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Which game had worse gameplay at launch, Reach or The 4?

What had worse gameplay at launch, Reach or The 4?  

224 members have voted

  1. 1. Which game had worse gameplay AT LAUNCH?

    • Reach
      97
    • The 4
      131


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Where is hardy lebel now and why is he not employed at 343? He essentially invented halo multiplayer.

He does webinars, writes books, appears on indi podcasts. He was supposed to appear on the next episode of my level design series on YouTube but I think he got busy.

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I appreciate both games for at least attempting to leave behind the Battle Rifle as the utility weapon of choice.  It's just a shame they went back on their progress in Halo 4 when they updated it.   Edit: I should clarify, that the return of single shot weapons to prominence came with a bunch of other baggage which was much worse.

 

Not sure why you downvoted, Cooper. Burst weapons as utility is less skillful. Just sweep the head after shields are down. Maybe you did before he clarified.

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He does webinars, writes books, appears on indi podcasts. He was supposed to appear on the next episode of my level design series on YouTube but I think he got busy.

 

Yeah and he's spoken privately with many members of this community. He seems to care but then disappears from time to time. Not sure if he gets sidetracked by projects.

 

I wish he would make an account and post here. Would be amazing to see some of his thoughts on the design of every Halo game. Would be more amazing if 343 actually hired him as a consultant and actually listened to him though.

 

I'm not sure why he hasn't done much work in the past decade; you'd think a resume listing lead designer of the original game of one of the most revolutionary and popular console shooter series of all time (if not THE most revolutionary), would get you in somewhere.

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Not sure why you downvoted, Cooper. Burst weapons as utility is less skillful. Just sweep the head after shields are down. Maybe you did before he clarified.

Appreciating anything about Reach or H4 triggers me lol.

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Are you kidding me? Reach was way better than 4. I played almost as much Reach as I did Halo 3 and stuck it out for a long time. 

 

I only played Halo 4 on 1-2 occasions but that game was such a piece of shit I think it might even be worse than Halo 5.

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Halo 4 is the worst video game experience of my life. MCC and Halo 5 aren't too far behind it.

 

I have over 700,000 kills on Reach, mostly from playing TU BTB. It's not that Reach is a great Halo game, but it's due to 343's inability to make a decent Halo game.

 

Some great things about Reach though are it's UI, vehicle physics and mechanics, art style/graphics, sound, and weapon sandbox. Overall, the TU version of Reach is much better than Halo 4 and Halo 5.

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I can't say "the 4" was any less a Halo game that Reach. Both games shit all over the formula- Reach had poor gunplay, which is the biggest crime possible in a shooter.

 

I think I have to say Reach was the worst. It actually turned me completely off Halo. H4 brought me back for a few weeks atleast. H4 4 did go full idiot with the Lack of skill based MP and kill streaks though- I was so confused playing my first few matches.

 

H5 shits on both of those games from a MP perspective

 

Edit: I forgot about no descoping. That shit was so dumb. Nearly makes H4 as bad as reach. Not quite though

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OD's made H4 unplayable, but Reach was simply awful.

 

I'd give the edge to Reach.

 

Also, Halo 4 Pro settings was more fun then I ever had playing any version of Reach.  That game was just trash.

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OD's made H4 unplayable, but Reach was simply awful.

 

I'd give the edge to Reach.

 

Also, Halo 4 Pro settings was more fun then I ever had playing any version of Reach.  That game was just trash.

 

More than v7?  Because that's some of my favorite Halo I've ever played.

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More than v7?  Because that's some of my favorite Halo I've ever played.

I didn't find V7 much more enjoyable than vanilla.

 

H4 Doubles Pro - that is close to the most fun I've had on Halo.

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Reach had AAs and bloom

 

4 had personal ordnance, global ordnance, AAs, h4 beam, boltshot off spawn, quick weapon despawn, personalized loadouts, the promethean weapon set, the saw, rail and sticky were very inconsistent online, the mantis, all vehicles were shit etc etc

 

..reach wins

 

reach had countdown, zealot, boardwalk, powerhouse, reflection and swordbase

 

4 had haven, adrift, solace, abandon and complex

 

this may be controversial, but i would rather have a shit game loaded with AAs on swordbase, than to play on either fucking solace, adrift or complex, abandon was also shit and haven < zealot and countdown

 

..reach wins

 

reach had snipers, swat, BTB, slayer, multi-team, infection, grifball, action sack, mlg, rumble pit, team objective and doubles, all before 2011 (except for MLG i believe), within the first 3 months, and smoothed out from what they were initially.

 

4 we had to wait for snipers, competitive game-mode and doubles, slayer and BTB were infinity slayer and BTB, h4 swat was shit, so was infection actually to be honest even with updates doubles was the only fun thing for me in this game, all the other playlists offered fuck all else.

 

..so yet again reach wins

 

in my opinion reach had a shit direction with an ok result, h4 had an even worse direction and something that didn't look, feel or play like a halo game

reach just had better and more halo-like maps, weapons, vehicles, art-style, audio design, playlists and mechanics 

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H4 was an extremely noobified game with no descoping, auto-aim that almost rivaled cod, and nooby ordinance drops and load out choices. Nevertheless, I could find some enjoyment out of stomping terrible players because, at a basic level, the mechanics made some sense.

 

Default Reach was a game that left me scratching my head after most fights. I'd spam my dmr across the map and get a 5 shot and then try the exact same angle again and have 3 of my shots hit. I'd shoot a guy twice who was sprinting at me and then we'd both melee each other and we'd have the same health.

 

Default Zealot was arguably the worst map in Halo history with the unbreakable space setup.

Default Sanc consistently had screen lag when looking through scope from one snipe hut to the other.

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Reach was bad until the TU and ZBNS, but at least it still followed the basic Halo game flow that H2 and 3 built with regards to power weapons, teamshooting etc. Heck, even the AA loadouts got fairly predictable since for any serious player Sprint and Jetpack were leagues above the others. It got really dumb, but at least it wasn't personal ordnance and random respawn timers or no descope levels of infuriating.

 

Also I have neither forgotten nor forgiven exchanging the Grenade Launcher for the Sticky Detonator.

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Also I have neither forgotten nor forgiven exchanging the Grenade Launcher for the Sticky Detonator.

I will never understand this. For the first in a decade Halo got a new and skillful weapon and the first thing 343 does is replace it with an inconsistent C4-clone weapon and then never speak of it again.

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I can't say "the 4" was any less a Halo game that Reach. Both games shit all over the formula- Reach had poor gunplay, which is the biggest crime possible in a shooter.

 

I think I have to say Reach was the worst. It actually turned me completely off Halo. H4 brought me back for a few weeks atleast. H4 4 did go full idiot with the Lack of skill based MP and kill streaks though- I was so confused playing my first few matches.

 

H5 shits on both of those games from a MP perspective

 

Edit: I forgot about no descoping. That shit was so dumb. Nearly makes H4 as bad as reach. Not quite though

woops, mobile neg

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I just couldn't deal with the way fights felt in Reach.  Everything felt so clunky in Vanilla.  It's hard to overstate how horrible it was to not have stopping power against sprint, AND have no bleedthrough on the melee.  And on top of that awful combination, Reach also had this weird and clunky knockback when you were meleed, so you couldn't even trade melee's consistently.  So the result would be I see a guy and get 2 or three shots into him, but the moment he saw me he made up his mind that he was going to sprint at me and punch.  As soon as he makes that decision, the BEST I can do is trade.  That is bullshit, and it ruined the game for me.

 

At least in Halo 4, say what you will about the ordinance drops and the loadouts, I hated them too, but on a fight to fight basis, H4 gunfights felt how a Halo gun battle should feel.  Yes of course you'd have your corner camping boltshot promethean vision guy, but I didn't have to worry about seeing a guy at midclose and wondering if he's gonna try to sprint at me and trade instead of having a gunfight.  At least in H4 you could slow his sprint and if you were up shots then you won the melee battle.

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I just couldn't deal with the way fights felt in Reach.  Everything felt so clunky in Vanilla.  It's hard to overstate how horrible it was to not have stopping power against sprint, AND have no bleedthrough on the melee.  And on top of that awful combination, Reach also had this weird and clunky knockback when you were meleed, so you couldn't even trade melee's consistently.  So the result would be I see a guy and get 2 or three shots into him, but the moment he saw me he made up his mind that he was going to sprint at me and punch.  As soon as he makes that decision, the BEST I can do is trade.  That is bullshit, and it ruined the game for me.

 

At least in Halo 4, say what you will about the ordinance drops and the loadouts, I hated them too, but on a fight to fight basis, H4 gunfights felt how a Halo gun battle should feel.  Yes of course you'd have your corner camping boltshot promethean vision guy, but I didn't have to worry about seeing a guy at midclose and wondering if he's gonna try to sprint at me and trade instead of having a gunfight.  At least in H4 you could slow his sprint and if you were up shots then you won the melee battle.

"Clunky" is the perfect word. The poorly implemented bloom and lack of melee bleed-through made the game have no sense of "flow". At least Halo 4 had some consistency to the basic mechanics (not including ordinance) even if it was horribly dumbed down.

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This isn't really relevant to how Reach played, but the assist system was emblematic of the head scratching design choices.

 

If I'm not mistaken, you had to do 60% damage to get an assist. So, in Bungie's mind, doing half of the work or even slightly over half wasn't enough to justify an assist. Stuff like that makes me feel like the whole development team was on some crazy drugs when they made the game.

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Having played both Reach and H4 quite extensively I have to say my least favourite experience by far was in reach.

 

Reach restricted to me to a singular playlist which was BTB. I hated 4v4 due to the shooting mechanics as well as terrible maps, and stupidly overpowered abilities. I really think people are forgetting just how abysmal this game was at launch and how little effort was put in by the developers to fix it. Halo reach was a failure to make a functional FPS game, it felt so weird and clunky in everything apart from bTB and Invasion. It may have been a better halo experience (putting all things into consideration but it was a worse FPS experience which is why I cannot forgive it)

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Having played both Reach and H4 quite extensively I have to say my least favourite experience by far was in reach.

 

Reach restricted to me to a singular playlist which was BTB. I hated 4v4 due to the shooting mechanics as well as terrible maps, and stupidly overpowered abilities. I really think people are forgetting just how abysmal this game was at launch and how little effort was put in by the developers to fix it. Halo reach was a failure to make a functional FPS game, it felt so weird and clunky in everything apart from bTB and Invasion. It may have been a better halo experience (putting all things into consideration but it was a worse FPS experience which is why I cannot forgive it)

Some people have short memory others don't want to admit that a 343 game is better than Bungie game.

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In H4 you died on the reg because of some bullshit, but that is IMO more tolerable than constantly having your kills denied because of some BS like sprint, armor lock or bloom.

 

The vanilla Reach DMR has an average kill time at least 150-200% times that of the other Halos' starting weapon (lets disregard AR and SMG starts) Shit like that infuriates me way more than getting beamrifle-noscoped or boltshotted across the map

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In H4 you died on the reg because of some bullshit, but that is IMO more tolerable than constantly having your kills denied because of some BS like sprint, armor lock or bloom.

 

The vanilla Reach DMR has an average kill time at least 150-200% times that of the other Halos' starting weapon (lets disregard AR and SMG starts) Shit like that infuriates me way more than getting beamrifle-noscoped or boltshotted across the map

I dunno why you'd disregard smg and ar starts. Halo 2 vanilla was even worse.

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I dunno why you'd disregard smg and ar starts. Halo 2 vanilla was even worse.

 

Because it was such a blatant mistake that even Bungie admitted it was a bad idea.

 

343i in the infinite wisdom obviously went right back to SMG starts in MCC

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