaming shit with sprinkles and a bow is still a steaming shit. If the developer can't get the fundamentals right (Power Weapons in FFA LOL) and (adding silenced weapons without data to back up claims, even more LOL), then MLG can't save it. If they could offer something, it would have shown in GoW, yet their viewership numbers have dropped each event since the first.

 

 

I appreciate your analytical response  but still thnk you're taking a bit of a cynical perspective. Adam has been here for a while. 

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for the people arguing against it, what do we have to lose by giving the TO that grew the game a chance? esl has given us burbank and 10 people listen-ins. we have the same issues every land. at the minimum, mlg can run a clean event  and bring in a crowd for events. they also know the world outside of califfornia. plus, they communicate. there is literally nothing to lose, and there is no good argument against mlg running a season or 2

 

Had 2 events both with technical issues. I don't hate MLG but they are not special. I don't know how many times I have to say this. They can't bring crowds in. If they could, Gears would be on the rise. Second event, they REMOVED chairs from the venue. They host tournaments, not create communities.

 

rWAfEZK.png

 

:lxthul:

 

Yes, please reply with a picture from 2016 showing what the average attendance to Halo is compared to 2009(?) where there was a peak of 1 000 000 players online. It's a very fair representation. If you can't fill Burbank why try to fill a concert hall?

 

Edit: #clueless

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Unfortunately I have to go to work in an hour but I'll see what I can reply with. First of all, this isn't 2004. Halo is not limited to being prominent east coast anymore. Frosty, Commonly, Shooter, Formal (when he competed) and more that I can't remember are from West. As much as you like to again, reminisce about "the home of Halo back in 2004", the new home is West coast. I'm from England and I can even see that.

stopped reading here

 

#clueless

 

 

Yes, please reply with a picture from 2016 showing what the average attendance to Halo is compared to 2009(?) where there was a peak of 1 000 000 players online. It's a very fair representation. If you can't fill Burbank why try to fill a concert hall?

pretty hard to convince people to spend 1k on a vacation to a jiffy lube that's located 10 miles outside of la

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stopped reading here

 

#clueless

 

Nah man, Formal is from the West Coast is why we are now the home of it when he hasn't played in a Halo event for 3 years now.

 

The whole "West Coast Halo" crap is artificial and done by 343i/ESL with their terrible event location planning. I can't tell if they hate flying across the country or forgot there is an East Coast - but it's been crap for a few years now.

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Had 2 events both with technical issues. I don't hate MLG but they are not special. I don't know how many times I have to say this. They can't bring crowds in. If they could, Gears would be on the rise. Second event, they REMOVED chairs from the venue. They host tournaments, not create communities.

 

 

i'm not really interested in a flame war with you so i'm going to ignore the name calling and condescension.

 

i think you have bungie and mlg confused here however. bungie didnt give a shit about the competitive scene. mlg scooped up that small disjointed community and grew it. mlg was born out of the same people who hosted basement tournaments. they gave us a place to congregate and venues to play in and equipment to play on. mlg wasnt some huge behemoth looking for a quick buck. they ran halo at a loss for years, but they did it to foster growth and out of love for the game.

 

would the be a halo community without them? yes, but it would be built out of the lore. they took a small dedicated community that they were  part of from the beginning and grew it to something amazing.

 

you cant ompare gears because gears has nver had that same interest as a competitive game which is why they had to showcase it in the middle of halo tournaments. yet they are still working on creating something great by showing it love vs tossing it to the side

 

as to polishing a turd, IW is not a great game by any stretch of the imagination with a lot of the community hating it, but look at the crowds they've brought for those events. they will do the same for the game that made them what they are

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Hey can we get offended over some trash talk today?

 

I just wanna share some Smash 4 trash talk from the best Twitter in competitive gaming:

 

 

 

 

 

I miss when Halo had trash talk without people getting butthurt.

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Nah man, Formal is from the West Coast is why we are now the home of it when he hasn't played in a Halo event for 3 years now.

 

The whole "West Coast Halo" crap is artificial and done by 343i/ESL with their terrible event location planning. I can't tell if they hate flying across the country or forgot there is an East Coast - but it's been crap for a few years now.

 

Yes and the illuminate is real. "artificial"? This isn't some government conspiracy. It's Halo. In two years, 60% of Halo events have been mid/east coast and they have had less than spectacular participation numbers. Yet every West coast tournament brings in bigger number of teams participating from grass roots. If a TO would like to verify this information, please jump in. (East Coast: St.Louis x 3, Indianapolis, Atlanta, Columbus, Regionals, PAX) vs (Season Finals, Worlds, Vegas and Orange County). Please use statistics and data to back up your claims. Also additional West players are: Claim, Falcated, Shotzzy, Stellur, Huke... So you were saying?  

 

I didnt read after this, but I am assuming you are with Dexerto?

 

Didn't read so you resort to disrespect and insults, the same reason I got banned for? Interesting.

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Didn't read so you resort to disrespect and insults, the same reason I got banned for? Interesting.

 

I think you said something about the west coast being the "new home for Halo" -- compare Esports Arena team attendance vs. UGC - argument vanished.

 

West coast events are happening because the developer and the TO happen to be located in that region. Since Xbox One and Halo 5 can barely support "LAN" I can understand why it would be annoying to lug equipment and servers across the United States.

 

 

Also being a part of Dexerto isnt an insult.

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Yes and the illuminate is real. "artificial"? This isn't some government conspiracy. It's Halo. In two years, 60% of Halo events have been mid/east coast and they have had less than spectacular participation numbers. Yet every West coast tournament brings in bigger number of teams participating from grass roots. If a TO would like to verify this information, please jump in. (East Coast: St.Louis x 3, Indianapolis, Atlanta, Columbus, Regionals, PAX) vs (Season Finals, Worlds, Vegas and Orange County). Please use statistics and data to back up your claims. Also additional West players are: Claim, Falcated, Shotzzy, Stellur, Huke... So you were saying?  

 

 

Can you show me any kind of proof for this? You tell me to use statistics but don't link any sources.

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Can you show me any kind of proof for this? You tell me to use statistics but don't link any sources.

 

I literally just backed up my claim by typing out events in the past 2 years comparing them from East and West, along with the widest selection of grass root talent in Halo right now. I actually had trouble finding someone who entered the top 8 team from East Coast so let me help you:

 

West Coast who have entered top 8 teams in the past 2 years: Shotzzy, Commonly, Falcated, Huke, Stellur, Frosty, Renegade, Shooter, Tripppey, Rayne, Penguin (North West)

Mid: Cratos, Eco, Bubu, Suspector

East Coast Players: El Town

 

I have now backed up my claim.

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I literally just backed up my claim by typing out events in the past 2 years comparing them from East and West, along with the widest selection of grass root talent in Halo right now. I actually had trouble finding someone who entered the top 8 team from East Coast so let me help you:

 

West Coast who have entered top 8 teams in the past 2 years: Shotzzy, Commonly, Falcated, Huke, Stellur, Renegade, Suspector, Shooter, Tripppey

Mid: Cratos, Eco, Bubu

East Coast Players: El Town

 

I have now backed up my claim.

 

I'm referring to this:

 

In two years, 60% of Halo events have been mid/east coast and they have had less than spectacular participation numbers. Yet every West coast tournament brings in bigger number of teams participating from grass roots.

 

Please link some proof.

 

----------------------------

 

In regard to Pro Player living locations - ESL and the HCS could care less where the players are coming from, that has no pull on where the events will be held.

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I literally just backed up my claim by typing out events in the past 2 years comparing them from East and West, along with the widest selection of grass root talent in Halo right now. I actually had trouble finding someone who entered the top 8 team from East Coast so let me help you:

 

West Coast who have entered top 8 teams in the past 2 years: Shotzzy, Commonly, Falcated, Huke, Stellur, Renegade, Suspector, Shooter,

Mid: Cratos, Eco, Bubu

East Coast Players: El Town

 

I have now backed up my claim.

When did where the players are from become the agruement. We want eastern lans because there is a greater fan base there

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Yes and the illuminate is real. "artificial"? This isn't some government conspiracy. It's Halo. In two years, 60% of Halo events have been mid/east coast and they have had less than spectacular participation numbers. Yet every West coast tournament brings in bigger number of teams participating from grass roots. If a TO would like to verify this information, please jump in. (East Coast: St.Louis x 3, Indianapolis, Atlanta, Columbus, Regionals, PAX) vs (Season Finals, Worlds, Vegas and Orange County). Please use statistics and data to back up your claims. Also additional West players are: Claim, Falcated, Shotzzy, Stellur, Huke... So you were saying?  

 

 

What an odd argument. 

 

I think your whole "compare these midwest events  vs.  these west coast events" point is riddled with holes. For starters, when seeing where your community actually is centralized you should really only be comparing West Coast OPEN EVENTS   vs.  Midwest OPEN EVENTS.  Throwing Worlds and other "Finals" events that arent open to the public to compete, is going to skew the data as these events always have escalated viewership due to them being "Championships" - generally with outside promotion (Microsoft, Xbox, Dashboard etc.) which isnt going to provide an accurate depiction of the core "day-to-day" fan-base.

 

It is fairly open and shut, when looking at team passes, attendance, etc. West Coast Open Events fall short most (if not every time).

 

Just off the top of my head, eSports Arena had like 22 teams for a SANCTIONED OPEN EVENT on the west coast, and UGC had around double for a NON SANCTIONED EVENT in the Midwest (If I recall correctly).

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I'm referring to this:

 

 

Please link some proof.

 

----------------------------

 

In regard to Pro Player living locations - ESL and the HCS could care less where the players are coming from, that has no pull on where the events will be held.

 

As I mentioned, I typed it all out. I have no actual hard fact data numbers besides brackets from amateur teams. The new home of Halo is West Coast. East Vs West, amateur teams normally compete at a minimum of 25% more when the LAN in on the west coast. That is a minimum. Along with the huge influx of west coast/mid players, the hard to disqualify that the west is the new home of Halo but you all won't listen because because because Dr Pepper and Hot Pockets god damn it!

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