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HCS Pro League Summer 2016 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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but if that last place team is still better than the best AM team, doing this would not have the best 8 teams in the pro-league.  If the best AM team is better than the worst pro-league team at the end of the season, they will earn their spot in the league.  I think the way it works now is good.

A fair point, but then that last place team will get their place back at the end of the next season (if they really are that much better) - it's a dilemma I'm glad I don't have to make a decision on!

 

EDIT: Just to clarify, I have absolutely no issue with the current format, just considering other possible ideas that may cause a bit more shake up

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An 8 team pro league and an anticlimactic open circuit like we have now is a sure fire way to slowly kill the eSport going forward.

 

There's definitely room for 2 more teams at least.

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An 8 team pro league and an anticlimactic open circuit like we have now is a sure fire way to slowly kill the eSport going forward.

 

There's definitely room for 2 more teams at least.

Open LANs, T2, Observer mode and better marketing.

 

This is how the HCS can be improved.

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An 8 team pro league and an anticlimactic open circuit like we have now is a sure fire way to slowly kill the eSport going forward.

 

There's definitely room for 2 more teams at least.

So you think the way to make the open circuit more attractive is to remove its top teams and noteable players, interesting ......

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Optic got knocked into the losers bracket of the LQC, WITH Naded on the team...By Elevate if I remember correctly. To suggest that there will definately be fewer competitive games is just nonsense. AMs have been working their asses off since then.

 

Regarding the League Start times, they could easily start an hour early, or spread matches more throughout the week.

 

These AM teams and players have gotten better since the LQCs. I remember being happy when Optic qualified for the league. But they just don't seem to have the drive. Had Elevate made it in instead, and got to scrim with Pros every night, I think the league would have been more interesting.

No, Optic went to loser cuz they lost to Liquid, they beat Elevate two times in that tourney, one in the group stage and then again in losers finals.
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A fair point, but then that last place team will get their place back at the end of the next season (if they really are that much better) - it's a dilemma I'm glad I don't have to make a decision on!

 

Yeah, i see the other side too.  right now the top AM teams are working harder than the bottom Pro teams.  Do they deserve a spot for working hard?  are they really that good if they are grinding and practicing significantly more than the bottom pro league teams but still can't beat them in a Bo7?  As much as i want to reward AMs for showing pro-league teams what real work ethic looks like, I also dont want to be patronizing to the league.  

 

We are definitely in a "wait and see" period.  we have to wait for the relegation matches to shake out and see how the teams perform in season 2.

lots of questions, not a lot of answers but i can'twait to see what happens!

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Open LANs, T2, Observer mode and better marketing.

 

This is how the HCS can be improved.

This This This 

 

Cannot agree more:

  • Commentating: in the NA pro league has been one of the largest deterrents in recent memory to watching competitive halo. We need to improve here drastically, T2 and Elamite were fantastic, keep them PLEASE. The cooldown times is another offence, have an analyst desk, with people who know the teams in and out and are up to date with the current meta, the casters should know more not less than the viewers. Get rid of these stupid montages and actually provide viewers with insights into what just transpired and why x team was able to secure the victory. If the game was a blowout I want an in-depth explanation as to what went wrong for the other team. We keep hearing from pro's that stats don't tell the whole story, but it is impossible for the viewer to fully understand atm, so we need assistance bridging this gap.
  • Marketing: Pro's need to start tweeting out during games, informing followers of the series score, the score of each game and constantly tweeting out the stream, they are doing a lackluster job right now in comparison to the cod pro's. 343 needs to create banners and alerts informing everyone playing halo 5 of what game is being streamed, with an option to take the player directly to the twitch channel.  Also, they (343/ESL) themselves need to promote the individual matches more just like the players.
  • Open Lan's need to be used in conjunction to the pro league, in order to break the monotony of the pro league, let's see how U4X stacks up on LAN, let's see if Liquid improves on LAN. It would also allow the challenger league teams and players the opportunity to show their skill and that they deserve to be in the league,it will create more storylines.
  • And of course improve the horrible observer mode.
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So you think the way to make the open circuit more attractive is to remove its top teams and noteable players, interesting ......

How about we make it an actual circuit and not run pointless online cups (AND WE HAD A DC FORFEIT DUE TO ONLINE ISSUES) where, in the end, only the last tournament mattered anyways? That's a start to make the open circuit more attractive.

 

How about we use REQ funding to increase the prize pools of the cups?

 

How about we use commnunity grass-roots orgs to run tournaments like EGL, UGC, etc for Open LANS for AM teams to go and compete in for HCS points?

 

I can go on and on brother. The problem is not removing the top 2 teams.

 

Denial and a couple other teams can take games from pro teams. You're always going to have the bottom of the standings being the poorest teams, it doesn't mean those teams don't rake in fans or bring in sponsors/money. 

 

TSM and 100T are on the bottom of the CWL standings. 

 

More teams = more matches = more Halo.

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Especially when your endurance levels are so low and your recovery times are so high. By jesus it would take it would take some man to ride a sheep from wales all the way to the ESL studios. 

 

Plus I believe the Welsh typically prefer riding their sheep in the comfort of their own bedrooms 

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First off, completely different elevate team. They have definitely downgraded since the LCQ. Second, you're saying they could compete with optic, the second worst team in the league. You can't legitimately think they have a chance at beating any teams in the top 6.

 

Also, if the top 6 teams thought Denial and elevate were worth scrimming, they would. I've asked snakebite in his chat and he said there's just no real benefit from scrimming them.

You are misunderstanding what I'm saying.

 

The players at the top of the AM circuit have displayed more drive than the teams at the bottom of the pro league circuit.

 

What I'm saying is I believe that the elevate and denial squads are more dedicated to winning than Optic and Liquid have been. Had the ball bounced differently at LQC, and these AM teams actually made it in, been I feel they would have spent the season doing what it takes to get better as a team, so that they could actually compete with the rest of the league.

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First off, completely different elevate team. They have definitely downgraded since the LCQ. Second, you're saying they could compete with optic, the second worst team in the league. You can't legitimately think they have a chance at beating any teams in the top 6.

 

Also, if the top 6 teams thought Denial and elevate were worth scrimming, they would. I've asked snakebite in his chat and he said there's just no real benefit from scrimming them.

It makes sense that the top team in the world sees no benefit in scrimming an AM team.

 

However,

 

E6 Scrimmed AMs plenty, when they couldn't even get a pro scrim, and they have secured their spot in the Finals (and beat CLG).

 

No, Optic went to loser cuz they lost to Liquid, they beat Elevate two times in that tourney, one in the group stage and then again in losers finals.

Thanks for the correction.

 

Optic narrowly squeezed by Elevate in group play (4-3), then optic got obliterated by Liquid (0-4)

Elevate played Liquid and lost (2-4) the fell to optic (2-4)

And the crowd went wild

 

Elevate seems to be the go to place for pro's who want to make it into pro league, as the just org keeps getting poached by pro teams...

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If we did have Moyceyy's beloved Open LANs I feel that would give AMs more incentive to practice and get better with a dedicated squad. More practice the AM's put in = better AM squads who can eventually compete with Pro squads. 

I also believe that adding in Assault would improve the game. Currently watching the same 3 gametypes can get stale. The staleness was intensified when watching RNG and EG play Fathom Flag 3 times in a row because of OT (which needs to be changed to sudden cap in OT). Having Assault on maps we do not see a ton like Stasis or maps not in pro league like Torque would be great. 

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Ok if Optic and or Liquid get relegated, do you think the orgs would stay with their teams in challenger league, try to grab a squad in pro league, or just leave Halo?

 

 

I think it would be really bad if we lose Team Liquid or Optic, both are big orgs and bring viewers, as well as be good to their players.

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If AM teams would stay together for more than 5 minutes they could probably beat optic and liquid.

 

Grinding doesn't mean as much when you never have the same team of 4.

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We have just launched the ASTRO Spartans FFA Tournament for tomorrow at 6pm EST, free entry as always!

 

 

SIGN UP NOW!

I want to play in these tournaments soooo bad. Sucks I work every day until 4pm pacific. :(
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I want to play in these tournaments soooo bad. Sucks I work every day until 4pm pacific. :(

I work til 5 EST, anyone with grown up 8/9-4/5 jobs are pretty much SOL. I have an hour commute home on a good day.

 

That said, these things go late so I couldn't see it starting any later.

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I work til 5 EST, anyone with grown up 8/9-4/5 jobs are pretty much SOL. I have an hour commute home on a good day.

 

That said, these things go late so I couldn't see it starting any later.

Can't please us all, but I completely understand. And I am still very thankful for these free tournaments! I still watch them all, even though I can't compete
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Can we stop having tournaments of importance being held online in 2016?

 

So many things about the HCS are half-baked, man.

 

So frustrating.

People want to "keep Competitive Halo alive". What they don't realize or care about is that Halo with ARs, radar, and online tournaments deciding things is "Competitive Halo" in name only.
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People want to "keep Competitive Halo alive". What they don't realize or care about is that Halo with ARs, radar, and online tournaments deciding things is "Competitive Halo" in name only.

I think autos are a bigger problem than radar. If I could get rid of 1 I would get rid of all autos first, but in a dream world both would go.

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I also believe that adding in Assault would improve the game. Currently watching the same 3 gametypes can get stale. The staleness was intensified when watching RNG and EG play Fathom Flag 3 times in a row because of OT (which needs to be changed to sudden cap in OT). 

 

The spawns are still fucked.  Honestly changing the way the players are facing when they spawn in the middle of the map would make this better, as stupid as that sounds.  Assault is still ending in way too many ties too despite the changes they made.  It is better than it was, but still not "good".  

 

And yes for the love of god, 3 min. OT is fine for MM but it should still be sudden death. but for Pro-League it needs to be unlimited time and sudden death.

 

I think autos are a bigger problem than radar. If I could get rid of 1 I would get rid of all autos first, but in a dream world both would go.

 

I think radar is the biggest problem right now (Edit: and would reduce reliance on auto's if removed), but thats like arguing over who's shit smells worse.  Its all still shit.

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People want to "keep Competitive Halo alive". What they don't realize or care about is that Halo with ARs, radar, and online tournaments deciding things is "Competitive Halo" in name only.

 

I mean this in the most respectful way possible @@Ugug - do you play anymore? Did you watch the 3-2 NV v CLG?  

 

I understand your points and that you don't like these elements.  I see a you make a ton of posts about them, and I agree with some of it.  It just seems like a lot of effort to keep the torches and pitchforks out at this point. We have the first Pro league (flaws and all) the game itself is fun, and while it will never be like the MLG halo 2/3 days, I'm happy that we're moving in the right direction.

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I mean this in the most respectful way possible @@Ugug - do you play anymore? Did you watch the 3-2 NV v CLG?

 

I understand your points and that you don't like these elements. I see a you make a ton of posts about them, and I agree with some of it. It just seems like a lot of effort to keep the torches and pitchforks out at this point. We have the first Pro league (flaws and all) the game itself is fun, and while it will never be like the MLG halo 2/3 days, I'm happy that we're moving in the right direction.

Yeah, I play sometimes. I didn't watch the nv vs clg series, though. my posts may not always show this, but I actually believe that halo 5 can be a fun game and does many things well. It's just hard to see it not reach its potential because of glaring flaws that could easily be changed
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