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Halo World Championship 2017 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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If I'm understanding this correctly, non-pro teams get the same amount of points as pro teams do based on their placings at these events. When every pro team get a 16k point headstart with hardly any events for AMs to realistically catch up that is insane. As an AM getting in the top 8 should reward thousands more points than the Pro teams. I'm talking like If an AM team actually wins a tourney they get like 6-8k points while a pro team would only get what they normally would now.

 

It would take consecutive top finishes for an AM team to catch up but it would be more fair than letting a bad team like PNDA to skate by on that initial 16k.

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I realize this isn't the right thread but I'm looking for someone who plays a lot of H5 with an elite controller to help me confirm something.  I believe I have honestly found a work-around to the heavy-aiming feeling outright.  The work-around could help 343 understand the issue and find where to fix it.  No, this does not have anything to do with the custom aiming curves.  If someone on here who has a decent 343 presence in the twitter-sphere, and has an elite controller, could message me I'd love to get the word out.  I already tweeted @ a 343 arena dev but my fresh twitter account with 1 tweet may not get a response and hasn't so far.

Talk to me fam.

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I'd like to point out how bad the brackets were at St. Louis and how that is effecting current seeding. We 3-0ed team randa in winners 4 of open bracket. As a result the seeds worked out in champ bracket that we played Luminosity and lost 3-1 and then lost 3-0 to ALG in losers. Team Randa got a fucking bye and then got 3-0ed 3-0ed twice by pros. So they place top 12 and we place top 16. How the hell can that happen?

@@PROVERB care to chime in on this?

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I don't know how/when tournaments are actually finalized, but I would like to bring an example of an event that is going on its 3rd year now in the Destiny community. Guardian Con / DCC is a charity based event held in Tampa for the past 3 years. I watch a lot of what goes on in that directory, and while it is different of course, the planning of the event each time now has occurred directly after the event ended. Granted there was a 2 week off period but it happens. The event happened last August, and by October, they already had announced a date for the next one. 

 

I don't understand what the hold up could be in announcing the Worlds location. This should have been locked in a long time ago. 

 

I don't even want to get started on the other incidents that have occurred already this year. 

 

I love you @@TheSimms and think you do a great deal for the community, please don't stop posting but there comes a certain point where we need to know what is going on and not just it has been relayed to others. 

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2000 points to earth root esportz

5000 points to whatever team crates is on

500 points to gryffindor

and while were at it 3500 points for my grandma

 

exciting worlds lineup we got

@@Infinity's grandma, top 1.

 

Narrowly beating out @@Saucey's second cousin, thrice removed in a thrilling double bo7.

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grammar error, fixed

 

Edit: to elaborate, it's natural for ESL to be subject to a bunch of meaningless flaming, because regardless if their mistakes are justifiable there will be a lot of people in the community who won't hold back abuse I know how much you love your job and the community.

 

But, I also read your posts and watch you in streams. You really don't enjoy the game. And yet you go above and beyond to tell us how hard your working and how big our future with ESL is, but quite literally the only one. The only ESL employee who seems to care at least.

 

I'm saying you shouldn't bother replying to posts like Crane's because not only is a complete waste of time - playing music to the deaf - but you deserve so much more and shouldn't stoop to the low level's of constantly trying to gratify a flippant forum. All we want is a well run esports scene, and somebody to publicly take responsibility for problems for once. That's not much to ask for, especially for a community that grew up on the best events of early esports.

Wait, hang on a second.

 

You and Crane just basically said the same thing.

 

Obviously, there was a lot of emotion behind Crane's post and saying they were purposely destroying Halo was out of line, but I saw a lot of truth in what he said. ESL as well as all parties involved in the HCS have fucked up repeatedly. So bad that we take out small victories and over-hype them just to make ourselves feel better. Obviously, Simms is not at fault, at the end of the day, he's just a community manager (no offense Rich, <3 you to death, this is just what my interpretation of what the job is. Correct me if I'm wrong).

 

We may be seeing increased viewership and higher attendance rates but the quality of what is shown and how it's presented have gone downhill. Added to ESL's extreme and horribly ignorant disregard for the integrity of their own league and seeing how they rabidly enjoy rewarding scum such as @@Cratos while screwing over other players and AMs. People have every right to be mad, they have since this whole HCS thing started.

 

Crane was wrong in saying that ESL is killing Halo intentionally.

 

But it's nearly impossible to objectively say they are putting a full effort into growing it. Intentional or not, they are doing a half-assed job of growing Halo in comparison to what is very realistically capable of being done.

 

TLDR;

 

ESL, please put your best foot forward when helping Halo.

 

And @@wow

 

high_horse.jpg

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Also Anyone who competed in the open bracket at St. Louis knows that there was one else side of the bracket with basically the best AM teams and the other side was nothing but randoms. Golden bracket was an understatement. This was a result of the randomly seeded online single elimination qualifier for St Louis. Who would have thought that a randomly seeded single elimination tournament does a shitty job of creating credible and accurate seeds?!?!

How did they even seed the AM teams into the champ bracket, did they just throw them in a randomizer and place them in the bracket? Seems that way because the way they were seeded made no sense.

 

Like, lets look at this.

 

From winners:

Inconceivable, 1st seed --> Champ bracket 11th seed.

Velvet Gaming, 2nd seed --> Champ Bracket 9th seed.

Earthroot gaming, 11th seed --> Champ bracket 12th seed.

SetToDestroyX, 13th seed --> Champ bracket 10th seed.

 

From losers:

Team Randa, 3rd seed --> Champ bracket 16th seed.

cE.Fs Starboys, 4th seed --> Champ bracket 14th seed.

Allegiance, 9th seed --> Champ bracket 13th seed.

Primal, 24th seed --> Champ bracket 15th seed.

 

nick-young-confused-face-300x256_nqlyaa.

 

http://p5s.challonge.com/ugc50kopen

http://p5s.challonge.com/UGC50kChamp

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How did they even seed the AM teams into the champ bracket, did they just throw them in a randomizer and place them in the bracket? Seems that way because the way they were seeded made no sense.

They seeded the Open bracket teams into Champ by map win %. Since Inconceivable dropped more maps than Velvet (because they actually played good teams) they were seeded lower. It's a ridiculous system, but that's how they did it.

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They seeded the Open bracket teams into Champ by map win %. Since Inconceivable dropped more maps than Velvet (because they actually played good teams) they were seeded lower. It's a ridiculous system, but that's how they did it.

That's idiotic, but ok. Makes no sense to use that when you had the teams play a seeding tournament.

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i feel like i need to clarify, i dont think esl is actively plotting to kill halo or fucking up intentionally or maliciously. but i do think that not as much effort is put into halo as csgo. i know csgo is growing money for esl, but halo could too if it were nurtured more.  we seem to be the black sheep of the esl family even though attendance and viewership numbers are going up. if we want to be the top of console esports we need

1) to have the community respected. listen to our concerns and interact with us. our input is passed along, but t feels like it never goes anywhere.

 

2) we need consistently good productions. this goes beyond lands too. the esl pro halo site is ridiculously out of date

 

http://pro.eslgaming.com/halo/proleague/

 

nothing has been updated since fall finals. we need some sort of coverage from our main competitive body.

 

3) we need timely action. nothing about world's has gone well so far from an organizational stand point, but unfortunately, none of these problems are particularly new. bad production is something we've had several times. the same with the lack of information and bad tournament structure. the cratos ordeal was new, but nothing was done about it except for an it's "in the rules." shit has to get done to avoid problems, such as hiring a production crew, planning venues and brackets and points structure at least a season in advance, timely action on rules ethics, and releasing the rule book 

 

we've dealt with poor planning, poor implementation, and poor communication for 2 years and nothing has gotten better. its chasing away fans. when a mod of beyond says he's not interested in halo because of the current state it's in, something is wrong.

 

again, i don't think esl is actually trying to kill off halo. but the work from behind way its being run is killing us

 

and @@TheSimms, i hope you know i have nothing but respect for you

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That's idiotic, but ok. Makes no sense to use that when you had the teams play a seeding tournament.

They could have done several things to prevent this issue.

 

1) complete the open bracket

2) had a double elim seeding tourney

 

They probably decided against both, in the interest of time, but the open bracket could have been finished in a single day of they weren't hell bent on airing a bunch of boring day 1 matches.

 

I just want to make sure you guys have it clear, since I'm seeing comments about "There's no way an Am team can pass a Pro team."

 

Those points are just for seeding Las Vegas and the Online Last Chance Qualifier.

 

All an Am team has to do is place top 6 at Las Vegas and they go to Worlds. Their points at the end of Las Vegas do not affect whether or not they attend Worlds. If they place outside of top 6 at Worlds, their points then determine their seed+bracket placement for the LCQ.

 

No Am teams will start in the Champ bracket at all at Las Vegas. The 8th seed will continue to be a Bye round, which means the 9th seed in Champ bracket will get a bye in Las Vegas yet again. (According to Proverb, this was direct from 343's HWC qualification rules.)

 

In order to go to Worlds from there, they have to win the LCQ.

 

 

 

 

 

All that said, this point system is still poorly constructed, nebulous bullshit and I would be embarrassed to have received money if I were the one who put together this qualification system for a major tournament+publisher.

I dont think that really needed clarification. The fact that AMs can't get seeded into the champ bracket diminishes their chances, and increases the chances of a teams meeting earlier than they should due to the champ bracket makeup having little to do with previous performance.

 

This just isn't how you set up a tournament if you actually want the best 6 teams to finish top 6.

 

Giving the 9th seed a bye is LOL stupid... if one team is gonna be guarunteed a top 12 finish, why would it be handed to the 9th seed? Especially when the seeds were awarded from an incomplete bracket- that was seeded by a single elimination tournament. There is no logic here.

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Yep. And this is why you do not give byes in a champ bracket. I could go on for days about all this but ultimately we have no say which is why I will stick to running unsanctioned events. 

 

that really makes me sad that the experience was that poor that you don't want to run hcs events again. its bad that ugc wasnt able to run it like yall did 3 months before

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Putting "k" after a number represents thousand fyi. 5000k=5 million, 5k=5 thousand.

Lol good catch, no idea why i put 5000K. Meant 5K.

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ESL wants Halo to do well in the same way you want to do well in the job you don't like. You do well enough that the paycheck (or in this case, the contract) still happens.

 

But the passion and care needed to help avoid the small mistakes and do a truly good job is not there.

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That is not the only problem lol but you are welcome to try lol also you were talking about how you knew what was happening at UGC but you were know where near the production area.   <3 you though :)

 

 

He doesn't have to be standing in the production area to know mistakes were being made over the course of three days. Maybe take a note from Millenial and use Championship Monday to get some extra time to fix those problems.

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